Did Mab break her word to Harry in Battle Ground?

[ElJefe81]

I think that also was the signing of the contract. He won't need to sign again because the contract is still valid, even when the Queen changes.

I would agree, the contract is with Mab (the mantle) not Mab (the individual wearing the mantle)

[KurtinStGeorge]

I think that also was the signing of the contract. He won't need to sign again because the contract is still valid, even when the Queen changes.

The new Queen might want a symbolic reenactment of the signing of the contract.  You know, just to demonstrate to the rest of Winter that the new Queen and current Winter Knight are in accord with one another, and not at all because Molly has had a thing for Harry for years and is currently being forced to wear the equivalent of an unbreakable magical fae chastity belt.

[Arjan]

The new Queen might want a symbolic reenactment of the signing of the contract.  You know, just to demonstrate to the rest of Winter that the new Queen and current Winter Knight are in accord with one another, and not at all because Molly has had a thing for Harry for years and is currently being forced to wear the equivalent of an unbreakable magical fae chastity belt.

She might suggest it but Molly won’t force Harry in this.

[StrayDog]

It seemed to me that this wasn't a command as much as a recommendation. Mab's death would definitely break any contract just as Harry's death would do likewise. Molly is a sensitive who hasn't responded well to such things in the past. Granted she has grow loads since then but how well would she endure feeling thousands of deaths through her banner coming from the gates? Imagine what millions of deaths over a thousand years has done to Mab then imagine Molly feeling that. Over time she could build up to that but right now, maybe not. I think Mab in her conversation with Titania has now made arrangements for Summer to take over the outer gates should Mab fall but that didn't happen until after the battle.

[Mira]

It seemed to me that this wasn't a command as much as a recommendation. Mab's death would definitely break any contract just as Harry's death would do likewise. Molly is a sensitive who hasn't responded well to such things in the past. Granted she has grow loads since then but how well would she endure feeling thousands of deaths through her banner coming from the gates? Imagine what millions of deaths over a thousand years has done to Mab then imagine Molly feeling that. Over time she could build up to that but right now, maybe not. I think Mab in her conversation with Titania has now made arrangements for Summer to take over the outer gates should Mab fall but that didn't happen until after the battle.

What is troubling about that scene is Mab knows perfectly well, that Harry isn't about to kill Molly without a very good reason.  Now, maybe because she didn't have time or more serious stuff was pressing, she was super vague, bad stuff will happen to Molly, Harry, and the Winter Court.  Not, good enough.

[Telynn]

What is troubling about that scene is Mab knows perfectly well, that Harry isn't about to kill Molly without a very good reason.  Now, maybe because she didn't have time or more serious stuff was pressing, she was super vague, bad stuff will happen to Molly, Harry, and the Winter Court.  Not, good enough.

She is planting the seed.  She knows if she dies Harry will not turn right around and kill Molly.  But it would be in the back of his head and he will be watching her closer.

[Mira]

She is planting the seed.  She knows if she dies Harry will not turn right around and kill Molly.  But it would be in the back of his head and he will be watching her closer.

Agreed, that is about the best she can do, because she knows at first at least, Harry will not obey that order.

[StrayDog]

She is planting the seed.  She knows if she dies Harry will not turn right around and kill Molly.  But it would be in the back of his head and he will be watching her closer.

Is Molly going to be the one to knife Harry in the back?

[Dina]

It seemed to me that this wasn't a command as much as a recommendation. Mab's death would definitely break any contract just as Harry's death would do likewise. Molly is a sensitive who hasn't responded well to such things in the past. Granted she has grow loads since then but how well would she endure feeling thousands of deaths through her banner coming from the gates? Imagine what millions of deaths over a thousand years has done to Mab then imagine Molly feeling that. Over time she could build up to that but right now, maybe not. I think Mab in her conversation with Titania has now made arrangements for Summer to take over the outer gates should Mab fall but that didn't happen until after the battle.

I disagree about the first part of what you said. I believe Harry will still be tied because, as ElJefe said, his contract is actually with Mab the mantle.

[Mira]

Is Molly going to be the one to knife Harry in the back?

Naw, in my opinion, that was Carlos.  I believe Eb was speaking metaphorically, not literally.  And I do believe it was Carlos who testified against Harry before the Council.

[StrayDog]

Naw, in my opinion, that was Carlos.  I believe Eb was speaking metaphorically, not literally.  And I do believe it was Carlos who testified against Harry before the Council.

Certainly the knife in the back is metaphorical and not literal. It only indicated betrayal of some sort. Yes it could have been Carlos changing his vote but didn't he say it was an emergency meeting of the SC while Eb and LTW were in surgery? That the vote was unanimous as well? We've been assuming that both Eb and LTW didn't know the vote would take place, giving their proxies to the Merlin but what if they had their proxies vote against Harry or knowingly let their proxies go to Langtree?

[morriswalters]

deed.” She narrowed her eyes. “Should I fall, I have one last command you would be wise to fulfill.” I tilted my head. “Kill Molly Carpenter,” she said calmly. “As quickly as possible.”

Butcher, Jim. Battle Ground (Dresden Files) (p. 219). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

This reads as Mab is giving him freedom of action.

[StrayDog]

This reads as Mab is giving him freedom of action.

It certainly does, did she allude to the burden of her mantel on Demonreach too? When Harry threatened to kill her and she said that Molly just got the Winter Lady mantel, do you want to add the Winter Queen as well? Seemed to indicate the Molly wouldn't fair so well.

[Mira]

Certainly the knife in the back is metaphorical and not literal. It only indicated betrayal of some sort. Yes it could have been Carlos changing his vote but didn't he say it was an emergency meeting of the SC while Eb and LTW were in surgery? That the vote was unanimous as well? We've been assuming that both Eb and LTW didn't know the vote would take place, giving their proxies to the Merlin but what if they had their proxies vote against Harry or knowingly let their proxies go to Langtree?

When Langtry has proxies, he uses them his way, he only follows the wishes of those who's proxies he holds when their wishes coincide with his own.  We saw that in Proven Guilty.

It certainly does, did she allude to the burden of her mantel on Demonreach too? When Harry threatened to kill her and she said the Molly just got the Winter Lady mantel, do you want to add the Winter Queen as well? Seemed to indicate the Molly wouldn't fair so well.

Certainly not at that point, she was in a dead faint from the shock of it just entering her body.  It didn't come with a manual.