Has Mab become something more? [CD Spoilers]

[BlahBlah]

I like to think of the Dresdenverse soul as source of light.  A typical mortal's soul shines bright, and is the shape of their body, for lack of a better form.

Like Bob has described, mortals swap bits of their soul's constantly. When they hug, emote, get jiggy, or whatever else brings them close.

I think for beings like Mab, who started out with a mortal soul, their soul slowly fades over time.  Maybe not in size, but in brightness.  Like a light fading.  Eventually, like Butcher describes it, it can seem to completely dissipate, where its no longer there.

I think in Mab's case, and most of the Fae, they still retain their soul initially, but it fades.  But I think there's still enough there to interact with other souls around them.

In this case, Mab has had regular interaction with Sarissa for years, and I'm sure on some level, they've either shared or reflected each other's souls.  Mab has also had more contact with the mortal world through Harry, who we all know is big on soul.  And she's now bonded to Harry through the WK mantle ceremony, and the mantle itself.

So the idea that any remnant soul hasn't been affected by those around her seems unlikely.  It seems more likely that whatever soul she has left has been influenced by Sarissa, Harry, and any other mortals.  And since Sarissa and Harry both seem to be big softies, I'd say that's had a softening affect on Mab.

I don't know that she's gotten her soul 'back', so much as what she had left has been slightly rekindled by her relations with mortals.  I don't think she's going soft and fuzzy on us any time soon, but I'd say it allows her enough to remember the feelings she might once have had.  The light of her soul might still be dim, but it might be brighter than before.

A wonderful theory.  It is also consistent with Odin's conversation with Harry at the bar.  Odin hints that Mantles do not necessarily change their owner, and recommends friendship and spending time outside of Arctis Tor.  I was always a little puzzled by this conversation; it seemed tangent to the discussion about Mantles and DR.  But if friends and human interaction are essential to preserving your soul, then Odin is essentially saying that Harry needs plenty of both.

Note too, how Mab takes Molly to her apartment instead of Arctis Tor after Harry forces her promise on DR. 

[Arjan]

I see the letter opener as a spanking, really.

A bit rough for my taste.

Harry got the message loud and clear.
slade was made an example of.

Sure, Mab does not do evil for the sake of some abstract absolute evil. Making an example of someone can be quite effective but it can be seen as an evil act.

Am I arguing in favor of absolutism? Utterly not, I am of the bleeding heart liberal faction.

But if doing such things is evil, 95% of human governments in history are evil.

They probably were. Read enough history and you will see 

[KrelianZG]

They probably were. Read enough history and you will see 

I won't argue with the moral judgement here, but if that's the case, doesn't that force you into a place where you're just a victim of what is inevitably a corrupt establishment?

I don't want to dispute it, that just seems like a rather depressing worldview to me...

[Arjan]

I won't argue with the moral judgement here, but if that's the case, doesn't that force you into a place where you're just a victim of what is inevitably a corrupt establishment?

I don't want to dispute it, that just seems like a rather depressing worldview to me...

Current government were I live leaves much to wish for but it is not that bad if you compare it to 95% of the governments in history.

There has been moral progress so I am not that depressed about it.

[KrelianZG]

Current government were I live leaves much to wish for but it is not that bad if you compare it to 95% of the governments in history.

There has been moral progress so I am not that depressed about it.

I'll leave this after this post so we don't get into TT territory, but a lot of governments are totally acceptable to their people, but condemned by the outside world. And vice versa. And everything in-between.

As far as the topic is concerned, "evil" is very obviously a subjective definition for us. But in the DV, I think Mab is very much NOT in the "evil" part of the supernatural spectrum.

[Mortax]

I'll leave this after this post so we don't get into TT territory, but a lot of governments are totally acceptable to their people, but condemned by the outside world. And vice versa. And everything in-between.

As far as the topic is concerned, "evil" is very obviously a subjective definition for us. But in the DV, I think Mab is very much NOT in the "evil" part of the supernatural spectrum.

"Luke, you're going to discover that a great many truths we hold dear greatly depend on our point of view."  Obi-Wan Kenobi

Pretty much sums that one up.

[Ms Duck]

A bit rough for my taste.Sure, Mab does not do evil for the sake of some abstract absolute evil. Making an example of someone can be quite effective but it can be seen as an evil act. They probably were. Read enough history and you will see 

Oh ive read the history, hence the comment.

but I'm not sure I agree as to the judgment of history on the whole good/ evil thing.

 

[Hollorr]

"Oh Hollorr, I am so not cool.  DF is my first fandom obsession in many moons... (I have seen Batman and enjoy Green Arrow, but am a strictly a viewer - no deep meanings.)

It would be easier for me to consider a Mab a hero for sacrificing her life and saving mankind, if saving mankind mattered to her.  I think if she needed the dead bodies of every man, woman and child on Earth in order to fulfill her purpose, she wouldn't blink an eye.  I don't think her nature includes any protective impulses for mortals, so saving them might be a by-product of her possible life-sacrifice, but isn't the goal."


hmmm for some reason I have a obsession with aton of Videogame/anime and manga...I haven't really gotten into deep with spiderman/superman/Batman/green arrow and few others. It's only been lately I have gotten into anime/manga full blast..Videogame story on the other hand I have allways loved the story of Rogue heros and well people acting outside of the law to bring justice.....if you think thats cool...Great.
Anyway back to the subject at hand, Mab...
I have nothing to defend in what you said...if Mab wanted you dead or you were usefull dead...you are gonna die....lol (since this is fiction and not real life I shall defend MAB!)
But Mab does have the world in mind to protect so as long as you are needed..your good.
anyway I still Vote Mab/Molly/Harry love ship....lol
I think Ms.duck theory that mab is gonna die soon...might be true but I think I'll need to see the next book before I believe in that...Need to see how molly and mab act.

[matolilyfu]

(since this is fiction and not real life I shall defend MAB!)
But Mab does have the world in mind to protect so as long as you are needed..your good.
anyway I still Vote Mab/Molly/Harry love ship....lol

Defend away.      I see Mab's purpose and its' importance - honest.  She's intriguing in a scary way.  But, I just can't romanticize her into a misunderstood heroine.

I think Ms.duck theory that mab is gonna die soon...might be true but I think I'll need to see the next book before I believe in that...Need to see how molly and mab act.

  I agree that Mab may not be with "us" much longer, but I have very little to base it on.

[123456789blaaa]

Perhaps the "is Mab evil" discussion could be moved to a new thread?

[Ms Duck]

Perhaps the "is Mab evil" discussion could be moved to a new thread?

I kind of think ti should die and stay buried, frankly.

questions of good and evil are entirely subjective and very close to TT; I have been gritting my teeth on this one for the last two pages.

[Arjan]

I kind of think ti should die and stay buried, frankly.

questions of good and evil are entirely subjective and very close to TT; I have been gritting my teeth on this one for the last two pages.

No it is entirely objective. There is an absolute standard. Everything that harms me is evil

[Paynesgrey]

"Good and evil" aren't necessarily Touchy Topics, but when they get into things like government things definitely go pear-shaped.  They're topics which easily tray into Touchy Topics in other areas as well.  They're topics where we must be very, very careful to stay on-task and watch what examples we use, because even things like self-defense, justifiable force, individual sovereignty can stray into TT or religious areas.  So there's no ban on "Good/Evil", but we've all got to watch our examples and our tempers.

[Mira]

"Good and evil" aren't necessarily Touchy Topics, but when they get into things like government things definitely go pear-shaped.  They're topics which easily tray into Touchy Topics in other areas as well.  They're topics where we must be very, very careful to stay on-task and watch what examples we use, because even things like self-defense, justifiable force, individual sovereignty can stray into TT or religious areas.  So there's no ban on "Good/Evil", but we've all got to watch our examples and our tempers.

  Indeed it is a tightrope because the whole series itself is a battle of good and evil with lots of grey in-between.. So it is very hard not to touch touchy topics, because that is the nature of the series.

[Paynesgrey]

Yuppers.  That's why we don't want to nix threads like this, just make sure they stay clear of the real-world religious and sociopolitical topics.  It's the type of issue that brings out the value-judgments in droves, but it's what the books are about pretty much.