I am dissatisfied with 'Focused Practitioners', particularly Mortimer (spoilers)

[Melendwyr]

I suspect that comes from a misguided attempt to emulate the novels, actually.

[grits teeth]

That is the point of this roleplaying game.  If I were not interested in emulating the novels, I'd have no reason to adopt and learn yet another RPG rules system.

[Sanctaphrax]

I disagree, for the record, but I don't think this is a good place for that discussion.

Regardless, if your novel-emulation gives you bad rules then you did it wrong. There's no reason why you can't have both good rules and a novel-like game.

[Melendwyr]

Precisely.  Which is why I'm trying to figure out the rules-changes necessary to permit this system to represent characters like Mortimer.  I don't see the point of your comment.

[Haru]

Precisely.  Which is why I'm trying to figure out the rules-changes necessary to permit this system to represent characters like Mortimer.  I don't see the point of your comment.

The problem is, that you only claim that a character like Mort isn't possible, but other than that, you don't have any examples on where the rules clash with your vision of how Mort should look like in the rpg. There have been a dozen and a half versions of Mort on this board, I think, so it is obviously possible to put him into numbers, so please understand that your argument is quite confusing.

[Melendwyr]

The problem is, that you only claim that a character like Mort isn't possible, but other than that, you don't have any examples on where the rules clash with your vision of how Mort should look like in the rpg.

I've already given examples.  Early-books Mort is barely seen, and so easily fits inside the rules.  The Mort we see in Ghost Story is another matter entirely, and he has considerable powers despite not fitting the mold provided for Focused Practitioners.  The rules provided don't permit characters like Mort to exist.

[Haru]

That Mort didn't exist when the RPG was written. And he can easily be modeled by giving him "Mimic Abilities" coupled with "Human Form" (to limit the use of powers to times when he is linked with a ghost) and a list of ghosts he might have access to.

[Melendwyr]

That Mort didn't exist when the RPG was written.

  As I mentioned in the very first post.  Nevertheless, the fact that the novels have expanded our understanding of the Dresdenverse means that the RPG is no longer adequate for producing the 'feeling' of the novel's setting.

And he can easily be modeled by giving him "Mimic Abilities" coupled with "Human Form" (to limit the use of powers to times when he is linked with a ghost) and a list of ghosts he might have access to.

  That might be an adequate representation of a single power; he has others not readily represented by the rules.

[Taran]

You could give him Ghost Speaker?  Then he can do 'at will' what a normal wizard can only do with the time and effort of a Ritual.

[Haru]

he has others not readily represented by the rules.

What powers are you referring to? I've yet to run into a power that was impossible to model with the system, one way or the other. I kind of get the impression you want to dislike the system. Which is fine, but if that's the case, please tell me, so I can stop bothering to try to give you a solution.

If you want help getting a sheet for Mort that matches what you have in mind, I need to know what exactly is on your mind. Otherwise, there's really not much I - or anyone - can help you with.

[Melendwyr]

You could give him Ghost Speaker?  Then he can do 'at will' what a normal wizard can only do with the time and effort of a Ritual.

  Certainly I think that's required - he seems able to see and converse with ghosts without expending effort of any kind.  It would probably also explain how he's been able to develop his spellcasting without having any (other) magical senses.  As Harry has pointed out previously, anyone could learn to do magic - but without the ability to sense its flows, it's like the blind learning to paint.

He doesn't seem to use any focus items at all.  Yet he's clearly capable of pumping power into a rapid ritual - and of conducting that ritual without physical aids, not even a physical circle.  Harry isn't skilled enough to simply imagine the circle and let that be enough.

The suggestion to adapt Sponsored Spellcasting, removing the need to have a particular sponsor, isn't a terrible one.  It's a bit of an awkward kludge, but it would at least provide a rules basis for Mortimer managing ritual effects "with the speed of evocation".  Fast enough to manage some simple effects within combat, in fact.

[Sanctaphrax]

You really should look at the canon character stat thread on the Resources board.

I don't see the point of your comment.

Which comment?

[toturi]

But it's different when it comes to active use of a skill. You can be an elite soldier with high athletics, but that doesn't mean you can do a backflip, or navigate a laser grid with your nimble cheerleading skills. You might have another way to use the skill, but you'll describe it differently. And that's exactly my point. I don't want to prohibit people from using their skills, I want them to use their skills in a way their character would actually do.

For example, I had a player with a wizard that was specialized in plant based thaumaturgy. But when it came to creating a trap for someone, he started talking blastwaves and explosions, etc. I stopped him and reminded him of what his character is actually about, and he switched that up and it became a vine trap instead. Mechanically, it was pretty much the same, Fate doesn't have many different actions, after all, but it felt a whole lot different, once the spell was cast.

I disagree. All of the trappings of the skill are available to the character. If some of the trappings are to be made unavailable to the character via their Aspects, then it is/they are a Compel/s.

[Haru]

I disagree. All of the trappings of the skill are available to the character. If some of the trappings are to be made unavailable to the character via their Aspects, then it is/they are a Compel/s.

I'm not talking about trappings, I'm talking about how those trappings are used. Michael and Charity both have high craftsmanship skills. Michael is a carpenter, but he doesn't know how to work with metal, that's why Charity builds and repairs his armor. But Charity is no carpenter, so it's up to Michael to do anything related to that. Yet both of them are using craftsmanship with all its trappings. If Michael's player started to say he is now building something complicated out of metal, I would remind him of who his character can do, and he would be able to solve his problem with craftsmanship, just as he had planned, but in a carpenter way instead.

[JGray]

I am curious. Wouldn't a simple house rule to the Refinement power, allowing focused practitioners to buy specialties for their chosen field, fix any issue with modeling Mortimer as portrayed in later books?

[PirateJack]

Not really, because specialisations require more than one element to give you more than a +2 in anything (+1 power/+2 control in Ectomancy, for instance).