Can a Wizard's Powers be Stolen or Taken permanently?

[Tami Seven]

If there was a way to do it you'd think that the White Council would use it often to disarm dangerous magic users.

[groinkick]

If there was a way to do it you'd think that the White Council would use it often to disarm dangerous magic users.

Stealing it would probably corrupt the person doing it.  Other than that I don't think so.  Jim mentioned that you can but it's horrible.   

[ClintACK]

Yes.  A wizard's powers can be stolen.

Evidence: In Grave Peril, the Nightmare eats a part of Harry's spirit.  After that, the Nightmare is able to take corporeal form and cast spells -- and Harry's own magic is noticeably weaker.

Permanently?  Less clear.  But Harry was worried that he might never regain his power if he didn't take it back from Kravos by force, which he does.  However, what we learn later about the way a person's soul regenerates over time and with certain life-affirming experiences... it probably wouldn't have been a permanent loss.

Would the White Council do this?

No.  Not a chance.  It feels like dark magic.  It probably corrupts the one who steals the power -- especially if they're taking the power from someone corrupted or dark.  Anyone who is dangerous enough that they'd consider this technique... should just be beheaded.

[Tami Seven]

Just thought that rendering a person powerless is far more humane than killing them.

[RobReece]

Yes.  A wizard's powers can be stolen.

Evidence: In Grave Peril, the Nightmare eats a part of Harry's spirit.  After that, the Nightmare is able to take corporeal form and cast spells -- and Harry's own magic is noticeably weaker.

Permanently?  Less clear.  But Harry was worried that he might never regain his power if he didn't take it back from Kravos by force, which he does.  However, what we learn later about the way a person's soul regenerates over time and with certain life-affirming experiences... it probably wouldn't have been a permanent loss.

Would the White Council do this?

No.  Not a chance. It feels like dark magic.  It probably corrupts the one who steals the power -- especially if they're taking the power from someone corrupted or dark.  Anyone who is dangerous enough that they'd consider this technique... should just be beheaded.

What if the person doing it was in possession of the Blackstaff?

[phi1601]

Why isn't there a Law against it?

[Mr. Death]

Why isn't there a Law against it?

It probably counts under unwilling transformation, possibly under the mind powers.

Either way, you're basically ripping a piece out of the guy's soul. That's going to be traumatic to both parties. It might well be more humane to kill them after all.

[Griffyn612]

What if the person doing it was in possession of the Blackstaff?

That'd require the Council at large to admit to the existence of the Blackstaff.  It's a secret.

[Rasins]

I don't see why not. 

We know that if a Wizard is sacrificed on the Stone Table that their power is taken and given to one of the courts.

How else it would be done (besides the Kavros method), I don't know.  Though I'm pretty sure that no matter how it's done, if it's permanent, it is permanent because it killed them.  I can't really see a scenario where it wouldn't. 

[Snark Knight]

Just thought that rendering a person powerless is far more humane than killing them.

That's assuming that completely de-powering a rogue practitioner isn't fatal to him or her anyway.

It's not like the people taken by the Fomor are let go again once their abilities have been stolen.

[Mr. Death]

That's assuming that completely de-powering a rogue practitioner isn't fatal to him or her anyway.

It's not like the people taken by the Fomor are let go again once their abilities have been stolen.

Remember that a wizard's power isn't just a tool and a thing they can do. It's not like taking the driver's license away from a drunk, or banning a violent offender from purchasing a weapon.

Magic is part of who and what the wizard is. It's an intrinsic part of them, body, mind and soul. It's their identity, it is synonymous with their self.

Look at the first season of The Legend of Korra. Look at the people who had their bending taken away. That's the sort of thing we're talking about here.

[groinkick]

That'd require the Council at large to admit to the existence of the Blackstaff.  It's a secret.

If so it's a secret that anyone with any kind of importance knows.  Kincaid knew it.  The Red Court knew.  I imagine the Mothers know.  The only ones who don't are probably just the lowly uniformed.

[Smaug with OCD]

I could have sworn I read a WoJ about this very thing in regards to the Fomor a while back, but for the life of me, I can't find it.

As to why it isn't one of the Laws: "Hey, guys, I've got an Idea! Let's tell ALL OF OUR ENEMIES that they can take away our magic! That'll end well...(Sorry, was in kind of a sarcastic mood...)

[peregrine]

As others have said, I would expect it to be under the aegis of the other Laws, which prohibits them from doing so.

Also, if it is possible we don't know how they would do it.  It may be very difficult compared to killing someone.  Possibly prohibitively so.

[groinkick]

My guess is it would fall under necromancy.  The only time we have seen it done is when Harry's magic was stolen, and when he took it back.  So to actually take a wizards magic would probably require someone to leave their own body, consume the magic, and return to their body.  Harry didn't use necromancy but he didn't go after a person either, just a spirit.  To go after a person might require going further into the realm of death which can only happen if necromancy is involved I think.  At least that's how I think it could happen.

If it is possible for one wizard to do it to another wizard it would have to be pretty risk, and dark magic.  If it was easy to do someone like Kemmler would have just targeted wizards to consume their magic.  He would grow greatly in strength, and remove threats to himself all at the same time.  Cowl for example could just target all members of the Senior Council...  It hasn't happened though.  So either not possible for a mortal wizard to do, or highly risky stuff.

The risk would probably be my idea of leaving ones body...  While the spirit is out of the body it is probably at great risk of either being contained, resulting in permanent death, or while outside of the body, the body is defenseless, and open to attack.