Why, Thomas, Why? (Peace Talks Spoilers)

[medaron]

So, I was thinking about this and haven’t seen anyone else post on it yet.

What if Thomas attacked and killed exactly who he wanted to? 

If he had orders from the Venators and Alustri was nemfected?  Thomas is skilled. If he wanted to have killed the svartelves leader afterwards, he could/would have. The fact that he didn’t was that he had completed his mission and didn’t want collateral damage.

(Apologies for misspellings, book is in the other room and I am incredibly lazy, lol)

[Grifter]

Certainly possible, but the description was that he went for the Etri, and Austri leapt between them. 

As for his abilities, we know in the first chapter that Thomas was notably hungry, likely because he hadn't been feeding properly.  There's a good chance he wasn't at full strength.  Which doesn't sound like a smart way to proceed with an assassination attempt.

[Bad Alias]

(click to show/hide)

I'm pretty sure Justine made him do it. With the proviso that I'm not certain if what we see is really Justine and that I don't know if was some form of mind control or just blackmail. Thomas keeps saying her name as a warning.

I also strongly feel that Justine is behind/in on it.
1) Eb makes a big deal about someone stabbing Harry in the back.
2) Someone is leaking information from the White Court.
3) Niall001's last sentence is a credible interpretation, especially within the context I provide below.
4) All the interest in Justine. She's more important than just Thomas's baby mama.

Counterpoint:

For one thing, I'm not convinced Thomas was trying to say "Justine".

Thomas never said Justine. I think the quote is "Justin-" and "J". Harry responds he's going to look out or take care of or already has taken care of Justine both times. Thomas responds with sobs or something similar both times. If it was Justin Dumorne, then mind magic and an f-you to Harry is a good explanation for why Thomas did it.

We really don't have any suggestion as to why Thomas did it other than someone threatening Justine. Harry does hint that maybe Thomas failing to kill Etri was intentional. We also don't have anything in this book as to why someone was trying to kill Etri.

[Grifter]

I also strongly feel that Justine is behind/in on it.
1) Eb makes a big deal about someone stabbing Harry in the back.
2) Someone is leaking information from the White Court.
3) Niall001's last sentence is a credible interpretation, especially within the context I provide below.
4) All the interest in Justine. She's more important than just Thomas's baby mama.

Counterpoint:Thomas never said Justine. I think the quote is "Justin-" and "J". Harry responds he's going to look out or take care of or already has taken care of Justine both times. Thomas responds with sobs or something similar both times. If it was Justin Dumorne, then mind magic and an f-you to Harry is a good explanation for why Thomas did it.

We really don't have any suggestion as to why Thomas did it other than someone threatening Justine. Harry does hint that maybe Thomas failing to kill Etri was intentional. We also don't have anything in this book as to why someone was trying to kill Etri.

In the case of Justin, or any other nefarious actor, the target wouldn't be Etri dying.  It'd be ideal, but the true win would be Thomas killing Etri, the Svartalves killing Thomas immediately, and Harry flying off the handle a la Red Court on the eve of the peace talks.  If it'd worked, The Wamps would not be working with the Svartalves and vice versa, Harry would be pissed at the Svartalves and in turn they'd be suspicious of him and Winter, the Council would continue to assume the worst and see Harry going off as a sign he's going warlock, and the whole thing would have fallen apart even before Mab got her teeth adjusted by Ethniu. 

I don't see it as part of the Fomor plot, but I see it as a chess move by Cowl/Black Council to ensure maximum chaos.

[Yuillegan]

Great theory Clintack. It's totally possible - and Eb has the means and motive. However, the main problem is that it created a lot of turmoil at a time when things needed to be calm. Which means either Eb wanted that (and is somewhat insane) OR it is isn't him. I also think it is certainly possible that it is in fact Etri's baby. However, the question then becomes why Justine is lying about the father? The two theories also don't work together. If one is true the other isn't.

Conspriracy Theorist you may be right about Titanic Bronze...then again what use would it be if it were so easy. Tbh it reminded me of Achilles in the River Styx. I suspect her one weak spot is the Eye of Balor myself - whatever the truth. Also the Athame/Spear isn't really there for actual combat. It's more about the ritual I suspect. But maybe it's both?

Dresden11 - Did you read the bit in Peace Talks right after Ethniu shows up? That's exactly when the Accords almost crumble - which as Marcone rightly points out was the whole point of Ethniu's entrance. Marcone, even under immense pressure and terror, is still very damn clever. Otherwise they would have just attacked. Read Sun Tzu's the Art of War - all warfare is based on deception. If they were not worried about the combined might of their enemies they wouldn't have bothered to announce their plans. But the whole show was also to scare their enemies into thinking they are mightier than they are, which Marcone saw through. Which isn't to say the Fomor and their allies are not mighty of course.

And perhaps the reason the Feds are watching Justine because in their eyes she is the girlfriend of a terrorist. The attack on the Svartalf embassy would have been treated as such, unless they thought it was some gas explosion. Or perhaps the Feds are more than merely FBI...perhaps they are the Federal version of SI. Like the BPRD.

Vairelome - Interesting idea. When Harry didn't use his blasting rod against the Cornerhound I wondered if Mab had done her old trick from Small Favor. OF course he uses it later which debunked that idea quick. I suppose I would question what Mab got out of the attack. Dresden already owed Lara regardless. Maybe she wanted Lara to waste her favors...but their would have been easier ways. Mab's reaction when Dresden was invisible also indicates that she wasn't in on it. She seemed to think Dresden was wasting his time.

Grifter - Totally possible the Fomor didn't arrange the hit on Etri. But it wasn't unrelated either.

Medaron - Totally possible, but why the hit on Etri. Why so obvious?

[Mira]

  My theory is Thomas is Nem infected or perhaps his Hunger Demon is, that is what drove him to attempt the assassination.  It is a diversion by the enemy, so the Fomor could bring up the big supernatural guns unnoticed, and meanwhile the Gates are under attack.

[Bad Alias]

Read Sun Tzu's the Art of War - all warfare is based on deception.

...

BPRD.

I prefer overwhelming force.  . Because I had to google it, BPRD is Bureau for Paranormal Research and Defense.

The surmountable problem with Thomas trying to warn Harry about Justin is Thomas shouldn't recognize Justin. Justin could have ignored the Evil Overlord List and taunted Thomas by revealing information.

[Grifter]

I prefer overwhelming force.  . Because I had to google it, BPRD is Bureau for Paranormal Research and Defense.

The surmountable problem with Thomas trying to warn Harry about Justin is Thomas shouldn't recognize Justin. Justin could have ignored the Evil Overlord List and taunted Thomas by revealing information.

Or a young Thomas saw Justin at Raith's house after Margaret left. They were supposedly contemporaries, and there are theories that they were all plotting together.  No reason to think that came to a stop after Margaret left.

[Cadmium]

I think the “why” was someone could guarantee that both Justine and the baby would survive to birth.

The price was the assassination.  Tomas learned too well from Harry’s example and was ready to sacrifice himself.  Especially since he saw himself as a potential danger to both. 

That someone may have been Mab.  Mab maybe used this as a way to direct ground out the favors She owed to Lara.

[Second Aristh]

That's an interesting thought, but I don't think Mab would order an assassination on a neutral party.


Also, how confirmed is it that Thomas was the assassin vs. Thomas being framed?

[Vairelome]

Also, how confirmed is it that Thomas was the assassin vs. Thomas being framed?

It depends on exactly how much you trust information from the svartelves.  Thomas plausibly has the means and reason to be present (either visiting Harry or one of his svartelf booty calls), and at the end of the day, the svartelves had physical possession of Thomas.  It's possible that Thomas was framed; either 1) the svartelves are lying about the events that took place (the svartelves are in on the frame job), or 2) someone else did the hit, framed Thomas, and fooled Etri and the rest simultaneously (the svartelves weren't in on it).

I'm inclined to believe the svartelves are being honest--it seems like it would be a major departure from their characterization otherwise--and I'm uncomfortable with the theory that someone snuck past svartelf security and pulled off the assassination attempt while framing Thomas and escaping undetected.  There are probably a handful of characters that could pull that off, but...the intended result would have to be Etri not dying, since I don't think it's plausible that someone could so thoroughly penetrate svartelf security (completely undetected!) and miss their shot at Etri.

[vultur]

There are probably a handful of characters that could pull that off, but...the intended result would have to be Etri not dying, since I don't think it's plausible that someone could so thoroughly penetrate svartelf security (completely undetected!) and miss their shot at Etri.

A naagloshii probably could have done it*. Regardless of whether it was Thomas or not, I think the real goal was to cause a major political incident.

*For that matter, can we absolutely confirm that the Thomas in most of this book was actually Thomas rather than a shapeshifter, conveniently posing as too injured to talk so Harry couldn't notice that the personality was wrong? Harry's illusion double might be a hint here.

OTOH, a shapeshifter probably would have transformed and attacked rather than let itself be imprisoned in Demonreach.

[Vairelome]

This may be naive of me, but...I'm really inclined to believe that Lara Raith was playing things straight in Peace Talks, and I'm not sure even Goodman Grey could have fooled her at that close a range for that length of time.  On the boat, she was interacting with Thomas Hunger-to-Hunger in order to keep him alive, and I don't see how Lara could be hoaxed at that point.

[Second Aristh]

Evanna mentions explosions started the fire in the building.  That's not Thomas's style at all.  Especially if he wasn't planning on getting caught.  An assassin posing as a svartalf could pin that on Thomas with enough chaos.  Thomas could have gone to Etri to negotiate to be Harry's new neighbor.  Parenthood probably pushed his buttons into wanting more security than his apartment to raise a child.

Plus Austri seemed to get along pretty well with Thomas; if he recognized the assassin as Not!Thomas, he would have to go.

[Second Aristh]

This may be naive of me, but...I'm really inclined to believe that Lara Raith was playing things straight in Peace Talks, and I'm not sure even Goodman Grey could have fooled her at that close a range for that length of time.  On the boat, she was interacting with Thomas Hunger-to-Hunger in order to keep him alive, and I don't see how Lara could be hoaxed at that point.

Yeah, that was Thomas.  Nothing was going to fool Lara with that kind of interaction.