Now THAT's what I call a Sample Chapter!

[ClintACK]

Wow.

https://www.jim-butcher.com/books/dresden/battle-ground-17/battle-ground-chapter-3

[kel0700]

Amazing chapter, even though it was short. Can't wait for this book.

[knightedbishop]

So, I think this makes it clear that Mac is (or was) one of the angelic watchers talked about in the Book of Enoch. Retired? Fallen? Did he have a Nephilim child? More to be told, I’m sure.

I wonder how Dresden figured out the power of the placard. Seems pretty specific. And interesting. And small scale thinking if he gave it to Mac. He could have given it to Marcone and hustled many more people into the BFS castle.

[Silentbrick]

And if he gave it to Marcone, he'd never get it back.

[Bad Alias]

I wonder how Dresden figured out the power of the placard. Seems pretty specific.

That's what I was thinking. I don't think anyone has commented here about any legend they've heard about the placard.

He could have given it to Marcone and hustled many more people into the BFS castle.

It probably wasn't "one of the designated shelters" because that's where the talks were going down.

[Conspiracy Theorist]

Still tormenting us about Mac, still!

Intellectus (of more than just Demonreach or about the written word) is something we have only seen in the Mothers and Archangels. It does explain why Mac doesn’t need to speak, he already knows.

Exactly how much research has Harry done on the objects, when and how? He suddenly has all this knowledge, when ignorance has been his most enduring feature. So the Placard is a super threshold, which puts Macanally’s on par with the Carpenters supernaturally, which is  powered by multiple Angels. Does this mean the bar can now withstand the eye of Balor? Is it just the bar, if Mac owns the entire building is that covered as well? That means they still have to defend against purely physical force, which is where Murphy comes in I suppose.

It’s original purpose on the crucifixtion would have been to protect Christ on the cross from supernatural intervention, but from who? Christ owned the Cross?

Is that as Harry has the Placard this is how he gets the Castle?it can only be used by someone who owns the building it is part of, so to create the perfect supernatural bomb shelter Harry has to own it. Harry becomes Marcone’s Landlord? Will Harry make Marcon shoevel the paths in Winter, even though as Winter Knight he doesn’t need them shovelled?

[Mira]

   So, if Harry looked at Mac with his sight, it would blind him or hurt him in some way.  Okay, seeing Shaggy with his sight gave him a severe migraine.  So is Mac really a retired archangel?  Did he rebel, but not quite fall with the rest?  Hopefully we will find out by the end of this book..

He had to trick her, but Harry did the right thing with Murphy, given her condition it is the best place for her to do some good..  Now, will Mac heal her when things get really nasty?  Do you doubt that Mac could?

[Bad Alias]

It does explain why Mac doesn’t need to speak, he already knows.

An alternative explanation is that it's dangerous for him to speak. That there are rules preventing him from sharing too much, so he errs on the sided of caution.

So the Placard is a super threshold, which puts Macanally’s on par with the Carpenters supernaturally, which is  powered by multiple Angels.

I kind of got the impression that this one has a different loophole. That loophole is that the threshold doesn't protect Mac.

So, if Harry looked at Mac with his sight, it would blind him or hurt him in some way.  Okay, seeing Shaggy with his sight gave him a severe migraine.  So is Mac really a retired archangel?

The only other time we saw something shutdown Harry's sight for his own benefit was the angel guard to the "police station" in GS.

[ClintACK]

I kind of got the impression that this one has a different loophole. That loophole is that the threshold doesn't protect Mac.

Yep. Like it redirects any attack against the people sheltering there into an attack on Mac.

Perhaps some sort of parallel to Jesus on the Cross taking on all of the sins of the world for everyone.

[KurtinStGeorge]

Yep. Like it redirects any attack against the people sheltering there into an attack on Mac.

Perhaps some sort of parallel to Jesus on the Cross taking on all of the sins of the world for everyone.

That makes sense.  I didn't get why the placard might redirect any attacks against the paraneters to Mac.  I had to reread what Harry said about the sign to be certain.  So this means that Mac is mortal or is made vulnerable by putting up the sign in his place.  So the question is, how much punishment can Mac take?   

[Bad Alias]

I'm not sure if it redirects the attacks to Mac. I just think Mac has to be killed to take down the threshold. I bet the bar is still vulnerable to the usual methods of getting around a threshold, like burning the place down or sending in mortal attackers. I'm not sure what happens if a supernatural threat goes after Mac directly. It's implied that the threshold won't protect him.

[morriswalters]

This is theology 101, Jesus died on the cross to save Man. Mac would appear to be a crispy critter.

[Mira]

This is theology 101, Jesus died on the cross to save Man. Mac would appear to be a crispy critter.

Yeah, sacrifice, by putting his blood on the Placard, Mac committed to sacrifice himself to save the others in the bar.

Rereading the bit when Mac first eyes it, I got the feeling that Mac was there when Jesus died.  Another thought of who he could be possibly, Pilate.  He may have objected to the role he was forced to play so that Jesus could die for our sins? 

One more thing, the look between Lara and Molly.. What is Molly so pissed about?  What does she know, is it Lara calling in the favors owed by the Winter Court?  Does she know that Lara might be behind what happened to Thomas in the first place? 

[Yuillegan]

I think it's clear Mac is

(click to show/hide)

a Grigori

.

Which isn't to say he isn't other beings from myth and legend as well.

I don't think he is

(click to show/hide)

Rafael

. Mostly because he appears to be active and I think would have elicited a stronger response from Before. And his title isn't Watcher either.

I believe the Placard, at least in my interpretation of the scene, is similar to JK Rowling's literary device of the "Fidellius Charm" and the Secret Keeper function. i.e Mac is the weak point of an otherwise impenetrable threshold. Meaning that for it to hold true, Mac will have to sacrifice himself (Morris is correct). If Mac were to not sacrifice himself, or place himself between the path of whatever was trying to get into his bar, the Placard's power would be neutralized.

I have no idea why Jim wants to sacrifice Mac at this point but clearly he wants to start expanding the scope of his books.

   So, if Harry looked at Mac with his sight, it would blind him or hurt him in some way.  Okay, seeing Shaggy with his sight gave him a severe migraine.  So is Mac really a retired archangel?  Did he rebel, but not quite fall with the rest?  Hopefully we will find out by the end of this book..

He had to trick her, but Harry did the right thing with Murphy, given her condition it is the best place for her to do some good..  Now, will Mac heal her when things get really nasty?  Do you doubt that Mac could?

Not just a sever migraine but it almost destroyed his sanity. He is forever damaged by it. Don't think he is a retired Archangel though, I will get into that.

I don't think Mac can heal Murphy. It would unfortunately abrogate her Free Will, remove the consequences (good and bad) that came with her choices. I think Mac can only heal himself. He is transubstantiated but perhaps not quite to the degree Uriel was. Or perhaps he is but he has gained some power since...or maybe he cheats. Maybe it was Mab who healed him.

An alternative explanation is that it's dangerous for him to speak. That there are rules preventing him from sharing too much, so he errs on the sided of caution.

The only other time we saw something shutdown Harry's sight for his own benefit was the angel guard to the "police station" in GS.

I agree. Mac is either limited or chooses to limit his speech. It amounts mostly to the same. Maybe a bit of both. If he still has access to some intellectus that gives him tremendous power anyway even if he can't just outright warp reality.

Yeah, that was definitely a call back to GS. Jim is really trying to remind readers and be like "hey, have you worked it out?" plus we have years of Mac's food and drink being "divine" or "heavenly" etc.

Not sure what happened between Molly and Lara...could be the violation of the guest right and stealing Thomas back and Molly is angry on behalf of Winter. It felt right because of her formality. In saying that, Lara seemed to catch on immediately so perhaps it is personal.

[Bad Alias]

Yeah, that was definitely a call back to GS. Jim is really trying to remind readers and be like "hey, have you worked it out?" plus we have years of Mac's food and drink being "divine" or "heavenly" etc.

Yeah. And "divine intellectus" seemed a bit on the nose to me.