He Couldn't Lose [SG Spoilers]

[kazimmoinuddin]

 There was a WOG about athames, but i cant remember it.

[Quantus]

What about Mother Winters deal she gave to Harry that can undo any magic?  I bet that could undo a Mantle..  Anyways why would it mess up conservation of energy?  Destroying a Mantle would just be dispersing the energy to a form that wasn't a Mantle...  Think of a jar filled with water.  If you break the jar the water isn't destroyed.  It's just not in the container anymore.

The way I see it, the Host IS the jar.  What you describe is, to me, more like that high school experiment where you split water into Hydrogen and Oxygen, a bit more fundamentally changing. 

[Quantus]

Not everything is a mantle. There's no reason to suspect dragons are.

Given the Cosmic nature of Dragons, I'd be quite suprised if they are not in fact mantles.  Especially, given the WOJ that each Eldest of a given race is a mantle (in Fae at least).  And given that they CREATED an entire servator race of the lesser dragons, if Dragon's aren't Mantles, then they are probably far and away the most Powerful thing kicking around that isnt. 

Didnt michael kill a dragon with his sword? That might mean it is a mantle killer item.

No it doesnt.  Harry has killed two mantled Immortal's so far, and has yet to Destroy a Mantle.  For all we know that dragon's Mantle is sitting in a Dragon Egg somewhere waiting to be Reborn, or got even distributed to the two surviving Dragons.  Or something.  We only know how the Fae Queen's mantles are passed, and they are unique enough overall that I dont think they are going to be the best example of "typical" mantle behavior. 

[Eldest Gruff]

Given the Cosmic nature of Dragons, I'd be quite suprised if they are not in fact mantles.  Especially, given the WOJ that each Eldest of a given race is a mantle (in Fae at least).  And given that they CREATED an entire servator race of the lesser dragons, if Dragon's aren't Mantles, then they are probably far and away the most Powerful thing kicking around that isnt. 

Not necessarily, Archangels have cosmic levels of power as well but they aren't mantle wielders. They too have underlings of lesser versions of themselves. Granted they didn't create them themselves but still.

[Mr. Death]

Given the Cosmic nature of Dragons, I'd be quite suprised if they are not in fact mantles.  Especially, given the WOJ that each Eldest of a given race is a mantle (in Fae at least).  And given that they CREATED an entire servator race of the lesser dragons, if Dragon's aren't Mantles, then they are probably far and away the most Powerful thing kicking around that isnt.

Mantles have to go somewhere. It's WOJ that there are far fewer big D Dragons around than there used to be. If they were mantles, this wouldn't be the case -- the mantles would have gone to a suitable host (those little d dragons, perhaps).

[Quantus]

Not necessarily, Archangels have cosmic levels of power as well but they aren't mantle wielders. They too have underlings of lesser versions of themselves. Granted they didn't create them themselves but still.

I submit that we dont really know /what/ angels are, beyond that they are uniquely made of pure soul.  For all we know all mantles are just the discarded Grace of now fallen angels. 

Actually, now that I say it, that would make a certain amount of sense; if "power has purpose" because it was the Purpose of an angel that is no longer performing, and so the entire current system is built of substitutes grown from the mortal population, empowered with the cast-off Purposes...

Mantles have to go somewhere. It's WOJ that there are far fewer big D Dragons around than there used to be. If they were mantles, this wouldn't be the case -- the mantles would have gone to a suitable host (those little d dragons, perhaps).

Two, in fact.  A recent one said their were three before Michael did his St. George impression, and only Ferrovax and Pyrovax(sp?) are left

[Eldest Gruff]

I submit that we dont really know /what/ angels are, beyond that they are uniquely made of pure soul.  For all we know all mantles are just the discarded Grace of now fallen angels. 

Actually, now that I say it, that would make a certain amount of sense; if "power has purpose" because it was the Purpose of an angel that is no longer performing, and so the entire current system is built of substitutes grown from the mortal population, empowered with the cast-off Purposes...

Which sorta gives automatic deference to the idea TWG is and was the be all, end all since everything began. Something that is very much in doubt as it pertains to Power, Purpose and life in general in the DV.

[Phariah]

I dunno. I do not look at Dragons the same as gods or powerful fae. they seem to be more a force of nature imho. no mantle just power much as angels are just souls.

[UncommonSense]

Yes, but in Changes Odin was using his Spear (presumably Odin's mythic spear Gungnir) /as/ a wizards staff.  It would appeal to me for harry to mount the spear of destiny on his staff, giving an upgrade to both.  Its always been the point and not the shaft that was important in the histories, but if the shaft were an enchanted Wizards staff (especially the muiltpurpose, layered version he had in SG) it could be all kinds of fun.   

Yeah, but an imposing guy walking around with a large stick, is a cosplay enthusiast.  An imposing guy walking around with a large spear will attract police attention.

[Quantus]

Yeah, but an imposing guy walking around with a large stick, is a cosplay enthusiast.  An imposing guy walking around with a large spear will attract police attention.

In the sage words of Michael Carpenter:  "[Harry] destroys buildings, Fights monsters openly in the streets of the city, works with the police, shows up in newspapers, advertises in the phone book, and rides Dinosaurs down Michigan Avenue, and [you] think that [he] works in the shadows?  Be reasonable."

 

[Phariah]

In the sage words of Michael Carpenter:  "[Harry] destroy buildings, Fight monsters openly in the streets of the city, work with the police, show up in newspapers, advertise in the phone book, and ride Dinosaurs down Michigan Avenue, and [you] think that [he] works in the shadows?  Be reasonable."

 

I still get chuckles from SG when I read Murphy telling Harry she wouldn't mind him burning down the warehouse when she first sees it. lol 

[Quantus]

I still get chuckles from SG when I read Murphy telling Harry she wouldn't mind him burning down the warehouse when she first sees it. lol 

Lol, ya.  Right along with Butters asking Harry if he coudl swing Sue by his boss's car...

[isoycrazy]

Mantles have to go somewhere. It's WOJ that there are far fewer big D Dragons around than there used to be. If they were mantles, this wouldn't be the case -- the mantles would have gone to a suitable host (those little d dragons, perhaps).

What if the mantle is back in Ferrovax or the other dragon?  They are just holding the power in themselves, hording the power, but still doing their duty.

[Mr. Death]

What if the mantle is back in Ferrovax or the other dragon?  They are just holding the power in themselves, hording the power, but still doing their duty.

I believe Jim has a quote out there somewhere about a body only being able to contain so much. If Big-Ds were a mantle, they'd be enormously powerful, so I don't see any body containing more than one for any length of time.

I'm only going to consider anything a mantle when the books say or imply they are. Just because it's the Big New Word as of Cold Days doesn't mean everything has to be shoehorned into it.

[canpinter]

the knife could simply drain the mantle into itself, seal the power away thus destroying it for all practical purposes