Repetitions (or what's up with dresden's shirt... and buttters) BG spoilers

[LaraBeck]

Hello.. Not my first time posting here, I used to be around with a different name a long long long time ago (years), but I lost all my passwords and accounts and stuff.. So anyway, hello all!

So.. This might be a silly thing, and maybe it's just a error in continuity, but it kinda bugs me, a lot tbh.. I noticed a couple of things in my second reading..

1. What's up with Harry's shirt?

Because when he gets to change out of the suit to the stuff Molly brings him before the battle starts, he says:

“It had my stuff in it, from the apartment. A pair of jeans, a T-shirt, and my ensorcelled leather duster. ”

The usual Harry ensamble. Nothin unusual there.

And then in the Murphy-gets-shot scene:

“I ripped the duster off, tore my shirt in my haste to get it off over my head, wrapped it into a pad, and put pressure on the gaping wound... There was so much blood. It soaked my shirt through.”

But then, when Harry gets hurt much later in the battle, we have:

“Oh boy,” Butters breathed. He crouched over me and ripped my shirt open.”

He's wearing a shirt again... Did he put on the shirt again all soaked in Murphy's blood? That'd be too weird... And it's never mentioned that he gets a new one (doesn't seem like there's even time during the battle right). I actually did a word search in the epub version, and didn't find any references to that.

Again, maybe it's just a error in continuity, and I don't have any crazy theories about it, it just bugs me, and I wanted to know if somebody else noticed, LOL. (I do admit I would think it awesome if I just stumbled upon something that later would become meaningful in the books).


2. And the second thing, this line from Butters, when he's with Harry defending Mab:

“The Queen of Air and Darkness stared up at me with wide, glassy, grass green eyes.
Three feet of bloodied cold iron stood clear from the center of her torn, spraying throat...
...“He reached my side, threw himself down behind the dead unicorn, and took one look at Mab.
“Jesus,” he blurted. “Again?”
“Shut up and get it out of her neck,” I said.”

I just find Butter's attitude kinda weird here. I know it's the heat of the battle and all that, but it sounded very insensitive to say something like that to Harry after what happened with Murphy. And yeah, I mean, yes "again" it's true. Maybe it just was for some humor, but it just seems odd somehow.

Maybe it's just me being too into details, but those two things that I pointed out here really bug me, as if I'm missing something.

Anyway, just wanted to share my crazyness. LOL.

[Dina]

Hi Lara! Welcome back (do you remember your previous username?)

I will begin with 2 because it's easier. Yes, I thought the same! I mean, it's like what we all say "ooof, Harry has sex with a woman that woman dies (or well, you know, is thralled). It's too much", but the characters in universe shouldn't be so callous. Specially the super good guys.

About 1, well, I had not realized that, cool. At first, it could seem that Harry had cut a piece of its shirt to use in Murph and then Butters had ripped the rest but Harry mentions get it off over his head. Well, I am rereading BG (still not at any of those parts) but I will try to pay attention to that.

[KurtinStGeorge]

This one sounds like a continuity error to me, but there are a number of instances in many of the novels of discrepancies that I ascribe to the story being told across multiple Dresden universes.  The story is happening with all the major events playing out the same way within each universe, but with minor changes in past events changing things very slightly here and there.

So in Peace Talks Harry says the wooden skull Bonea resides in was made for her, when in fact it was originally made for Bob.  The Brighter Future Society changes names to Better Future Society and then back again.  In at least one of the worlds with a Better Future Society, Harry says he had never been to Marcone’s castle in the flesh before Peace Talks, but he had gone there in Skin Game.  This was probably because in a different Dresdenverse the meeting between Marcone and Mab that took place in Skin Game occurred at a different Marcone property or possibly at Mac’s or even Arctis Tor.  It doesn’t matter where that meeting took place, as long as it wasn’t at the castle and it was a place that Harry could discover and go to.

From other books, in at least one parallel world, Mort Lindquist has purchased, and lives in a home with a particular architectural style, while in another parallel universe Mort lives in a different neighborhood in a home with a different architecture style.  In either universe Harry knows Mort’s address and their interactions with one another are identical or nearly so.  In one parallel universe the Churchmice stole the Shroud of Turin for John Marcone, but Nicodemus and company stole the shroud and murdered two members of the Churchmice before Marcone could take delivery.  In another parallel universe the Churchmice were contracted by Nicodemus to steal the Shroud of Turin, but Marcone offered them more money so they headed to Chicago and Nicodemus murdered two of them in return.

About Butters reaction to seeing Mab's wound.  I ascribed it to shock.  Remember Butters prefers working with dead bodies than dealing with injured or sick ones.  Plus, I've seen people laugh in what seem totally inappropriate ways after witnessing a violent incident in real life, probably out of shock or disbelief in what they had just witnessed.  I think it was kind of like a safety valve to protect them from completely going to pieces.


 

[Dina]

About Butters reaction to seeing Mab's wound.  I ascribed it to shock.  Remember Butters prefers working with dead bodies than dealing with injured or sick ones.  Plus, I've seen people laugh in what seem totally inappropriate ways after witnessing a violent incident in real life, probably out of shock or disbelief in what they had just witnessed.  I think it was kind of like a safety valve to protect them from completely going to pieces.

I agree about that happening IRL, but it is a little weird in a book character. It's sort of when in a book (or TV) someone sneezes or coughs. You know it means something. Conjuritis, poison, cancer, TB, Ebola. No one sneezes or coughs by accident.

[The_Sibelis]

#2 would be Raidem's old Murphy is Mab theory lol. It does have a direct parallel there...
Other repetitions I noticed were
-Odin has a map as detailed as Harry had made LC,
-Mab going into battle was almost to a T Molly fighting In her earlier state. Multiple images all going every direction. (Cold Case, something se brought over from her natural talents too)
This repetition of details in archatype characters or perhaps history itself is a detail I like to point out whenever I see it. Something that combined with the theory of the gyre (referenced in yeats second coming iirc, certain in yeats own philosophical leanings) can accurately predict future events.. for one that has happened, Harry kills Susan to save his daughter, Nic kills his daughter in spite of the mother(they are the most polar opposite, I believe because Nic was the most recent and ergo inverted repetition). And a future one I hope comes to fruition

(click to show/hide)

Harry goes into the library of Congress to save or destroy their stores of knowledge on supernatural beings

also, I'm keeping an eye on Thomas compared to TWC(and in direct correlation to Harry)... Due to a line of theories going Harry=Antichrist, nic=Judas, Judas=doubting Thomas, Doubting Thomas=Jesus Christ's brother.(which seems to invert their fate in direct parallel, they are now playing the part of the other brother except in dark parallel) culminating in whatever Harry does opposite of Judas in becoming a dark TWC, Thomas will act in opposition as the risen Judas. 🤔 I cannot yet see where that ends up though. Harry is going to be a 'good monster', so will Thomas be a 'bad' good guy? Balance... Balance..

[Dina]

About the Antichrist, there is a WoJ that Drakul is something inhuman in a human body (or something like that). It sounds like Jesus himself. Therefore, I see Drakul as the dark Jesus, or AntiChrist. So I think the Shroud or the Crown are destined to beat Drakul for good.

[The_Sibelis]

About the Antichrist, there is a WoJ that Drakul is something inhuman in a human body (or something like that). It sounds like Jesus himself. Therefore, I see Drakul as the dark Jesus, or AntiChrist. So I think the Shroud or the Crown are destined to beat Drakul for good.

mmm? I certainly agree with him being on the same archatype as the Antichrist..  but I figure it's a starborn thing too.. the major players keep repeating themselves on the battlefield.... Now that I think on it that whole 666 years things kinda dampens the idea Nic was the last one, though, the gyre cycle is not the starborn cycle to begin with..
Anyway, I had an older theory that because of how Michael addresses Mavra and that he was sent on duty to stop Blamps that Drakul(or dracula at the time) was in fact Lucifer stuck in a mortal body, seperated from his grace in hell. And that's why he's the CEO of hell but not the absolute ruler like Hades is of his realm, that is to say it's genus loci of his own domain. Lucifer envied humanity, and it's freedom. It'd be kinda thematic for him to gain that freedom by being tricked into basically being a human. I find that less likely now, at least as Drakul, simply because while he was a BAMF, he was not Lucifer level BAMF imo.

[Snark Knight]

I find that less likely now, at least as Drakul, simply because while he was a BAMF, he was not Lucifer level BAMF imo.

Plus it raises an awkward question of where the BAMF quantity of hellfire in SmF came from if Lucifer was running around on earth.

[TheCuriousFan]

Plus it raises an awkward question of where the BAMF quantity of hellfire in SmF came from if Lucifer was running around on earth.

It was probably a subsidiary.

Muskogee: Yeah they will, there are ten of them. So I have some questions from our chat so I'm going to read these. So... where is Lucifer in all this? I am remembering he made a play in Small Favour with helping Nick power up the trap for Ivy.

Jim: He runs a pretty big corporation, it was probably a subsidiary.

[Griffyn612]

If the Fox show has taught us anything, Lucifer will have set up shop running a bar to be at the center... of... events...

Wait.

Mac?

 

[The_Sibelis]

Plus it raises an awkward question of where the BAMF quantity of hellfire in SmF came from if Lucifer was running around on earth.

if he's cut off from it directly it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. He just lacks direct access. Hence the big spell form to channel it.

[morriswalters]

@KurtinStGeorge
I'd like someone to explain to me what purpose changing the facade of Mort's house could serve in the books. 

[The_Sibelis]

@KurtinStGeorge
I'd like someone to explain to me what purpose changing the facade of Mort's house could serve in the books.

off the top of my head, one has a better threshold, but the other is a familial home, somewhere Sit Stuart has more power as guardian perhaps. Also the matter of the darkhallow, Morts tied up in the necromancy game going on in DB indirectly. I was thinking if MM Harry specifically did a mini hallow, then the position of Mort is something that can effect other choices and consequences. Other things I'm sure, but I'm tired and getting ready for bed.(overnight last night)

[Wicked Woodpecker of West]

This one sounds like a continuity error to me, but there are a number of instances in many of the novels of discrepancies that I ascribe to the story being told across multiple Dresden universes.  The story is happening with all the major events playing out the same way within each universe, but with minor changes in past events changing things very slightly here and there.

So in Peace Talks Harry says the wooden skull Bonea resides in was made for her, when in fact it was originally made for Bob.  The Brighter Future Society changes names to Better Future Society and then back again.  In at least one of the worlds with a Better Future Society, Harry says he had never been to Marcone’s castle in the flesh before Peace Talks, but he had gone there in Skin Game.  This was probably because in a different Dresdenverse the meeting between Marcone and Mab that took place in Skin Game occurred at a different Marcone property or possibly at Mac’s or even Arctis Tor.  It doesn’t matter where that meeting took place, as long as it wasn’t at the castle and it was a place that Harry could discover and go to.

Now, either this is matter of Jim not being careful enough - which is always a chance, or maybe purposefuly Dresden memory not being good enough, and struggling a big.

But if your're right and that's like purposeful multiverse creation by Butcher - this books will enormously grew in my mind - maybe not in terms of enjoyement perhaps as I'm usually not fan of multiverses as they sort of cheapens weight of both free will and destiny in my mind - but most definitely in terms of WOAH Jim pulled this thing of on purpose.

But... untile proven otherwise I will go with simple bit sloppy Butchering

[Mira]

Now, either this is matter of Jim not being careful enough - which is always a chance, or maybe purposefuly Dresden memory not being good enough, and struggling a big.

But if your're right and that's like purposeful multiverse creation by Butcher - this books will enormously grew in my mind - maybe not in terms of enjoyement perhaps as I'm usually not fan of multiverses as they sort of cheapens weight of both free will and destiny in my mind - but most definitely in terms of WOAH Jim pulled this thing of on purpose.

But... untile proven otherwise I will go with simple bit sloppy Butchering

One of the biggest examples of weirdness, is the flash backs early in the books when young Harry comes home from school and Justin attempts to enthrall him,  he talks about a naked Elaine painted up with feathers, him being tied up, I think even some blood.  Then when Lea helps him to remember what supposedly really happened in Ghost Story, it doesn't match the original flashback at all.