Advancement question.

[Cadd]

I've been thinking a bit about the advancement rules, specifically the Minor Milestone option of swapping Stunts.

Is it possible (i.e. by RAW allowed) to simply drop a stunt?

One of my players have picked Listening as a stunt, to represent a magical sharpening of senses that's available to her, even if she is still unaware of her actual magical abilities. When she starts to gain control of her magic, I feel that the effect should be fairly simple to replicate magically, albeit not as fast. She might then feel like she would want to drop the stunt to recover some refresh (to be able to invest it in the magic instead). Is this OK, ruleswise?

[Taran]

Is it o.k with you?  I think it's fine to drop powers or stunts any time as long as it makes sense.  I don't recall there being anyplace that it says you can or can't do that.  So as long as the GM is o.k with it, I don't see why not.

[Vairelome]

In general, if you want to do refresh-switching, that's what Modular Abilities is for.  Frequent switching of stunts and/or powers is tremendously powerful due to massive flexibility, so you have to pay a -2 refresh surcharge to do so.

That said, one-off switching is something I'd be ok with, so long as it was appropriately rare and justified by the character.  This case, where a player is taking a stunt as a "precursor power," is in my opinion one of the best situations to justify switching.  She should make sure the table and the GM were ok with it, but I would support her case while noting that this was not an open invitation to edit your refresh list between sessions.

[Taran]

having modular abilities and swapping out stunts at Milestones are two completely different things.  I'm not really sure you can compare. 

Modular abilites lets you switch out, on the spot - every exchange - if need be. 

Changing a stunt at a milestone doesn't have the same weight at all.

this was not an open invitation to edit your refresh list between sessions.

It's already in the rules that you can do exactly that.

YS:88

Minor Milestone
Minor milestones usually occur at the end of a
session of play, or whenever one significant piece
of a story is resolved. A minor milestone allows
the characters to evolve in response to the story
that’s been unfolding before them.
When a minor milestone occurs, you may
choose one of the following:
- Switch the rank values of any two skills,
or replace one Average skill with one that
isn’t on your sheet.
- - Change any single stunt for another stunt.
- Purchse stunts or powers, provided you have the refresh to do so.
- Rename one aspect

[GryMor]

I've been thinking a bit about the advancement rules, specifically the Minor Milestone option of swapping Stunts.

Is it possible (i.e. by RAW allowed) to simply drop a stunt?

You can't drop a stunt as part of a Minor Milestone, but as part of spending refresh on powers, some of the refresh can come from powers that are/were precursors to the purchased power. The canonical examples include the casting powers. In this particular case, I'd recommend Channeling (air?) or Evocation eat the stunt when the character picks up the power the subsumes it.

[Vairelome]

having modular abilities and swapping out stunts at Milestones are two completely different things.  I'm not really sure you can compare. 

Modular abilites lets you switch out, on the spot - every exchange - if need be. 

Changing a stunt at a milestone doesn't have the same weight at all.

It's already in the rules that you can do exactly that.
YS:88

Fair enough, but 1) the rule you quote limits to one stunt substitution per Minor Milestone, not open rewrite, and 2) it doesn't really apply to this case, because the player wants to cash in a stunt plus some refresh to buy a power.  As I said, I think this is perfectly fair in this case, and I'd support it, but it does fall into the grey area between the Minor Milestone stunt replacement and Modular Abilities.

[Lavecki121]

Fair enough, but 1) the rule you quote limits to one stunt substitution per Minor Milestone, not open rewrite, and 2) it doesn't really apply to this case, because the player wants to cash in a stunt plus some refresh to buy a power.  As I said, I think this is perfectly fair in this case, and I'd support it, but it does fall into the grey area between the Minor Milestone stunt replacement and Modular Abilities.

I don't think it does. Like at all. Modular abilities is way more flexible than buying out a stunt with the purchase of a power at a milestone.

[Taran]

Modular abilities that only lets you swap out your stunts/powers once per session or milestone probably wouldn't be worth a 2 point surcharge, obviously.

That aside, as I mentionned above, as long as it makes sense to the story and the character.

I played a character with 5 refresh worth of True Faith Powers and after a while I wanted to try something new and different.  I asked my GM if I could trade them all out for Soul-Fire.  With his consent, we played the story through to the next major milestone where an in-story event made the power swap beleivable.

[Tedronai]

Modular abilities that only allowed swapping at milestones wouldn't be worth ANY surcharge.  Or the loss of the Pure Mortal bonus (though any powers bought with it would be).  Or even a dedicated aspect (though, as always, the new stunts/powers would have to fit with the character as represented by their aspects).

[Vairelome]

I don't think it does. Like at all. Modular abilities is way more flexible than buying out a stunt with the purchase of a power at a milestone.

I don't see where I wrote anything that could reasonably be construed differently.

The RAW do not have a particular rule that governs the OP's case.  The rules that are listed are 1) you may switch out one stunt at a Minor Milestone, and 2) Modular Abilities, where you pay a -2 refresh surcharge to change out a variable number of powers on the fly.  What the player wants to do in this case is somewhat more than 1) and significantly less than 2), so I think it's ok, given the character's circumstances.

I played a character with 5 refresh worth of True Faith Powers and after a while I wanted to try something new and different.  I asked my GM if I could trade them all out for Soul-Fire.  With his consent, we played the story through to the next major milestone where an in-story event made the power swap beleivable.

This is somewhat farther along the spectrum than the OP's case, but since it's a one-time swap, character-justified, and happened at a major milestone, I'd agree that it was reasonable.  I don't think it should be a common occurrence, since frequent switching isn't good for a consistent character concept (unless that's a particular character's bag, in which case Modular Abilities was written with that character concept in mind).

[Lavecki121]

I don't see where I wrote anything that could reasonably be construed differently.

You said:

In general, if you want to do refresh-switching, that's what Modular Abilities is for.  Frequent switching of stunts and/or powers is tremendously powerful due to massive flexibility, so you have to pay a -2 refresh surcharge to do so.

Which is completly different than switching out stunts and exchanging them for powers durring a milestone. I dont think it should be done all that often, however there is no rule about switching powers in the RAW so once you have purchased a power you are pretty much stuck with it.

[Vairelome]

Which is completly different than switching out stunts and exchanging them for powers durring a milestone.

Of course it is.  That's because there is no rule in the book that covers switching stunts for powers during a milestone.  Since there is no rule covering the specific situation, you can look for rules covering similar situations and see what would be most reasonable.  In this case, there are two rules that cover related situations: one stunt-switch at a Minor Milestone and Modular Abilities.  I'm not going to do the further analysis again.  See above.

I dont think it should be done all that often, however there is no rule about switching powers in the RAW so once you have purchased a power you are pretty much stuck with it.

Modular Abilities is exactly a "rule about switching powers in the RAW."  That's why it's relevant.

[Haru]

I'd say dropping a stunt should be fine any time if you are unsatisfied with it. If you had one idea for a character and you took a stunt for it, but it just doesn't come up, because the game is going in a whole different direction, but there isn't another stunt you'd need or want for that, just drop the stunt and be done. I wouldn't even wait for a milestone, just drop it then and there.

Losing a stunt could also be part of a concession, losing your memory, that sort of thing.

In the end, it comes down to what you are comfortable with as a group.

[Taran]

Yup

[Mr. Death]

Yeah, dropping a stunt is fine. I've had players drop stunts between games either because they got a power, or because it turned out they just never had the opportunity to use it.

Hell, I think the game mentions dropping stunts for powers as an option at some point, but I can't remember where.