Is Cassius death curse in effect already?

[I_hate_lotr]

Starting to think it's in effect already. Everyone who is close to him has gotten hurt or killed. Michael is seriously injured. Molly became the winter lady. Murphy has died. Thomas is locked up. Every single person has been hurt or killed or pushed away since that curse has been laid on him.
Which leads to this scary thought, what happens if Maggie is hurt or killed?

[forumghost]

I mean on the one hand we have a WoJ saying that Harry mostly got out from under that the first time he died, on the other hand iirc we have a different WoJ saying he's still suffering because of the effects of the curse.

Personally I think that if Snake boy didn't have the Juice to kill Dresden in the Museum, it makes little sense that he'd have enough juice to Ice everyone Harry gets close to years later, but who can say.

[Mira]

  However it wasn't much of a curse.  As Malcolm pointed out to Harry in his dream," everyone dies alone."  Also both Molly and Michael are very much alive, so is Thomas last we checked.

[LostInTime]

Maggie and Bonnie are both still alive. Still uncertain if the curse attached itself to Harry's penis. Susan and Murphy are both dead. Luccio and Elaine still seem to be alive. Lara is an unknown quantity for now.

[Mira]

Maggie and Bonnie are both still alive. Still uncertain if the curse attached itself to Harry's penis. Susan and Murphy are both dead. Luccio and Elaine still seem to be alive. Lara is an unknown quantity for now.

And there are a whole lot of other people in Harry's circle.  I have to run down the exact quote, I think it is in Dead Beat.  It is when Harry dreams or has a vision of meeting up with his Dad by a camp fire.  That's when Malcolm told him not to be overly alarmed by that curse, because everyone walks though death's door alone.

Here is the quote I was looking for from Dead Beat page 420 paper back version

"Harry." my dad said, and his voice was very gentle, "can I tell you something?"
"Sure."
He walked around the grave and put his hand on my shoulder.
"Son.  Everyone does alone.  That's what it is.  It's a door.  It's one
person wide.  When you go through it, you do it alone."  His fingers
squeezed me tight.  "But it doesn't mean you've got to be alone before you go
through the door.  And believe me, you aren't alone on the other side."

So what I think Malcolm was trying to tell Harry, as long as he has friends, he won't be alone as he walks through life.  That is true unless Harry succeeds in alienating everyone he knows.  And when he does walk through that door alone, there are a lot of loved ones waiting for him on the other side. 

[Conspiracy Theorist]

You forget Harry has plot armour is a Starborn and appears to shrug off all forms of predestination - entropy curses, death curses, prophecy all have tried and failed. He is the ultimate champion of free will which means he is the White God’s chosen pain in the ass.

It’s telling that the Gatekeeper has trouble telling futures for Harry, the scene where he defies the White Council on Demonreach leaves the Gatekeeper confused that it’s too early in his timeline, and that he can’t win until Harry does something so incredibly stupid which is the epitome of free will in deciding to bind Demonreach.

[Mira]

You forget Harry has plot armour is a Starborn and appears to shrug off all forms of predestination - entropy curses, death curses, prophecy all have tried and failed. He is the ultimate champion of free will which means he is the White God’s chosen pain in the ass.

It’s telling that the Gatekeeper has trouble telling futures for Harry, the scene where he defies the White Council on Demonreach leaves the Gatekeeper confused that it’s too early in his timeline, and that he can’t win until Harry does something so incredibly stupid which is the epitome of free will in deciding to bind Demonreach.

A couple of things, being star born or not, predestined or not, what Harry's father told him still holds true.  If we die, any of us, we pass through that door alone.

Rashid had no problem seeing his future in Turn Coat, he gave him the odds of surviving against the Senior Council as low off the island, and a lot higher on the island and especially when he realized what Harry did.  I think there are rules that go along with having the eye that Rashid has.  I think it is the eye of the Three Fates, and rule number one is you cannot go around telling anyone what their future is going to be, because there are consequences for doing that, serious ones.

[Ed0517]

Starting to think it's in effect already. Everyone who is close to him has gotten hurt or killed. Michael is seriously injured. Molly became the winter lady. Murphy has died. Thomas is locked up. Every single person has been hurt or killed or pushed away since that curse has been laid on him.
Which leads to this scary thought, what happens if Maggie is hurt or killed?

He thought Elaine was dead. His mother was killed, possibly his father, if you listen to Chauncey. Susan got infected by the Reds. Being Harry's buddy has always been an extremely hazardous hobby.

Here's one, though - could the curse HELP Harry? Picture Harry and Maggie walking down a street in Chicago, they just went to Navy Pier or something. Some guy sees someone he hates walk by, decides to shoot him (it IS Chicago), whips out a gun and misses. Bullet goes downrange, hits Innocent Bystander Harry in the head. But Maggie is with him. Maybe Mouse (Mouse is not an ordinary dog). Does he survive? Does it make the bullet miss? Does he lie comatose, or in agony like the guy that got shot in front of Kumori that she cast on?

He was alone on the boat when Kincaid shot him, and I think the likes 0f Ethniu blow away the curse. Maybe even massive physical damage overpowers the curse - hit by bullet, linger. Hit by tank main gun, yeah, magic overruled. 

But could the curse help? Maybe it would help him survive. Preschism, maybe his friends could sit with him until Injun Joe came to start his healing. Now, they may pull Maggie away at the hospital and he dies on the table.

[Mira]

  Again, is it a real curse?  We know what Malcolm told him... When he was mostly dead, he fell from the boat into Mab's waiting arms.. Yeah, he heard in his mind Cassius's death curse, but he was only mostly dead, Mab was there so even if he was all dead, he didn't die alone.  If it means that all his friends and family die first, well, if Harry is the military leader of the BAT, that stuff happens...

One more thought, was Cassius even a wizard?  I think not, so there was no juice behind his curse other than to make Harry feel bad.

[Ed0517]

  Again, is it a real curse?  We know what Malcolm told him... When he was mostly dead, he fell from the boat into Mab's waiting arms.. Yeah, he heard in his mind Cassius's death curse, but he was only mostly dead, Mab was there so even if he was all dead, he didn't die alone.  If it means that all his friends and family die first, well, if Harry is the military leader of the BAT, that stuff happens...

One more thought, was Cassius even a wizard?  I think not, so there was no juice behind his curse other than to make Harry feel bad.

I think Cassius was a wizard, but a minor one. Harry is gaining in strength all the time, even if it is still there it may get shed in time. The same way Cowl was contemptuous of Harry's death curse, and Kumori told Harry he has shaken off worse. 

[Mira]

I think Cassius was a wizard, but a minor one. Harry is gaining in strength all the time, even if it is still there it may get shed in time. The same way Cowl was contemptuous of Harry's death curse, and Kumori told Harry he has shaken off worse.

I don't think so,  think Namshiel was the only one.  Since Cowl never killed Harry, he never actually received it, easy to laugh off a threat.  But Harry was a lot younger then, he has gained in more ways that one, including deciding on the kind of death curse he'd throw and take into consideration who is killing him.  Not unlike his mother, she didn't just throw a death curse for the sake of it, she considered who would kill her and how best to get to him... And she succeeded..  I don't think Cowl would blow off a death curse from Harry now.

[Ed0517]

I don't think so,  think Namshiel was the only one.  Since Cowl never killed Harry, he never actually received it, easy to laugh off a threat.  But Harry was a lot younger then, he has gained in more ways that one, including deciding on the kind of death curse he'd throw and take into consideration who is killing him.  Not unlike his mother, she didn't just throw a death curse for the sake of it, she considered who would kill her and how best to get to him... And she succeeded..  I don't think Cowl would blow off a death curse from Harry now.

Cassius is the host. Saluriel is the Denarian (the usual -el ending). Even without the coin Harry sees energy around him as he releases the curse. I think Cassius may have been a minor practitioner pre-coin. And I think ALL the Denarians have some ability, if not as much as Namshiel. Remember Ascher seemed AWFULLY good - I think Harry said Senior Council level, and she only had Lasciel.

[Second Aristh]

Cassius is the host. Saluriel is the Denarian (the usual -el ending). Even without the coin Harry sees energy around him as he releases the curse. I think Cassius may have been a minor practitioner pre-coin. And I think ALL the Denarians have some ability, if not as much as Namshiel. Remember Ascher seemed AWFULLY good - I think Harry said Senior Council level, and she only had Lasciel.

Ascher was better than Harry with fire, but only with fire.  She wasn't senior council level, not a wide enough pool of talent.

[Conspiracy Theorist]

I always saw Cassius as pretty much at the bottom of the White Council of his time, a Wizard who just only qualified for training and served a long, long, long apprenticeship. Such things make a man bitter and open to suggestion from someone who can offer a power up.

It is notable that Nick in seeking Harry sought out a powerhouse who served a short apprenticeship, He was clearly fed up with Cassius and wasn’t going to repeat that mistake. Instead he made a much worse mistake.

[Mira]

 Talent maybe at the OP level, but they'd never make wizard, sure they got some juice from the coin, but the only real magical bad ass in the bunch was Namshiel.  Ascher could have been a wizard but she went warlock instead due to making some bad choices early on.  Thus like Molly she was on the run depending on her half turned friends, when Harry did in the Red Court, most of them died because the mortal halves of them were very old. That made her bitter, take up the coin, and Lasciel powered up her fire magic more than it was.