Vadderung and Ferrovax(PT Spoilers)

[Con]

So that moment.

Vadderung is Beowulf.

Both Odin and Beowulf have slayed Dragons.

There was that moment just a subtle tap that made Ferro hesitate and stop, then once the Titan came the Titan was more respectful to Vadderung than she was to Ferro who was basically her puppet.

Given how powerful Ferro is there's also the limitation of that power. Ferro was rather limited in not being about to help the Accords or the new Anti-Titan League, because he could crack reality with his presence

Vadderung has more choice because he's mortal he can directly help.

In that moment that tap of warning and respect stalemated Ferro.

[Mira]

  Ferrofax stated in Peace Talks that he'd shut off the earth so the Fomor couldn't invade from underneath.  He then said if he did more he'd do more harm to the city than good.  Vadderung said he'd shut off the air/ways, which you'd think Mab would do, but there it is.

[Conspiracy Theorist]

Already brought this up, and of course there is the legends of St Nicholas taming a Dragon.

Basically these two have been at it a long time, and it is likely they are most Dragons and Dragon Slayers in history anf myth. Wikipedia has a list of Dragon Slayers, several of which shout Vadderung. Basically everyone except Bard and Smaug.

[Avernite]

Already brought this up, and of course there is the legends of St Nicholas taming a Dragon.

Basically these two have been at it a long time, and it is likely they are most Dragons and Dragon Slayers in history anf myth. Wikipedia has a list of Dragon Slayers, several of which shout Vadderung. Basically everyone except Bard and Smaug.

You're telling me all those are Vaddrung, them up comes an aspiring Knight just around Harry's time, and becomes the first other Dragonslayer?

I mean, it's not impossible, but I think ALL of them is overselling.

[Mira]

I totally doubt that Vadderung is mortal.

[Con]

I totally doubt that Vadderung is mortal.

You and Quantus both, but repeated WOj's say otherwise

Quote:"He's already Kringle when Kringles around...When he's acting in his role of Kringle he takes on the Kringle Aspect when he's doing that he's got all the power of a major lord of Faerie but he's also beholden to Mab while it's going on, Mab's no dummy though so she knows not to order him around. But they do talk and have strategy sessions and stuff like that. The Kringle is what Odin does to keep from dying of old age."

Quote: "If you’re (a powerful immortal being) in the real world, well, the problem is that you’re in the world, and you’re kind of mortal, and something could come along and try and whack you, if they’re fast enough, or good enough, or lucky enough. Which makes Odin a kind of special guy, because he doesn’t mind it, he thinks it’s awesome."

"

Already brought this up, and of course there is the legends of St Nicholas taming a Dragon.

Basically these two have been at it a long time, and it is likely they are most Dragons and Dragon Slayers in history anf myth. Wikipedia has a list of Dragon Slayers, several of which shout Vadderung. Basically everyone except Bard and Smaug.

It's one of the things about Immortals even if you're mortal enemies your frenemies if onyl for the fact that there are relatively few of you left, the ones that are have been around and you've known for centuries. Love/Hate Frenemies that you know evantually you might have to kill. Otherwise known as Family.

[Darkest-Before-Dawn]

Quote:"He's already Kringle when Kringles around...When he's acting in his role of Kringle he takes on the Kringle Aspect when he's doing that he's got all the power of a major lord of The Kringle is what Odin does to keep from dying of old age."

I don't doubt Vadderung is definitely more mortal than some of the other beings in the series we've seen. But I do wonder about the old age thing. I read this more as a metaphor for immortals 'growing old' and dying out because nobody worhsips them anymore. To me that says Kringle is Vadderung's way of having mortals know about him and pay him tribute (in milk and cookies). Since there aren't many Odin worshipers in the world anymore.

[Bad Alias]

I don't doubt Vadderung is definitely more mortal than some of the other beings in the series we've seen. But I do wonder about the old age thing. I read this more as a metaphor for immortals 'growing old' and dying out because nobody worhsips them anymore. To me that says Kringle is Vadderung's way of having mortals know about him and pay him tribute (in milk and cookies). Since there aren't many Odin worshipers in the world anymore.

I've met at least one.

[Conspiracy Theorist]

You're telling me all those are Vaddrung, them up comes an aspiring Knight just around Harry's time, and becomes the first other Dragonslayer?

I mean, it's not impossible, but I think ALL of them is overselling.

My theory is that most of the historical/mythological dragonslayers are Vadderung, and the dragons Ferrovax, neither can really kill each other. They are forever stalemated, but on occasion Ferrovax gets playful and needs to be slapped down.

Perhaps it’s a long con, Ferrovax starts up, terrorises the locale, accumulates a hoard, and the villagers put out a reward for someone to slay the dragon, and Vadderung steps forward, “slays” the dragon and gets the reward and Ferrovax and Vadderung then split the proceeeds warily between them. Vadderung invests his share in creating Monoc, Ferrovax adds to his hoard, and they wait a couple of decades before trying it again.

Michael didn’t attack Ferrovax he killed the lesser Siriovax, and he stayed dead.

[vultur]

There's a WOJ that there were once weaker, non-Ferrovax/Siriothrax level, dragons but most of them were killed off - "thanks George" - so I think most dragonslayers weren't Odin and didn't deal with capital-D Dragons.

As for Odin/Kringle, we might actually have the cause and effect reversed. I don't think gods and other Nevernever entities need mortal belief or worship, just knowledge - knowledge of them as myths or folklore is good enough, as shown by the whole Grimm's Fairy Tales incident, and the stories of Odin survived even when he had no worshipers.

(Yes, there are some now, but there was a long time between the end of pre-Christian Norse worship and the origin of modern Neopaganism.)

I think it's at least as likely that in the Dresdenverse the original Norse paganism died out because the Aesir dwindled in power, giving over their Purpose at the Gates to the Fae.