A Fistful of Warlocks (SPOILERS: FISTFUL OF WARLOCKS)

[Anubissama]

Grevane is one of the (non-Cowl) necromancers that Harry faces in Dead Beat.   IIRC, Ramirez shoots him.

Ramirez beheads him. Samurai Master style, the cut doesn't make his head fall off, and Grevane is so crazy at this point that he tries to continue to fight because he believes death can't touch him.

Turn out believe isn't everything in the Dresdenverse.

[jonas]

Ramirez beheads him. Samurai Master style, the cut doesn't make his head fall off, and Grevane is so crazy at this point that he tries to continue to fight because he believes death can't touch him.

Turn out believe isn't everything in the Dresdenverse.

ROFL! I thought he just severed the flesh, not the severed the whole neck?

[Zaphodess]

- It is also odd that an experienced Wizard like Kemmler would leave blood and skin on his bonds when escaping, a quick fire spell to burn the ropes was too much of a hassle? Feels like an obvious trap.

Well, we didn't see what happened next.

I think Dodge City was already a trap to catch a Warden. Kemmler was expecting one, though he said not until a week later or so.

Another interesting thing was that Luccio said the zombies weren't very high quality. This indicates that Grevane was still new in the business of Necromancy. Or that the group felt confident enough to use the incident as a training experience for one of the new recruits.

[Ulfgeir]

- It honestly feels a bit unrealistic that a vanilla sheriff can shoot down a 40+ sized horde of the Undead, especially with Wild West era weapons, those things weren't known for range and precision. Did they had even rifling back then?

Accoding to wikipedia they did. Might not be common though.

/Ulfgeir

[peregrine]

They had rifling in the 1700s.  I can't think of any Wild West era guns that weren't rifled.  Except for shotguns, of course.  Handguns especially were rifled because it's easier to do on a shorter barrel.

[Anubissama]

Another interesting thing was that Luccio said the zombies weren't very high quality. This indicates that Grevane was still new in the business of Necromancy. Or that the group felt confident enough to use the incident as a training experience for one of the new recruits.

First I thought that it was Page (as the new recruit) that is doing the summoning but he is just the drummer. Later in the fight, Grevane redirects some zombies to the roof to attack her,  so he was the summoner.

I guess he wanted to be able to throw some evocation around as well if needed? Since in Dead Beat, he summons full powered Zombies and it takes up to much of his energy that he can only attack with mundane weapons besides that.

They had rifling in the 1700s.  I can't think of any Wild West era guns that weren't rifled.  Except for shotguns, of course.  Handguns especially were rifled because it's easier to do on a shorter barrel.

Okay, still feels unrealistic that a Vanilla Sheriff mowed down a 40+ hoard of zombies, especially when for a good part of it, he was out on the street and the hoard was reportedly approaching from both sides, at some point he should have been surrounded. Feels to nice of an ending simply, no one got hurt, and Luccio has a hot trail to pursue Kemmler (although that one is probably a trap).

This story gives Necromancers a bad rap!

[jonas]

Do we know for sure the sheriff was vanilla and not a trained 'gunslinger' waiting on the dark tower come'th, lol? I've not read it, but simply your description of that event reminded me of a particular scene... and I"ve found when the description fits but the details are changed, amalgamation time! Both from elements within his story and his homages to pretty much every good story ever. Two of my favorites are

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In SmF when Harry gets pissed at what happened to Michael he channels the prince of saiyans for his next energy blast. Unleashing one very similar to Majin Vegeta's vs Buu. Always figured that as an insight to just how wrathful Harry felt in the moment.
And Stan.... poor Stan. He met the same fate as Aliens android, Bishop.

*if you know of a scene adapted to the DF, does that make it a pop culture reference for the list ?

[Anubissama]

He says he is a vanilla mortal. The only supernatural about him is that he is a Venatori, so he knows of the supernatural but is not part of it.

He had some Wards on the cell but either someone else did them for him or they were ritualistic in nature, still, the only thing they did was detect magic use and make a sound, so something probably any Vanilla can do with the right knowledge. He later confirms that he can't do anything against spells aimed at him, so he is just a knowledgeable Vanilla.

Something else I find interesting:

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just as the Thule Society was more or less a long-time foe, using their resources to attempt to use supernatural powers to their own benefit.

Seems odd to me that the White Council allows open opposition to them, even by lightweights. Luccio says that the Thule Gesellschaft has Sorceress in them later on, so they would fall under the authority of the Council. In the supernatural world of politics, aperance is a big thing (even more so than in the vanilla world), allowing some would-be-sorcerers to be in opposition, even if they don't break the Laws feels unrealistic.

[Arjan]

He says he is a vanilla mortal. The only supernatural about him is that he is a Venatori, so he knows of the supernatural but is not part of it.

He had some Wards on the cell but either someone else did them for him or they were ritualistic in nature, still, the only thing they did was detect magic use and make a sound, so something probably any Vanilla can do with the right knowledge. He later confirms that he can't do anything against spells aimed at him, so he is just a knowledgeable Vanilla.

Something else I find interesting:

(click to show/hide)

just as the Thule Society was more or less a long-time foe, using their resources to attempt to use supernatural powers to their own benefit.

Seems odd to me that the White Council allows open opposition to them, even by lightweights. Luccio says that the Thule Gesellschaft has Sorceress in them later on, so they would fall under the authority of the Council. In the supernatural world of politics, aperance is a big thing (even more so than in the vanilla world), allowing some would-be-sorcerers to be in opposition, even if they don't break the Laws feels unrealistic.

It was a secret society so their survival depended on how seriously the white council took them and how good they were at secrecy. The world is a big place and it is not like the white council had a lot of wardens running around, sending only one warden without backup into the unknown is not something a police force would normally do.

The white council is the all powerful omnipresent killer of kids but if you are a reasonably strong warlock and you know what you are doing you can hide from them for decades or even centuries.

[Desden]

Let's look at a similar situation.

Harry walks in and uses his little candle lighting spell to light a bunch of candles.

Then, one gets knocked over.

The place burns down and kill some mortals.

Harry is TECHNICALLY guilty of murder, but there would be no council, or cosmic consequences.

I think  it's more about the letter of the law and the way the magic is applied. If I cast fire on your face I have to believe in it and my right to do so for it to work, and thus I have killed with magic and broken the first rule.
If I cast fire on a candle and then use said candle to burn your bed I have broken no law of magic. I simply lit a candle. The rest was physics.
Moral I'm still guilty. Same as stabing someone through the neck with a sword. But by the law I'm clear

[LordDresden2]

I think  it's more about the letter of the law and the way the magic is applied. If I cast fire on your face I have to believe in it and my right to do so for it to work, and thus I have killed with magic and broken the first rule.
If I cast fire on a candle and then use said candle to burn your bed I have broken no law of magic. I simply lit a candle. The rest was physics.
Moral I'm still guilty. Same as stabing someone through the neck with a sword. But by the law I'm clear

You're safe from the Laws of Magic.  But in that case, it wouldn't shock me a bit if the Wardens sent some anonymous mail to the local mundane authorities, either, if you're weak enough that they could handle you.

If you're too powerful for that, the Council might also decide that the 'grey area' just shrank in your case, too.  I suspect that's one of the reasons there is a grey area.

[Gman]

First impressions after reading it:

I liked it, I prefer a logical and reasonable protagonist, so Luccio's POV was a nice change compared to Dresden. Overall it was as enjoyable as one can expect from a short story, and I hope we will get "For A Few Warlocks More" soon enough.

I'd have liked to see a bit more talk from Kemmler, he seemed like a nice guy.

Now on to observations and problems:

- Anyone else notices that the pentagram the Necromancers were using was of the same design Nicodemus used in "Small Favour"? Is it just coincident? It might be just the go to pentagram for Warlocks, or maybe it is hinting at a connection?

- I see many people have a problem with Luccio considering burning down the place, I don't really agree.

First off it would probably fall under not breaking the Law since once summoned fire is fire, so it would be vanilla arson that killed people not Law braking here.

Besides Luccio had a good take on the Warlocks position (upstairs) and where the rest of the people are (downstairs) so evacuating them and avoiding causalities was possible IMO, also I think it is implied that the Wardens have a certain immunity when fulfilling their duties, they definitely don't get beheaded if a Warlock dies resisting arrest.

- Oh my god! Magical Glasses! I have been saying for years Dresden should get something like that

- It honestly feels a bit unrealistic that a vanilla sheriff can shoot down a 40+ sized horde of the Undead, especially with Wild West era weapons, those things weren't known for range and precision. Did they had even rifling back then?

- While I understand sending the bulk of you forces to the Sherif Office it feels unrealistic that Grevane wouldn't keep a few undead on the roof

- It is also odd that an experienced Wizard like Kemmler would leave blood and skin on his bonds when escaping, a quick fire spell to burn the ropes was too much of a hassle? Feels like an obvious trap.

He was a clued in Sheriff Named Wyatt Earp. A man known for how to shoot and where to hit the target (the head) since he was clued in. He probably had 2 pistols (12 rounds). He probably can shoot rapidly and slowly retreat and reload as the low quality zombies attacked. A decent marksman could shoot 12 rounds in 30 seconds or less and reload both pistols in less than a minute. It's possible.

[peregrine]

I think  it's more about the letter of the law and the way the magic is applied. If I cast fire on your face I have to believe in it and my right to do so for it to work, and thus I have killed with magic and broken the first rule.
If I cast fire on a candle and then use said candle to burn your bed I have broken no law of magic. I simply lit a candle. The rest was physics.
Moral I'm still guilty. Same as stabing someone through the neck with a sword. But by the law I'm clear

If you use a gust of wind to blow someone off a roof, you're guilty under the Law (and tainted metaphysically), even though technically it's the gravity doing the killing.

[Desden]

Exactly. But I'd you use wind to blow sand into someone's eyes causing them the trip off the roof that's fair game

[Aminar]

First I thought that it was Page (as the new recruit) that is doing the summoning but he is just the drummer. Later in the fight, Grevane redirects some zombies to the roof to attack her,  so he was the summoner.

I guess he wanted to be able to throw some evocation around as well if needed? Since in Dead Beat, he summons full powered Zombies and it takes up to much of his energy that he can only attack with mundane weapons besides that.

Okay, still feels unrealistic that a Vanilla Sheriff mowed down a 40+ hoard of zombies, especially when for a good part of it, he was out on the street and the hoard was reportedly approaching from both sides, at some point he should have been surrounded. Feels to nice of an ending simply, no one got hurt, and Luccio has a hot trail to pursue Kemmler (although that one is probably a trap).

This story gives Necromancers a bad rap!

What you're missing is that this is Wyatt Earp. Wyatt Earp.  He's a literal legend. Documentaries are made about him. He's taught about in American schools. Having him be anything other than strictly epic would ruin the cameo and feel off to anyone with enough knowledge of both American History and Alt-history genre savvy. So no, it doesn't give necromancers a bad name. It holds true to the legends of the source material in the same way making Odin terrifyingly powerful does.