Future Darkhallow

[WereElephant]

As of the end Skin Game (and presumably into the beginning of Peace Talks - I haven't read the released chapter), six known entities have the knowledge to perform the Darkhallow: Harry, Mavra, Cowl, Evil Bob, Ivy, and Lasciel. I'm assuming Grevane is completely dead and not returning. Also assuming that Kemmler is staying dead. Think we'll see someone successfully pull it off?

I doubt it will be Harry. He's already gone down the Winter Knight path for power, and isn't overly thrilled with the consequences.

Mavra might not be interested in it. Her desire for the Word of Kemmler may have been to remove knowledge of her weaknesses from the world instead of a power grab. Her motivations are unknown to me at present.

I still think Cowl wants the power, but the circumstances haven't aligned for him to try again yet. He's a contender.

Evil Bob wouldn't (I think) be able to do it on his own behalf, but after Capiorcorpus went southbound, I imagine he's looking for new allies.

Ivy knows everything that's ever been written down, but I seriously doubt she'd ever use it.

Then there's Lasciel. IIRC, she knows everything that the shadow Lash knew (possibly knows?), so when Harry scanned each page of the Word for her to memorize before Grevane took the Word, a copy of that info went to the Fallen angel proper. As of Skin Game, Lasciel is evidently collaborating with Nicodemus, putting the knowledge of the Darkhallow in the hands of the Denarians. Would any of them use it?

Oh, I guess Anduriel might have already known it, too. Master of Shadows, and all that...not definitely, but possible.

Unknown if others like the big players (Fae queens, Drakul, Dragons, non-Fallen Archangels, Outsiders) have any knowledge of it, but I'm guessing not.

[Quantus]

There was also a Hag in the Welcome to the Jungle comic that was trying to perform a "mini-darkhallow", so she was at least aware of the underlying mechanics of one.

Why doesn't cowl do the darkhallow thing on a remote island or in the middle of the sahara desert or something...same with hag.  just a question that's been bothering me...
Cause you need people around to fuel the fire.    Had Cowl been successful, his ascension would have exterminated every source of life for several miles--and the more who died, the more elevated he would have become.  Think of them as a big old batch of human sacrifices.
The hag's ritual was a far more primitive version of Kemmler's rite, and wouldn't have done nearly as much for her as the Darkhallow would have for Cowl--but it still would have sparked off massive violence, plague, ill-fortune and general chaos for miles all around.

[Lost Merlin]

For me to use a Dark Hallow again would kind of be a let down.  I understand it is a powerful spell that is also simple that can have huge benefits to the caster, but it feels played out.  Counting the Dark Hallow in Jungle, the one in Dead Beat and the one in Ghost Story another use would make 4.  That's a lot even considering Jim likes to come back to things, (warehouse by the water, Dark Hallow, worn dollar bills)

[Quantus]

What Darkhallow in GS?

[Lost Merlin]

What Corpsetaker did to all of the spirits that Harry brought towards the end.  She/he ate all the spirits to gain their power.  I cannot recall if it was called a Dark Hallow or not, but when I first read it that is what it screamed out to me.

[Quantus]

What Corpsetaker did to all of the spirits that Harry brought towards the end.  She/he ate all the spirits to gain their power.  I cannot recall if it was called a Dark Hallow or not, but when I first read it that is what it screamed out to me.

Ah, fair enough.  It was never referred to as a Darkhallow, but I can definitely see the similarities.  The only differences are very vague and center aroudn the ill-defined question of What Corpsetaker actually /was/ at the end there. Evidence was that she was more than just a typical ghost, more likely a disembodied Spirit/Soul just like Harry. 

[kazimmoinuddin]

My theory is that a BCV or a necromancer will use a version of the dark hollow, to consume most if not all the remaining elders of the BCV. The concentration of the power in the elders could create something very dangerous.

It is said that the BCV were created by the scion of Drakul, Dracula. Drakul is said to be an inhuman abomination trapped in human shape. The ritual was said to be a failure. If the BCV was an attempt to tap into the same power that Drakul does, then a concentration of the BCV energy could be used against or for Drakul.

Drakul is an increadibly powerful entity, in the coming conflict, he would be a powerful ally or enemy. There was a theory he might be an old one or outsider that has been bound in some manner.

[khadgar4606]

old dark hallow is powerful okay but if you want to up the ante you gonna need to pull dark hallow on demon reach thus its hard to pull it off again

[kazimmoinuddin]

Say he summons the spirits for a dark hollow onto demon reach, contain it, then release it at a specific target.

Is it possible to force an Ascension ritual on another, at least an improper one, fill another being with enough unstable power to harm them. We know immortals feed on such power, so is it possible to poison them.
Imagine Harry pouring the power and inmates into a single being. If it did not destroy them, could he use it to bind and trap the bring then!

[Griffyn612]

Elaine Kumori might also know, since she helped Cristos Cowl set it up.

[huangjimmy108]

Ah, fair enough.  It was never referred to as a Darkhallow, but I can definitely see the similarities.  The only differences are very vague and center aroudn the ill-defined question of What Corpsetaker actually /was/ at the end there. Evidence was that she was more than just a typical ghost, more likely a disembodied Spirit/Soul just like Harry.

It is most likely the primitive version of the darkhallow. Remember that in book 7, it is mentioned that Kemmler is famous due to his ability to devour ghost and spirits to empower his magic. It is mentioned that this ability gave Kemmler enough strength to defy the white council. We know this must be before Kemmler casted the darkhallow, because we know Kemmler is thwarted when he try casting it.

As a matter of fact, book 7 also mentioned that the darkhallow is basically devouring a lot of ghosts at once, which is why corpsetaker brings the exibit of native American artifacts to Chicago. The darkhallow devours magic, but because it is based on Necromancy, the magic to control dead things, ghosts and spirits are the medium whereby life and magic are to be devoured, because necromancy grants power over ghosts instead of raw magical power.

[kazimmoinuddin]

The dark hollow ritual is a necromancy based Ascension ritual, a way for a mortal to become immortal. There are likely different Ascension ritual depending on the style of magic, and sources of power. I wonder if demon reach allows for a temporary version of an Ascension ritual, which allow him to channel the power of the inmates.

[huangjimmy108]

The dark hollow ritual is a necromancy based Ascension ritual, a way for a mortal to become immortal. There are likely different Ascension ritual depending on the style of magic, and sources of power. I wonder if demon reach allows for a temporary version of an Ascension ritual, which allow him to channel the power of the inmates.

In Theory, there should be other types of ascention ritual. But there is no mention of say, a fire mage who become a fire god by devouring a volcano or a star. All the mortals who ascended to become immortal, all that we know of anyway,  done it via either the faith rute or the human sacrifice rute, which is closer to the school of necromancy than any other arcane discipline.

I suppose devouring natural elemental energies of the heaven and the earth like you see in Xianxia and Xuanhuan novels is not a viable path of power in the dresdenverse.

[Griffyn612]

In Theory, there should be other types of ascention ritual. But there is no mention of say, a fire mage who become a fire god by devouring a volcano or a star. All the mortals who ascended to become immortal, all that we know of anyway,  done it via either the faith rute or the human sacrifice rute, which is closer to the school of necromancy than any other arcane discipline.

I suppose devouring natural elemental energies of the heaven and the earth like you see in Xianxia and Xuanhuan novels is not a viable path of power in the dresdenverse.

I wouldn't limit the sacrifice category to just "human" sacrifice.  It seems highly likely that gods were sacrificed as well. 

[huangjimmy108]

I wouldn't limit the sacrifice category to just "human" sacrifice.  It seems highly likely that gods were sacrificed as well.

Definitely possible. Immortals stealing bits and pieces of each other's mantle during Halloween is a good indicator that such a thing is possible. The fact that Hecate's power has been split into 6 and become the 6 queens of faeries are another example.

However, as far as we can tell, all those things are done via the power of another immortal. Only a fellow immortal can steal bits of an immortal's mantle during Halloween, and I doubt it is a mortal wizard who split Hecate's mantle into 6 and form the courts of the fae.

Not even Merlin could sacrifice and drain divine entities for power, otherwise he would have done it instead of imprisoning them at Demonreach.

So far, such a feat like sacrificing a god seem to be beyond the scope of human wizardry. Kemmler's ability to devour ghosts is already Heaven defying. for a human mortal, trying to devour a god is like an ant trying to eat an elephant in one bite.