Force of Will

[Dr.FunLove]

Quick question that I wanted to throw out to the community - the bindings of will used by beings such as Odin and Mother Winter: how to model it? Magic block? Conviction-block? Thoughts, ideas, insanity?

Thanks!

[Hick Jr]

Incite Effect (Divine Will), using Conviction as the governing skill. Mother Winter's conviction is probably something in the low teens, so Harry had to drop a few fate points on the evocation that shattered it.

[Dr.FunLove]

Also, he had to jack it up with soulfire. Recently re-read that scene...I really do like the Mother's. I digress.

This effect seems to be raw willpower. I'm personally inclined to model it as using Conviction like a block. Only the will and a little know-how required. Having a lot of will helps, such as in Odin's or Mother Winter's case. But other powerful willed individuals should be able to pull it off just the same, ya?

[Hick Jr]

Quite true. Harry describes it as magic like evocation having a "seed" of will, encased in magic. How powerful you are (Conviction score, specializations) determines how much magic you can draw around the seed.

Whereas Mother Winter's bindings were just pure seed, with no ambient magic required. I'd put her Conviction at 13 and call it a block.

[Dr.FunLove]

It's probably more...MORE! I reckon she was holding Harry with the mental equivalent of a pinky. Big scary Fae!

Glad I'm not off base - it's something that I feel will be coming up in the near future and I wanted to take the pulse on this issue.

[Sanctaphrax]

You can't use Conviction to paralyse someone unless you have an appropriate Power or Stunt. The skill just doesn't work that way.

[Lavecki121]

I believe the power was suggested to be incite effect

[Sanctaphrax]

Yeah, but Dr Funlove was saying that he figured anyone with a powerful will could do it.

[Dr.FunLove]

Appreciate the feedback - I wouldn't think a Stunt would be all that appropriate either. In the case of practitioners, would you bundle that in with their other magical prowess or force them to take an additional power (whatever you want to call it ultimately).

[Sanctaphrax]

You could paralyse someone with a Spirit evocation, but if a caster wants to do it without casting a spell (and taking stress) they have to take another Power.

Incidentally, I don't think it would unbalance anything if you added a Raw Will trapping to the Conviction skill. The balance between skills is loose enough to allow that sort of thing.

[Deadmanwalking]

A -1 Power that lets you grapple with Conviction, without the need for an invoked Aspect, sounds right. I mean, there's already a Stunt for Blocking, but Grappling is different (and much more like what the power does) and sounds good for this.

[Dr.FunLove]

@Sanctaphrax
You would then be utilizing the trapping to create such will-constructs or as the basis for such a Power to utilize Conviction to pull off the will-constructs?

@Deadmanwalking
-1 seems fair for a Power that would perform that...the heavy lifting in terms of cost would come from buying up Conviction in this case.

[Sanctaphrax]

You'd use the trapping for maneuvers and blocks that express the pressure your will puts on people.

You can grapple with Incite Effect if you buy the appropriate upgrade, incidentally.

A -1 Power that lets you grapple with Conviction, without the need for an invoked Aspect, sounds right. I mean, there's already a Stunt for Blocking, but Grappling is different (and much more like what the power does) and sounds good for this.

Nah, you should still need the Aspect invoke. Removing that requirement is pretty similar to granting an extra action, and shouldn't be that easy.

Also, said grapples shouldn't have any range. Because basic Might grapples don't, and for 1 Refresh you can't do much more transplant trappings.

Would probably be fair to let people inflict mental stress, though, which is actually kind of a big deal sometimes.

[Dr.FunLove]

@Sanctaphrax
Interesting...I like the trapping. I feel that it's thematically genesis of what the power in question is based on while leaving it open for anyone to utilize meaningfully (if they have the Conviction to do it).

Incite Effect is a custom power, ya? I did a cursory search for it but didn't find it. Mind referencing it?

#Will grapple/block
Is it a grapple we've seen per the books or a grapple? I'd imagine it's more of a block because it can be used at range. Right?

[Sanctaphrax]

Could be a block or a grapple. Ought to work either way.

(click to show/hide)

INCITE EFFECT [-1]
Description: You can do a thing. A special thing, that cannot be done by most people. Maybe you can control clouds of smoke, maybe you can inflict fear by shouting. Or maybe you can summon the aid of two thousand invisible squirrels. Whatever.
Skills Affected: Any.
Effects:
Incite Effect. Pick a type of effect and a skill that's related to that type of effect. You can use that skill plus two to perform maneuvers and blocks related to that type of effect against anything you can touch. At the GM's discretion, this may also enable Declarations.
At Range [-1]. You may use Incite Effect on anything within your line of sight.
Incite Limited Effect [+1]. (Requires At Range) Do not add two to your skill when using Incite Effect. This upgrade is not compatible with Incite Physical Effect or Incite Mental Effect.
Incite Physical Effect [-1]. You may use Incite Effect to perform attacks that inflict physical stress. These attacks have a weapon rating of 2. They use the same skill as your maneuvers and blocks, but without the +2 bonus. If you have the At Range upgrade, then targets must use their Endurance to defend against these attacks. If you do not have the At Range upgrade, then targets may use whatever skill they would use against ordinary Fists attacks instead.
Incite Avoidable Physical Effect [-0]. (Requires Incite Physical Effect At Range) The targets of your Incite Physical Effect attacks defend with Athletics.
Incite Mental Effect [-1]. You may use Incite Effect to perform attacks that inflict mental stress. These attacks have a weapon rating of 2. They use the same skill as your maneuvers and blocks, but without the +2 bonus. If you have the At Range upgrade, then targets must use their Discipline to defend against these attacks. If you do not have the At Range upgrade, then targets may use whatever skill they would use against ordinary Fists attacks instead. This upgrade does not allow mind control; characters taken out with it are generally overwhelmed with emotion or driven insane.
Incite Potent Effect [-1]. (Requires Incite Physical Effect or Incite Mental Effect) Attacks that you make with Incite Effect are weapon 4.
Incite Protective Effect [-1]. You may use your the skill that you use for Incite Effect to defend against physical attacks.
Incite Restrictive Effect [-1]. (Requires Incite Physical Effect or Incite Mental Effect) You may use Incite Effect to grapple targets within the range of this Power, using the skill that you use for Incite Effect. Grappling with a physical effect inflicts physical stress, while grappling with a mental effect inflicts mental stress.
Incite Mass Effect [-1]. (Requires Incite Physical Effect or Incite Mental Effect) You may make spray attacks and zone-wide attacks with Incite Effect. If you attack your own zone, then you are affected normally by the attack. Even if you lack the At Range upgrade, targets defend against your zone attacks as though you had it. This upgrade does not affect your ability to maneuver, and no penalty is incurred when attacking a zone with it.
Incite Explosive Effect [+1]. (Requires Incite Mass Effect) You may not make non-zone-wide attacks with Incite Effect.
Incite Selective Effect [-1]. (Requires Incite Mass Effect) You do not harm yourself when attacking your own zone.
Incite Persistent Effect [-1]. (Requires Incite Mass Effect) When attacking a zone with Incite Effect, you may take an accuracy penalty (before rolling) in order to extend the duration of the attack. For each point of accuracy sacrificed this way, the attack is reapplied at the beginning of another exchange. You may take actions to extend this effect as though you were an evoker extending an evocation.
Incite Additional Effect [-1]. You may select another effect to create with this Power. You may also select another skill to use that effect with. If the other upgrades that you have are appropriate for the new effect, you may use them with it. You may also upgrade the new effect separately.