Any news on Peace Talks

[Mr. Death]

The Fomor are specifically noted as avoiding places with wizards, so if anything, I imagine it's the other way around -- the White Council attacking Fomor outposts and giving them a bloody nose.

I mean, think about it, the three major Fomor stories we have right now are:

(click to show/hide)

1. Even Hand, where the Fomor try and fail to take on Marcone, resulting in the death of a major Fomor sorcerer;
2. Aftermath, where Murphy and two of the Alphas wreck an entire Fomor cell by themselves.
And 3. Bombshells, where Molly helps take out one of their dudes.

So all in all, the Fomor are not fairing very well in straight fights, even against mostly mortal forces. So I doubt they've gone and given the White Council a bloody nose -- but they might be using the Peace Talks to try and take some of them out, like they tried in Bombshells.

[Kindler]

Well, yeah, they've gotten their butts handed to them when we've seen them fight characters with Plot Armor. I'm just judging from the information we got between Ghost Story and Skin Game, which kinda indicated that the Council was scrambling, to the point that they pretty much ignore North America to maintain order in Europe (with the exception of Bill, Carlos (currently out of action), and maybe another warden or two I can't remember).

Regardless, I phrased it poorly; I didn't mean that the Council was losing , especially not open confrontations. I meant that the Council was fighting a war of attrition, and not doing great. I mean, one dead wizard is more of a blow than, what, a hundred dead Fomor servitors? I don't know how many of them there are, I'm just going based on Fantasy Rules (for every "hero," there are approximately one quadrillion orcs/goblins/Red Court Vampires/Lilliputians.)

[segaily]

As of April 4th, 2019, the current draft of the novel is up to chapter 56. 

I must say wow the book is getting long and Jim is really knocking out chapters lately. 

[KurtinStGeorge]

Well, yeah, they've gotten their butts handed to them when we've seen them fight characters with Plot Armor. I'm just judging from the information we got between Ghost Story and Skin Game, which kinda indicated that the Council was scrambling, to the point that they pretty much ignore North America to maintain order in Europe (with the exception of Bill, Carlos (currently out of action), and maybe another warden or two I can't remember).

Regardless, I phrased it poorly; I didn't mean that the Council was losing , especially not open confrontations. I meant that the Council was fighting a war of attrition, and not doing great. I mean, one dead wizard is more of a blow than, what, a hundred dead Fomor servitors? I don't know how many of them there are, I'm just going based on Fantasy Rules (for every "hero," there are approximately one quadrillion orcs/goblins/Red Court Vampires/Lilliputians.)

Your post makes me wonder about Marcone and the White Court and what kind of losses they have been taking to hold onto the territory they claim within Chicago.  I remember the negotiation session Murphy had with Marcone's proxy in Ghost Story when they traded small bits of territory.  I don't remember the specifics of what their negotiation was about, but the important thing is that Murphy's people and Marcone would have to be willing to fight to hold on to what they had against the Fomor.  The same is true for Lara Raith and the rest of the White Court.

Now Marcone and Lara could use hired guns, but that would get pretty expensive because they would have to be highly trained people to go up against Fomor servitors.  Not the same thing as hiring people for a one time job like Marcone did in the Raith Deeps.  It makes me wonder how much Marcone and Lara would want a settlement with the Fomor or if either or both would really like the White Council to go all out against the Fomor and solve their problem for them.

As of April 4th, 2019, the current draft of the novel is up to chapter 56. 

I must say wow the book is getting long and Jim is really knocking out chapters lately.

We should have had pool going to guess how many chapters this book will have.

[Kindler]

Your post makes me wonder about Marcone and the White Court and what kind of losses they have been taking to hold onto the territory they claim within Chicago.  I remember the negotiation session Murphy had with Marcone's proxy in Ghost Story when they traded small bits of territory.  I don't remember the specifics of what their negotiation was about, but the important thing is that Murphy's people and Marcone would have to be willing to fight to hold on to what they had against the Fomor.  The same is true for Lara Raith and the rest of the White Court.

Now Marcone and Lara could use hired guns, but that would get pretty expensive because they would have to be highly trained people to go up against Fomor servitors.  Not the same thing as hiring people for a one time job like Marcone did in the Raith Deeps.  It makes me wonder how much Marcone and Lara would want a settlement with the Fomor or if either or both would really like the White Council to go all out against the Fomor and solve their problem for them.

Yeah, that scene was a little telling for me. Marcone and the White Court have the resources to hold Chicago reasonably well, but the Paranet review during that meeting indicates that the world is a very, very scary place for those without an organization backing you up. I would imagine Marcone would be interested in a deal that eliminates or mitigates the Fomor threat... but I also have the sense that Marcone would be extremely reticent to actually give up the territory he's holding, especially to the White Council. Lara and Marcone are using the chaos to expand, I think (actually, doesn't Thomas say that Lara's been particularly aggressive, going for national influence?). The White Council probably wouldn't care which crime lord runs Chicago, so long as it isn't the Fomor.

We should have had pool going to guess how many chapters this book will have.

I'm in! Twenty bucks on 62.

[morriswalters]

He's up to 57, I'm beginning to think he is writing the Encyclopedia Galactica rather than Peace Talks, /stamps feet and throws tantrum/

[Maz]

 

[DonBugen]

He's up to 57, I'm beginning to think he is writing the Encyclopedia Galactica rather than Peace Talks,

He'd better not be.  It's too expensive, and lacks any helpful advice on the cover.

[Griffyn612]

He'd better not be.  It's too expensive, and lacks any helpful advice on the cover.

[Mira]

   Long is good, but if the chapters are not just filler to make up for the long drought between books
in the series we may be in for a disappointment...    Not saying this is the case, it happens... Everything that goes before the word "but" in a sentence is bullshit.... Ned Stark..

[Avernite]

Well, yeah, they've gotten their butts handed to them when we've seen them fight characters with Plot Armor. I'm just judging from the information we got between Ghost Story and Skin Game, which kinda indicated that the Council was scrambling, to the point that they pretty much ignore North America to maintain order in Europe (with the exception of Bill, Carlos (currently out of action), and maybe another warden or two I can't remember).

Regardless, I phrased it poorly; I didn't mean that the Council was losing , especially not open confrontations. I meant that the Council was fighting a war of attrition, and not doing great. I mean, one dead wizard is more of a blow than, what, a hundred dead Fomor servitors? I don't know how many of them there are, I'm just going based on Fantasy Rules (for every "hero," there are approximately one quadrillion orcs/goblins/Red Court Vampires/Lilliputians.)

I have the feeling the White Council got too much used to major battles; especially Proven Guilty implied that the Red Court fought them en-masse. So a Wizard would be on his guard only occasionally for a period of utter chaos, and then go back to some semblance of normality.

And I think it's also where the Council's main strength is - bring your army to the battlefield the Council knows about, and they can prepare the magic to utterly wipe the floor with you. So noone who has an army wants to annoy them (much).

But the Fomor are fighting a guerilla war, and that requires constant vigilance and a desire to always go out there and kick the Fomor back. We see Marcone and Lara Raith (intelligent and adaptable operaters) struggle with it, so imagine what a bunch of hidebound conservatives would have to do?
This also means the victories of 'normals' against the Fomor are less impressive than otherwise would be the case - the moment a Fomor operation is known about by their enemies is the moment they have already half-lost, and smart Fomor operators start running (of course, the examples shared make it clear that such smarts aren't always in evidence).

[Fcrate]

Do not forget that the Fomor aren't fighting a war, per se. They're heavily recuiting, and accepting casualties while doing so. They're kidnapping as many people as possible with a low-class magical talent. Even to the point of trading one higher-class talent for two of the low-class. This means that they're turning them, and they care more about numbers than talent. All they're doing so far is preparing for the big fight to come.

[morriswalters]

If they are not fighting a war, why is the book called Peace Talks?  And if they are poor fighters, why the supposedly high body count in the Christmas story?  Fighting a conventional war is one thing, but they haven't shown any desire to do so.  But they have shown the will to use weapons of mass destruction.  It looks to me the Jim is going to try and deliver a sucker punch based on our expectations.  It's been driving me nuts as to why he killed off the Reds and replaced them with the Three Stooges.  It was late in the game to do it and it doesn't play well with me.  There has to be something more to it.

[Gman]

I think the Fomor are loosing lots of minions and rarely powerful Fomor. The White Council has few minions and lesser allies. So the White Council could be taking losses in much lower numbers but can't afford to lose 20 wizards to 500 minions and the Fomor count themselves ahead. Nemesis could be influencing some of the Fomor leaders so they are doing things not in their long term interests. Look what the Red Court did. They got themselves wiped out. The Black Council (Team Outsider) is trying to get the local major powers to fight each other and weaken or destroy each other. The White Council was supposed to be wiped out or crippled and the Red Court weakend. It was mentioned that the good guys took lots of losses in Peace Talks, perhaps the Fomor are now crippled and no longer a major player.

[groinkick]

I have the feeling the White Council got too much used to major battles; especially Proven Guilty implied that the Red Court fought them en-masse. So a Wizard would be on his guard only occasionally for a period of utter chaos, and then go back to some semblance of normality.

And I think it's also where the Council's main strength is - bring your army to the battlefield the Council knows about, and they can prepare the magic to utterly wipe the floor with you. So noone who has an army wants to annoy them (much).

But the Fomor are fighting a guerilla war, and that requires constant vigilance and a desire to always go out there and kick the Fomor back. We see Marcone and Lara Raith (intelligent and adaptable operaters) struggle with it, so imagine what a bunch of hidebound conservatives would have to do?
This also means the victories of 'normals' against the Fomor are less impressive than otherwise would be the case - the moment a Fomor operation is known about by their enemies is the moment they have already half-lost, and smart Fomor operators start running (of course, the examples shared make it clear that such smarts aren't always in evidence).

I think that what happened is the White Council suffered some big losses during the war with the reds.  They have been weakened, thus making their fight with the Fomor a more difficult one.  A good example is the Captain of the Wardens had her power placed in a weaker individual, and she can no longer forge the powerful swords the wardens carry.  Morgan, one of their greatest Wardens was killed.  Archangel, and the Brute Squad were all slaughtered. 

So they lost some heavy hitters, and that's not including all the people they lost to the Reds.  A White Council at full strength would be less vulnerable to the Fomor, and their tactics I think.