Author Topic: Rashid's Eye  (Read 5130 times)

Offline Yuillegan

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Rashid's Eye
« on: June 09, 2020, 05:00:52 AM »
Whilst we are lead to believe that this Eye is given by the Mothers (Fates), what the Eye actually is and does is up for debate.

It seems implied that it can check possible futures but to what extent and how far is unknown - but it seems oddly similar to how the Mothers see futures. One way this might be possible is if the Gate is like the Ultimate Gate in Lovecraft mythos, which one can access the Multiverse through and see all possible timelines. Perhaps the Outer Gates have a similar quality...although that might imply that the Outer Gates are actually a part of the Mothers.

We also are told that it is a tool to check for Nemesis. It doesn't use the Sight however, although it is implied Rashid has used the Sight on Nemesis so it seems these are different methods. Considering it is made from the same "crystal" as the Outer Gates it appears it might share qualities (such as checking for Nemesis among other things...perhaps it also acts as a filter of sorts so that the viewer doesn't go mad).

In mythology there are a number of ancient eyes with mystical properties. The Eye of Horus that was cut out of the god Horus during his battle with his evil uncle Set, was healed by Thoth and was associated with the Moon. Odin cut out his own eye for wisdom and sacrificed it to the Well of Fate. Considering Thoth and Odin are considered to be equivalent (via Hermes/Mercury) perhaps in the Dresden Files that is how Vadderung lost his eye. Even more interestingly is the fact that the eye of the Fomorian King Balor was so powerful that it's evil gaze could kill those it hit (one of the origins for the phrase "The Evil Eye) and after being cut out was contained in crystal. Also, we have had reference to the Evil Eye in Blood Rites - the Malacchio entropy curse that Lord Raith uses (possibly sponsored by HWWBh).

In any case, the complicated links between Vadderung, Rashid, the Mothers, the Fomor and the Outsiders make for fun theories.

Does anyone have any other links or bits of trvia/mythology or clues they have picked up?
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Offline knnn

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2020, 01:48:24 PM »
The fact that it doesn't pick up Harry's connection to Demonreach until he physically stands on the island is rather telling.
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Offline Mira

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2020, 02:16:51 PM »
The fact that it doesn't pick up Harry's connection to Demonreach until he physically stands on the island is rather telling.

Or not,  it might be something that because Harry had to figure it out for himself so nothing was
said.   

Offline knnn

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2020, 04:46:18 PM »
I don't think that follows from the text, Unless you're saying Rashid's response was an act.

Quote from: Turn Coat
He frowned at me and then repeated the little ritual. Then he made a choking sound. "Blood of the Prophet. he swore, opening his eyes to stare at me. "You... You've claimed this place as a sanctum"
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Offline Mira

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2020, 05:42:59 PM »
I don't think that follows from the text, Unless you're saying Rashid's response was an act.

No, I misunderstood, dogs were doing crazy barking at the time I was reading and responding.  I was
thinking back to when at the end of Small Favor Harry told Luccio he felt like he had been on the island before, just got them mixed up..

Rereading the passage, the only thing I can think of is what went on between Harry and Demonreach is between them, that keeps the truth behind the island secret when he isn't on it, beyond even Rashid's magic eye.  However when he is standing on the island the bond is clear to those with the
ability to see it.

Offline Yuillegan

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2020, 12:40:53 AM »
Yes I think it could well be that Demonreach's intense magics meant that whilst Dresden wasn't on the island the futures were not so good, but once he was physically on it things improved dramatically.
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Offline Con

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2020, 09:37:11 AM »
I think Rashid's eye is his direct intellectus tool to the Outer Gates, and therefore anything involving them. Rashid changes his tune in Turn Coat after muterring a simple spell, before and after Harry steps on Demonreach, there by revealing Harry has become the Warden, and his chances of survival are greater. Later on in Turn Coat Ebenezar and Listens-to-Winds say Rashid is more familiar with what an Intellectus bond can actually do.

Offline morriswalters

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2020, 11:41:38 AM »
I think that the Gates and the Eye are in part like Little Chicago. And in part like the sight.  And in part a probability calculator. Plus some other things.

Offline Bad Alias

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2020, 03:29:51 PM »
If the Mothers gave Rashid the eye, it doesn't necessarily follow that the Gates are part of them. They could just be their custodian. Additionally, I don't think the Mothers are the Fates. I think the Mothers are a Fate. The Ladies are another, and so are the Queens.

I think there is only one Outside based on some stuff Jim has said, so the Gates might be able to be used to get to a different Inside.

The only other eye that comes to mind is the all seeing eye of Sauron. Most of these eyes are associated with knowledge or gathering knowledge. That makes sense because that's what eyes are for. They're for seeing things. We mostly learn first by seeing. Seeing is believing. It only makes sense that a magical eye will be related, in some way, to the function of a real eye. Especially in the DF where magic and symbolism often go hand in hand.

Offline g33k

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2020, 05:24:03 PM »
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Eye_of_Vecna



yeah, I know, I'll show myself out now...

Offline KurtinStGeorge

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2020, 08:11:42 AM »
I like Mira's idea that as a security measure the connection between Harry and Alfred can only be detected while Harry is on the Island.  Also, Harry doesn't mentally connect with Demonreach until he physically stands on the island.  We found that out when Harry, Molly and Morgan went to the island, just before Harry went back to Chicago and made his phone challenging the White Council.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2020, 08:25:57 AM by KurtinStGeorge »
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Offline Yuillegan

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2020, 05:52:29 AM »
Vecna is fairly new G33k, so I doubt Jim has much association with it. More likely they share some of the same origin materials.

Morris, I essentially agree.

Con, that's a very interesting idea. I wonder what more we will learn about sanctums. But I am sure Rashid has at least one. Does he mutter a spell? I don't have my copy of the book so can't check

Bad Alias - Sorry if I wasn't clear. I wasn't saying the Mothers (and only the Mothers) represent the entirety of the Fates. I agree that they are merely a part (perhaps the greatest part). But it's a very strange coincidence that the Mothers seem to see the future (from the perspective of an outside observer) almost the same way Rashid does? And considering his job and links to the Fae... It could be that being custodian of the Gates requires them to be a part of the Gates. Power has purpose after all.

I certainly wasn't suggesting there is more than one Outside. I have read the WOJs that support it. But I definitely think that going through the Outer Gates is one of the few ways of travelling through the multiverse...for beings that only exist in one place at once. Angels and the like are different.

Well the Eye of Sauron is actually a bit of a reference to Odin, Tolkien made a lot of references to Odin in his character of Sauron.
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Offline g33k

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2020, 12:14:35 AM »
Vecna is fairly new G33k, so I doubt Jim has much association with it ...

Jim is an active RPG gamer.
Vecna is a longtime element of D&D, going back to the late 70's (almost certainly before Jim got into gaming).

I mean... my "Vecna" remark was throwaway snark, honestly.  I expect Rashid's eye is more mythic/fairytale in origin than it is D&D in origin.

... But ...
 
« Last Edit: June 13, 2020, 08:04:17 PM by g33k »

Offline Mira

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2020, 02:48:44 PM »
Quote
If the Mothers gave Rashid the eye, it doesn't necessarily follow that the Gates are part of them. They could just be their custodian. Additionally, I don't think the Mothers are the Fates. I think the Mothers are a Fate. The Ladies are another, and so are the Queens.

It doesn't mean that they cannot be made out of the same substance either.  When you think about it the gates that are meant to keep out Outsiders etc wouldn't be made of ordinary material, so they can be used in defense.   It makes sense that Rashid's eye is made of the same material with an added bonus, a mind behind it to take action.  It also makes sense that the Mothers had the Eye first
to keep watch, they've been around for centuries before Rashid was even born.  Like Harry, Rashid has a role to play, he agreed to it or bargained for it, in return he was given the Eye so he could do his job.

Offline Avernite

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Re: Rashid's Eye
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2020, 04:34:18 PM »
Maybe it's the eye of the Graiai, that Perseus stole to be able to slay Medusa. Those sisters were named horror, alarm, and dread...

Granted that Mother Winter might have inherited it from the Graiai, but seemingly having good eyes herself, she doesn't really need it.