King Arthur on DR?

[Rasins]

The Brit seems to be the only one that actually agrees with the Purpose of the Well, that's not hte same thing.  The others seem to LOVE to communicate because without exception they seem to think they might be able to use it to get free.  Which is my point, Any contact at all is potentially a Security Risk, so if you are designing a 5th dimensional Supermax, why risk it?

What the inmates of a Prison think of it's design doesnt really matter...Im sure they'd all vote for short walls made of cheese

I agree with the security risk.  But then again having a Warden that could release them is a security risk too.

I think the Warden would need to communicate with them, if for no other reason than this .... What if the WARDEN has to make a deal with one, to release it, but only if it will do something that the WARDEN believes needs to be done and that prisoner is the only one that can accomplish it?  How can said deal be made if the prisoner cannot agree with it?

[Quantus]

I agree with the security risk.  But then again having a Warden that could release them is a security risk too.

I think the Warden would need to communicate with them, if for no other reason than this .... What if the WARDEN has to make a deal with one, to release it, but only if it will do something that the WARDEN believes needs to be done and that prisoner is the only one that can accomplish it?  How can said deal be made if the prisoner cannot agree with it?

Hmm, reasonable argument (Ive made similar ones in the past theorizing that Time only progresses in the presence of the Warden).  Flip argument:  If the Warden cannot communicate with the entity, will there be enough common ground to form any such bargain?  Im cahnnelingthe old Ender's Game/Speaker for the Dead Hierarchy of Foreignness , fwiw.

[LordDresden2]

The Brit seems to be the only one that actually agrees with the Purpose of the Well, that's not hte same thing.  The others seem to LOVE to communicate because without exception they seem to think they might be able to use it to get free.  Which is my point, Any contact at all is potentially a Security Risk, so if you are designing a 5th dimensional Supermax, why risk it?

Because they may know things you need to know.  It might be necessary cut some kind of deal at some point.  Circumstances can change.  I could easily imagine a Warden (we need some shorthand to distinguish between the Warden and the Wardens) deciding it might be a good idea to offer someone in minimum security parole in exchange for information on how to take down a major threat.

If you've got Shagnasty himself locked away down there, but Kemmler is about to Darkhallow his way to godhood, even Harry might cut Shagnasty loose if it enabled him to neutralize Kemmler.

[Drikonn]

The most important reason Harry needs to be able to communicate with them is so he can make a smart ass Silence of the Lambs joke. Obviously.

[Mbresle]

The Brit seems to be the only one that actually agrees with the Purpose of the Well, that's not hte same thing.  The others seem to LOVE to communicate because without exception they seem to think they might be able to use it to get free.  Which is my point, Any contact at all is potentially a Security Risk, so if you are designing a 5th dimensional Supermax, why risk it?

What the inmates of a Prison think of it's design doesnt really matter...Im sure they'd all vote for short walls made of cheese

On the flip side, communication does not necessarily equal magic or influence.  With Harry running those tunnels for months, anything could have influenced him.  I think instead the crystals allow word/thought communication to pass through to the warden when he (or previous she's) are in close proximity, but nothing even close to the line of magic.  This is why the island still stands instead of having had a massive prison break eons ago from prisoner x using their abilities to shatter prisoner y's crystal.  Now manipulation with truth (a la Changes and Mab) is another story.

[Rasins]

Hmm, reasonable argument (Ive made similar ones in the past theorizing that Time only progresses in the presence of the Warden).  Flip argument:  If the Warden cannot communicate with the entity, will there be enough common ground to form any such bargain?  Im cahnnelingthe old Ender's Game/Speaker for the Dead Hierarchy of Foreignness , fwiw.

If the WARDEN cannot communicate, they can't make a bargain.

[Quantus]

If the WARDEN cannot communicate, they can't make a bargain.

ya, we covered that.  The questions are a) whether Bargaining with them is anything less than a terrible Idea, and b)Whether it might be a reasonable Protective security measure to require that any beings that want to Communicate with the Warden to be capable of it themselves (as opposed to having all these advanced translations subroutines to facilitate it).

[groinkick]

ya, we covered that.  The questions are a) whether Bargaining with them is anything less than a terrible Idea, and b)Whether it might be a reasonable Protective security measure to require that any beings that want to Communicate with the Warden to be capable of it themselves (as opposed to having all these advanced translations subroutines to facilitate it).

That's like saying Hades shouldn't be allowed to speak with the spirits he holds because of security concerns...  He's freaking Hades.  Well whomever made that Island was very powerful, and very smart.  That was the original Warden, and it appears that any Warden is held to the same regard, so it's not a surprise that communication is possible.

[isoycrazy]

If an ancient deity atoned and realized the errors of its ways, saw the Light of Redemption and Atonement, binding them would be unjust.

Of course, I doubt many, if any, of these beings (save the British Prisoner) has the humility to admit, "I was wrong.  Please forgive me."  You would likely find Lucifer bowing his head and asking Dad to come home.

[LordDresden2]

If an ancient deity atoned and realized the errors of its ways, saw the Light of Redemption and Atonement, binding them would be unjust.

Maybe, but I don't think Demonreach is exactly about Justice or Mercy.  It may be more oriented toward Necessity.

[isoycrazy]

Maybe, but I don't think Demonreach is exactly about Justice or Mercy.  It may be more oriented toward Necessity.

Demonreach is motivated by Necessity.  The Warden, however, as he has pardoning capabilities, seems to be given leeway for compassion and understanding.  Deamonreach simply would understand, "Being X is designated to be dangerous by a previous Warden.  I contained it.  Now Warden Dresden has designated entity safe for removal.  I will release it."

[Quantus]

Demonreach is motivated by Necessity.  The Warden, however, as he has pardoning capabilities, seems to be given leeway for compassion and understanding.  Deamonreach simply would understand, "Being X is designated to be dangerous by a previous Warden.  I contained it.  Now Warden Dresden has designated entity safe for removal.  I will release it."

Always possibly, but that feels like applying a moral hope to what might simply be functional necessary, maybe a relief valve on the prison system.  Or to leave the Warden the possibility of Weaponizing the inmates, as has been mentioned in the books. 

[groinkick]

Now Warden Dresden has designated entity safe for removal.  I will release it."

Designating an entity safe?  lol how would Harry go about that decision?  If Harry releases something it will be because he has no more options.  I doubt even Harry would release something just because it appeared to be nice now. Unless it provided him with some sort of evidence that he could verify that it was wrongly locked up I don't see Harry ever believing that an inmate has changed it's ways.

[isoycrazy]

Designating an entity safe?  lol how would Harry go about that decision?  If Harry releases something it will be because he has no more options.  I doubt even Harry would release something just because it appeared to be nice now. Unless it provided him with some sort of evidence that he could verify that it was wrongly locked up I don't see Harry ever believing that an inmate has changed it's ways.

I never said how Harry would identify the being as safe or reformed. Simply that he has the capability to make such an assertion and Demon reach wood adhere to his request for release.

[Quantus]

I never said how Harry would identify the being as safe or reformed. Simply that he has the capability to make such an assertion and Demon reach wood adhere to his request for release.

But that's not really a separate ability or function, it's just a hope/assumption of an existing function's use.  The Warden is entrusted with the decision to imprison and/or release an inmate, full stop.  It would be /nice/ if he were given the time and inclination to somehow Reform and Release inmates, but I dont know that we can assume there are going to be extraneous functions and/or granted abilities to facilitate that.  At the end of the day, those are functions that would make this Prison of the Immortal Damned slightly more morally or aesthetically palatable, but they dont really Contribute to its core Purpose.