Harry/Marcone Relationship

[raidem]

I've in the past speculated that there is some father son relationship, or paternal lineage, going on, with a temporal spin on things in the mix between Harry and Marcone.  I've further speculated that TT_Harry and/or TT_Murphy are Marcone's parents.  The following is the first interaction in the series between Harry and Marcone and the dialogue drips with fatherly references of some type.  So I've wondered if perhaps Jim has set the stage for a complex time plot whereby someones (Marcone's) origin lies within time travel; someone needs to time travel for him to be born. 

The simplest explanation is that Marcone enjoys using the father persona in dealing with Harry.  And Jim likes describing it that way.
The simple reason without time travel with it being significant is that there is some paternal familial relationship that connects Harry and Marcone.

Stormfront and Dresden Files series begins with Son paying tribute to father.

For Debbie Chester, who taught me everything I really needed to know about writing. And for my father, who taught me everything I really needed to know about living.
I miss you dad.

This is then followed closely by multiple 'father' references during the Harry/Marcone encounter.
SF:

Marcone seemed somewhat put off by my attitude. Maybe I was supposed to be holding my hat in my hand, but I had never really liked Francis Ford Coppola, and I didn't have a Godfather. (I do have a Godmother, and she is, inevitably perhaps, a faery. But that's another story.)

He wrinkled up his face as if carefully considering what he would say, and taking my well-being into account with grandfatherly concern. "How much would it set me back to have you not investigate something?"

"All right, then," he said, smoothly, and as though nothing had happened. "I won't try to force my offer on you, Mister Dresden." The car was slowing down as it approached my building, and Hendricks pulled over in front of it. "But let me offer you some advice?"
He had dropped the father-talking-to-son act, and spoke in a calm and patient voice.

FM:

"Get out of my office," I said. I stepped inside and closed the door.
"Now, now, Mr. Dresden," Marcone said, a father's reproof in his tone. "Is that any way to talk to a business partner?"

...Marcone chuckled. "I think you should hear me out." I looked him in the eyes and smiled faintly. "No. Get out."
His fatherly manner vanished, and his eyes became cold. "I have neither the time nor the tolerance for your childishness, Mr. Dresden.

By now, in just a cursory review of just the first few books, Jim has deliberately depicted Marcone employing a fatherly approach when attempting to persuade Harry to do what he wants. What that exactly means, I'm not sure but it can be the basis of potential foreshadowing and irony depending on how things turn out.

TIDBITS THAT AREN'T NECESSARILY GERMANE.

(click to show/hide)

Comics constantly have Marcone and Harry appearing together.
Bloodline curse in Storm Front aimed at Marcone; Same curse aimed at Harry in Changes.
In a book on bloodline curses, Archive points Harry to Marcone for hint which then leads to Vadderung. (Changes)
DB: Marcone interferes with Harry's fate in fight with CapioCorpus at Boks Books.
Both Harry and marcone have a solid rule about protecting children.

Obviously, I am not Harry Dresden [Irony?].  My name is something I rarely trouble to remember, but for most of my adult life, I have been called John Marcone.  I am a professional monster.
It sounds pretentious.  After all, I'm not a [flesh-devouring ghoul, no vampire, no ogre, no demon, no cursed beast, not a mortal wizard]. But they will never be what I am.  One and all, those beings were born to be what they are. I made a choice.

[long lived changeling who finally chose similar to Sarissa?]

Mirror Mirror Marcone interesting.

Kansas City release party Q&A
I read the short story from Marcone's point of view, Even Hand, and I noticed that John Marcone is not his real name. Is that going to be significant?
Sure is if somebody tries to cast a spell at him using the name John Marcone! That would be a big deal. We'll have to see how that works out. Actually the character that's really interesting is the Mirror Mirror universe Marcone, and we'll get to him in a few books.

Per Priscellie Jim told her at ComicCon:
Hendricks' first name is Nathan

Favorite Restaurant's; Multiple Meanings?

Marcone
2010 Powell's books Q&A off of Youtube @0:30
With Regards to Even Hand
It's from the perspective of John Marcone, and sort of shows you what he's doing behind the scenes.  And if you read the short story and then go and read the story that's in Changes in Burger King, it has two totally different meanings.

Both have a favorite restaurant as can be seen at end of even hand for Marcone, then for Harry in changes. Please analyze the above WOJ and what you conclude from it and the readings of Even Hand and excerpt of Changes.

I'll add to this as I come across additional pertinent information.

[Con]

-_- Harry is clearly the scion of Odin

[Thatguywhocomesaround]

Marcone was a solider in Vietnam? That doesn't sound right. I think WOJ was a Marine, but was it specified it was Vietnam?

[raidem]

From what I recall he was a marine in Vietnam.  Though I might be getting Michael carpenter confused in with the woj.  You definitely remembered correctly that he was a marine.

[Mira]

From what I recall he was a marine in Vietnam.  Though I might be getting Michael carpenter confused in with the woj.  You definitely remembered correctly that he was a marine.

Yeah, it doesn't sound right that Marcone was a marine in Viet Nam...   Does anyone know what his age is?  That would tell us a lot about whether he was or not.. 

[raidem]

@BillyYank Marcone was a Marine.

So that settles it, there isn't an allusion at least in that quote to Vietnam.

This was the last reference to Marcone I could find in WOJ section via search for his name. 

2011 Naperville Signing
You have a big supporting cast of antagonists in the Dresden Files, are there any you prefer writing over others?
...And Marcone is also a favorite.  Being able to write the short story Even Hand from his viewpoint was very enlightening for me.  Because I had never really been entirely certain what his take on Dresden was until I actually got inside his head and started writing him for a while.  He’s the guy that looks at Dresden like, you know, the guy that looks at the drunken Sheriff in town who’s just like “I just want the shootouts to stop.”  It’s like, Come on, yes you keep wining them but COME ON, there’s gotta be a better way that brakes fewer windows.  But at the same time he owns the undertaker shop so… [shrugs and waves his hand in front of them like they are balancing scales].

Now back to establishing lower limit on Marcone's age via Amanda's age.

Amanda's birth via Priscilla's timeline prior to Storm Front
~13-17 BSF: Amanda Beckitt born.  [Age:0] {This needs to be analyzed further it is based largely on description of Amanda as in late teens, early twenties in DM which according to timeline takes place 3 years after Storm Front)

[2-7 years BSF] What I could see was the Beckitt family. Husband, wife, daughter, a little girl maybe ten or eleven years old. [Age: 10-11]

She is "in her late teens or early twenties" in DM which takes place about 3 years after SF. [Age 18-23]

Now for Marcone

@BillyYank Marcone was a Marine. [Age>17 when he entered service]

I'm having some difficulty making some of the facts we know about Marcone mesh particulary regarding his apparent age at time of shootout, service as a marine, temporal proximity to Storm Front, his takeover of Chicago's criminal underworld.

I looked over my shoulder to see a very, very young-looking Marcone.
He wasn't wearing a business suit. He had on jeans and a black leather jacket. His hair was longish, a little mussed, and he also sported a stubble of beard that gave him the kind of rakish look that would attract attention from the girls who fantasized about indulging with a bad boy. [Age:?]

How long was Marcone involved in the years of internal struggle after the Vargassi family dissolved into internal strife?

"Gentleman" Johnny Marcone had been the thug to emerge on top of the pile after the Vargassi family had dissolved into internal strife. The police department saw Marcone as a mixed blessing, after years of merciless struggle and bloody exchanges with the Vargassis.

SF: Marcone's appearance during first Harry/Marcone encounter

Gentleman Johnny Marcone didn't look like the sort of man who would have my legs broken or my jaw wired shut. His salt-and-pepper hair was cut short, and there were lines from sun and smiling etched into the corners of his eyes. His eyes were the green of well-worn dollar bills. He seemed more like a college football coach: good-looking, tanned, athletic, and enthusiastic. The impression was reinforced by the men he kept with him.

Harry's Age

25 BSF, October 31:  Harry is born.  Harry's mother, now Margaret Gwendolyn Dresden, dies in childbirth.  She is murdered by a ritual entropy curse, courtesy of Lord Raith. [Harry's Age SF=25]

Based on time of shootout, estimate of Amanda's birth, Harry's birth, and Marcone involvement in a shootout 2-7BSF at age no earlier than 18, I estimate that Marcone is at least 6-10 years older than Harry.

[jonas]

Merlin to Uther or Arthur, He helped him cement his kingdom, is known/rumored to be in 'cahoots' with him, Marcone literally tried to get him in the advisor role for magics even, both caught up in the Grail quest in ways, ect.

[Mira]

Now for Marcone
Quote

    @BillyYank Marcone was a Marine. [Age>17 when he entered service]

I'm having some difficulty making some of the facts we know about Marcone mesh.
Quote

    I looked over my shoulder to see a very, very young-looking Marcone.
    He wasn't wearing a business suit. He had on jeans and a black leather jacket. His hair was longish, a little mussed, and he also sported a stubble of beard that gave him the kind of rakish look that would attract attention from the girls who fantasized about indulging with a bad boy.

Why? Because he was busy taking over the criminal enterprise in Chicago after that shootout or so I suppose and the shootout wasn't that much earlier than Storm Front.

Age is important to determine whether or not he served in Viet Nam...    The fall of Saigon happened in 1975..  That was forty-two years ago, if Marcone entered the service at 18 and served in Viet Nam, the youngest he could be is 60, most likely he is older if the claim is he saw combat..  I didn't get the impression that Marcone was that much older than Harry, but that is merely an impression,  is there better information out there?   As to entering at age 17, I believe he'd need parental consent to do so, I cannot imagine his crime family parents giving that.. But I could be wrong about that as well.

[raidem]

Oh, sorry.  I already dismissed the Vietnam bit in my post of the WOJ I partly incorrectly recalled.

@BillyYank Marcone was a Marine.
So that settles it, there isn't an allusion at least in that quote to Vietnam.

So, I'm not concerned about the Vietnam piece anymore. I was moving on to establish an age for him. The thing is though if you view/read the comics, the Marcone portrayed there is much older than Harry.

As to entering at age 17, I believe he'd need parental consent to do so, I cannot imagine his crime family parents giving that..

I don't think it's established that he has crime family parents.  We are in the dark as to his parents otherwise I wouldn't even be entertaining this WAG.

[Rasins]

We know MacFinn was in Vietnam.  Don't know about Marcone though.

[Mira]

We know MacFinn was in Vietnam.  Don't know about Marcone though.

Yes, and he was an older guy,  being a Loop may have allowed him to age more slowly like wizards.. Marcone however is a vanilla mortal as far as we know.

[Thatguywhocomesaround]

Well, in regards to Marcone's age - I always liked to think of him at thirty or very early thirties at the start of the series. At least five years or so on Harry.

[Thatguywhocomesaround]

So, it can be pretty easy to figure out.

He could have started his criminal career early, joined the Marines -served his time for the minimum, and Vargrassi war kicked off when he returned or not soon after.

[jonas]

So, it can be pretty easy to figure out.

He could have started his criminal career early, joined the Marines -served his time for the minimum, and Vargrassi war kicked off when he returned or not soon after.

Which it's a stupid way to make a time table but GTA vice city and Marcones 80's Hair support that timeline lol.

[wardenferry419]

In Storm Front, circa 2000, I would put Marcone in his early 40s, That would mean he was born between 1955 and 1960.  Old enough to have served in Vietnam,  barely. Presently, 15+years later, Marcone is around 60, give or take a few years. That is my estimate.