Narration vs. Mechanics - Thoughts and Ideas

[Crion]

I'm up for discussing this idea in general, but for starters, I have this one that came up:

One of the players in one of my games asked about the concept of "combining" elements together to create things such as cold fire or flames of shadow.

Personally, I'm looking at just making it count as whatever element is should act like (in this case, fire) but just have the narrative flavor. The only thought against this involves two events from the books: when Harry burns and freezes Red Court Vampires near the end of Changes, and in Cold Days when he

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unleashes the icy fire blast at He Who Walks Before in Mac's

, which makes me wonder if there is a mechanical way/benefit to mixing two elements together in a spell.

Anyone have any thought to this idea, or have their own similar situation they need to soundboard?

[Mrmdubois]

In the case in Changes it seems to me like Harry is setting up a spell that probably sets up a maneuver with Fire that he then tags in order to increase damage with the Ice spell.  He may have pumped shifts into duration, or spray attacking if he didn't he was having Winter take a lot of the strain, otherwise it seems he's chucking around more Evocation than is usual for him in one scene.

In the second case i think it's just a regular Fire evocation getting ramped up by Harry's Sponsors which had some cool narrative effects.

There isn't really going to be a lot of advantage to using two separate elements except as they can set each other up via maneuvers.  Otherwise an attack, is an attack, is an attack and the shift values are the same no matter what, the rest is all flavor.

[UmbraLux]

Anyone have any thought to this idea, or have their own similar situation they need to soundboard?

Don't forget, elements are aspects.  I figure you get one by default with all associated benefits and limitations.  If you want a second element you'll need to invoke the aspect.  (And have the element / aspect to invoke.)

For control purposes, it is worth noting I'd say you're adding power to the spell by adding the second element.  It's not simply better control of a single element.  Mechanically, you'll have the choice of +2 for an invoke or applying an effect via compel / invoke for effect.

[Auspice]

Very often I go with narration in my games, and this system is actually designed just for that.

Remember that with spells sometimes you can just choose to add aspects.  (ie if somebody sends out a fire wave, you can just decide there is the aspect Furniture On Fire)

Usually when my players come up with an idea that I think is clever and fun, it pretty much just works.  At worst, I try to make something significant happen so they are encouraged to be creative.  If you bog everything down to die rolls and rules, that's what they will be concerned with.

Also, as a GM you might just say "Maybe for a Fate point you can declare that the bad guy shatters from the sudden change" or something.

[Mr. Death]

I don't think it needs any special mechanics or invokes. What happened was, Harry's player said, "Okay, I hit him with a huge attack, using Fire." and the GM goes, "Okay, you take him out. Narrate it." Then Harry's player gets creative with the description.

[Crion]

All good lines of thought here! Thank you all for the input!

I think I have something to work with now!


--Crion