What is Lara's problem? [PT Spoilers!]

[Grifter]

It depends what we are saying with "out of juice". Particularly I did not mean "she is starving" but "she has the munchies. She wants food right now".

I don't think she was starving, but typically when someone is out of juice, they're exhausted and not capable of fighting/playing/continuing.  Which strikes me as odd given her presumed power level as White Queen. 

[Arjan]

I don't think she was starving, but typically when someone is out of juice, they're exhausted and not capable of fighting/playing/continuing.  Which strikes me as odd given her presumed power level as White Queen.

That is how white court vampires work. If their reservoir runs empty they can do less and their hunger puts on pressure to feed. Lara is always well fed. She has little experience in running low.

[KurtinStGeorge]

For me; the real question is, Why didn't Lara ask Harry specific questions about his plan to keep Thomas safe and hidden.  I mean Harry had to have told Lara something like, "I can put Thomas in a kind of stasis that will both protect him from tracking spells and his own hunger, but everything I need to do it is on an island in Lake Michigan"  All Lara would have had to have said was something like, "Why there?" and "How does it work?" 

In theory, Harry could have lied to Lara if she had asked one or both of the above two questions, but that's not really Harry's style and Lara would know that.  So in this situation, Lara charging Harry with a blade is odd; and maybe even somewhat out of character, but what is even more odd is Lara not doing her due diligence. 

[Arjan]

For me; the real question is, Why didn't Lara ask Harry specific questions about his plan to keep Thomas safe and hidden.  I mean Harry had to have told Lara something like, "I can put Thomas in a kind of stasis that will both protect him from tracking spells and his own hunger, but everything I need to do it is on an island in Lake Michigan"  All Lara would have had to have said was something like, "Why there?" and "How does it work?" 

In theory, Harry could have lied to Lara if she had asked one or both of the above two questions, but that's not really Harry's style and Lara would know that.  So in this situation, Lara charging Harry with a blade is odd; and maybe even somewhat out of character, but what is even more odd is Lara not doing her due diligence.

It started earlier but slowly Jim is showing us that the all powerful super humans are more vulnerable than Harry thought they were. Mab and her daughter. Lara running low. Ebenezer and control issues. Nicodemus not as smart as we thought.

[Dina]

For me; the real question is, Why didn't Lara ask Harry specific questions about his plan to keep Thomas safe and hidden.  I mean Harry had to have told Lara something like, "I can put Thomas in a kind of stasis that will both protect him from tracking spells and his own hunger, but everything I need to do it is on an island in Lake Michigan"  All Lara would have had to have said was something like, "Why there?" and "How does it work?" 

In theory, Harry could have lied to Lara if she had asked one or both of the above two questions, but that's not really Harry's style and Lara would know that.  So in this situation, Lara charging Harry with a blade is odd; and maybe even somewhat out of character, but what is even more odd is Lara not doing her due diligence. 

I don't think he would have mentioned stasis. I believe he told her that the island had magical defenses or something like that. The thing is,Harry and Lara had not idea a Titan would appear to create chaos and endanger the whole city. So why Lara thinks Harry did a whole ruse to have the Raith forces protecting him and leverage her? He conceived all that in a minute, as soon as he saw the Titan? And did something completely out of character for him in all the years they have known each other? Nonsense. It makes more sense that Harry is being sincere, that he has done the best he could to protect their brother and she should help him. Besides, don't forget that Lara used her favor to force Harry. I understand her anger and frustration but I would hope it would get better after Lara had some time to cool off. Unfortunately, the whole conversation in the island foreshadows Lara doing something awful to Harry in the future (which, I don't like).

[Arjan]

I don't think he would have mentioned stasis. I believe he told her that the island had magical defenses or something like that. The thing is,Harry and Lara had not idea a Titan would appear to create chaos and endanger the whole city. So why Lara thinks Harry did a whole ruse to have the Raith forces protecting him and leverage her? He conceived all that in a minute, as soon as he saw the Titan? And did something completely out of character for him in all the years they have known each other? Nonsense. It makes more sense that Harry is being sincere, that he has done the best he could to protect their brother and she should help him. Besides, don't forget that Lara used her favor to force Harry. I understand her anger and frustration but I would hope it would get better after Lara had some time to cool off. Unfortunately, the whole conversation in the island foreshadows Lara doing something awful to Harry in the future (which, I don't like).

More sense to us.

But remember the problem about understanding other peoples motives in Skin Game? Karin thinks it easy to understand Harry but for Nicodemus it is very difficult. Lara is bad in understanding Harry because of what Lara is.

(TV Tropes warning. Take a day off)
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EvilCannotComprehendGood

[ClintACK]

Re: Lara being empty...

Remember that Thomas's Hunger has always been described as being much stronger than Lara's (or any other WCV's except their father's) -- it's possible that a comfortable margin for her is barely enough to sate his. And the feeding process is probably less than 100% efficient.

LOTR was a masterpiece,  Peace Talks not so much,  yes, LOTR was split into three books but each book felt complete, Peace Talks not so much..

LOTR was a masterpiece. But if I'd waited six years to get Two Towers to see how Frodo and Sam got on with their adventures going to Mordor to destroy the ring, I'd have been screaming bloody murder. They spent their entire book walking in swamps and whining about things.

(Also, LOTR was technically six books published in three volumes. /pedantic nitpick.)

Having the next book already there to pick up makes all the difference -- like how the ends of Changes and Ghost Story appeared to us (reading and then waiting for the next book) as opposed to readers picking up the series now. Peace Talks won't feel nearly as incomplete once we've read Battle Ground. The feeling isn't just that the threads are up in the air, it's that we can't identify what are threads of plot and what are red herrings (or worse, signs of the author having lost the plot) until we've read the second half.

[Mira]

LOTR was a masterpiece. But if I'd waited six years to get Two Towers to see how Frodo and Sam got on with their adventures going to Mordor to destroy the ring, I'd have been screaming bloody murder. They spent their entire book walking in swamps and whining about things.

(Also, LOTR was technically six books published in three volumes. /pedantic nitpick.)

All true, however carefully planned out and refined and rerefined..   Tolkien didn't wait for five years writing other stuff then rushing through the writing of the next book.   Also The Two Towers wasn't just about Frodo and Sam stumbling around in the Dead Marshes, there was that "other book" with in the book going on the return of Gandalf, the awakening of the Ents, the healing of King Theoden etc all intertwined and setting up for the climax in Return of the King.. 

Having the next book already there to pick up makes all the difference -- like how the ends of Changes and Ghost Story appeared to us (reading and then waiting for the next book) as opposed to readers picking up the series now. Peace Talks won't feel nearly as incomplete once we've read Battle Ground. The feeling isn't just that the threads are up in the air, it's that we can't identify what are threads of plot and what are red herrings (or worse, signs of the author having lost the plot) until we've read the second half.

As pointed out, most of the readers of Peace Talks have pretty much read the whole series, a lot of page space didn't need to be mired in rehash.  It was never meant to be a stand alone, even if Battle Ground was part of it..

[TheCuriousFan]

So - Lara just outright charges Harry with a knife?

Yeah, I know, "people are irrational about family" is one of the themes of the book. But Lara's White Court. She's been surviving in a really deadly society for a long time. She really ought to be more controlled than that.

Even without Demonreach, there wasn't much chance of that working out for her.

She was there in WN. She's seen what happens when a White Court vampire goes up against a combat-capable wizard; it ain't good for the vampire. Sure, she had Valkyrie backup, but Harry could have fried or frozen her just as quickly as he told the island to grab her - before Freydis could have done anything.

To recap her situation:

• Her brother who she raised is basically dead.
• She's got traitors in her midst.
• The city she runs her operations out of is in the middle of being burned to the ground in an event that'll shatter the masquerade and most likely wipe out her court.
• The island absolutely freaks out anyone who isn't Harry.
• Ebenezar's that's what they are comment seemingly got way under her skin.
• She's hungry.
• And most importantly, from where she's standing it really looks like Harry went for a backstab.

So yeah, just a few reasons to lose control over her temper.

[morriswalters]

The events on the island are poorly motivated.  Jim had already established in Turn Coat what would happen in these circumstances.  The Skin Walker used this to torture Thomas. The process was to torture Thomas to the point of death and then feed him. Thomas was starving and it was killing him. There were no people on the island, so where was he going to get food?  I don't think there were any cans of instant vampire food in the cabin.  Either Lara is a idiot or Jim thinks we are.

[Dina]

I totally agree with TCF (also, hi! I haven't seen in a while, I don't even know if you visited your birthday thread)

Morris, Harry did not tell Lara that he would feed Thomas, only that he will keep him safe. I don't think he gave her any detail, and there simply were not much time to talk. She trusted him because she believed Harry cared for their brother, and then she saw Thomas hurt and...disappearing. She felt that she did a terrible mistake and failed Thomas.

[Mira]

The events on the island are poorly motivated.  Jim had already established in Turn Coat what would happen in these circumstances.  The Skin Walker used this to torture Thomas. The process was to torture Thomas to the point of death and then feed him. Thomas was starving and it was killing him. There were no people on the island, so where was he going to get food?  I don't think there were any cans of instant vampire food in the cabin.  Either Lara is a idiot or Jim thinks we are.

  In chapter one we have Thomas, agitated, Justine is pregnant,> Eb showing up at Harry's place to warn Harry that the White Council is out to get him, but no details> sees Thomas and spews all kinds of vitriol against him and he and Harry get into a heated "talk" about him but no one is honest, not Eb on why he hates vamps so and not Harry that Thomas is his brother and Eb's grandson> Harry goes off to have sex with Murphy and the next thing we know Thomas has tried to assassinate
someone and killed someone else and either the Stavaelves are super fighters or Thomas wasn't "topped" off but they manage to beat him up to the point of death...  Jump some more and jump some more, they spring Thomas and head to the island...  Why one has to ask didn't Lara insist that they stop at the local McDonalds on the way so Thomas could grab a quick snack from one of the employees?   

[Dina]

I am sure Lara intended to do something like that, but an EMP in Chicago complicated things 

[Mira]

I am sure Lara intended to do something like that, but an EMP in Chicago complicated things 

 I could over look the starvation issue, the big elephant in the room is what were his motivations?
Who was behind it?  What were their motivations? 

[morriswalters]

I am sure Lara intended to do something like that, but an EMP in Chicago complicated things 

I have no way of knowing for certain but I suspect this is the subplot that was created when they decided to split the book.  I doubt that Lara was suppose to be involved at all.  I can see Harry dragging a half dead Thomas to the island to save his life, but Lara coming along for the ride feels contrived. ?shrug?