Help with a Player's Item

[Theonlyspiral]

Hey There Guys,
A player in my upcoming game sent me his Family Sword (an Item of Power) to review and make sure it was OK. I've played about 2 hours of the game, completely out of the books and a pregenerated adventure, so I'm a little out of my depth here. Having had bad experiences with magic items in other games, I figured I would come to the experts. The character is the last son of a family that has a destiny to destroy a specific outsider. I would really appreciate everyone's thoughts on this blade.

Akai Family Spirit Blade [-3]
Description: An unassuming Japanese Katana that has gained significant magical powers over the past several centuries.
Musts: You must be a descendant of the Akai family, and Have a High Concept related to the family Destiny.
Skills Affected: Weapons
Effects:
[-1]Memories of the Ancestors. The wielder of this sword gains +1 Weapons while wielding it in combat.
[+1]One Time Discount. You're not Duncan Macleod. You can't hide a Katana on your Person.
[-1]Outsider Bane. This sword serves as the catch for any supernatural toughness abilities possessed by outsiders. This weapon increases and stress it inflicts on an Outsider by 1 step.
[-1]The Quest. This item is unbreakable as long as it is used in the service of the family destiny. If it is ever used to further the aims or ends of Outsiders it looses it's magical properties until the user redeems himself or it passes to a new member of the Akai family.
[-1]Spirit Sheath.Up to Four times a day you may use the sword to generate a strength 7 Block against magic on yourself.

[Mr. Death]

Personally I'd put just about any kind of a sword with a +2 discount.

[Deadmanwalking]

Personally I'd put just about any kind of a sword with a +2 discount.

This. It's pretty explicit, what with one of the Swords of the Cross being a katrana and getting the +2. Also, unbreakable as described under The Quest is free with Items of Power. You don't have to pay for it. So, with those considerations in effect, it's only a -1, not -3. If you want it to be a bigger deal than that, well, add more powers.

[Tedronai]

The Quest should not cost refresh.
As said, a Katana should probably be a +2 discount.
Spirit Sheeth's effects are being determined...how?  It looks like an Enchanted Item effect worked in to the IoP, but does the player holding the item have the stats to back that up?

[Mr. Death]

Also, four times a day with a set effect like that isn't really a "power", and it's way above the guidelines for what a 1-refresh power should be.

If anything, I'd say make that power allow the player to make a block against magic using some specific skill (Conviction comes to mind, given the flavor of the sword; maybe Discipline) at a bonus.

[Haru]

Hey There Guys,
A player in my upcoming game sent me his Family Sword (an Item of Power) to review and make sure it was OK. I've played about 2 hours of the game, completely out of the books and a pregenerated adventure, so I'm a little out of my depth here. Having had bad experiences with magic items in other games, I figured I would come to the experts. The character is the last son of a family that has a destiny to destroy a specific outsider. I would really appreciate everyone's thoughts on this blade.

Yeah, Items of Power can get a bit tricky at times. Here are my thoughts on it:

Akai Family Spirit Blade [-3]
Description: An unassuming Japanese Katana that has gained significant magical powers over the past several centuries.
Musts: You must be a descendant of the Akai family, and Have a High Concept related to the family Destiny.
Skills Affected: Weapons
Effects:
[-1]Memories of the Ancestors. The wielder of this sword gains +1 Weapons while wielding it in combat.

So far so good, but here is the first time it gets weird. A weapon like that has a purpose, and a purpose no less, that is mentioned already. I would therefore only grant the +1 when the wielder is fighting outsiders, not as a blanket bonus. This is basically a stunt that is attached to the weapon.

[+1]One Time Discount. You're not Duncan Macleod. You can't hide a Katana on your Person.

That's true. And as a sword, it should get a +2 bonus. A sword is definitely big enough to grant that.

[-1]Outsider Bane. This sword serves as the catch for any supernatural toughness abilities possessed by outsiders. This weapon increases and stress it inflicts on an Outsider by 1 step.

The wording here is a bit off, and I think it grants too much power for one refresh. Since the sword was made to fight one specific outsider, I would only allow it to cut through that outsiders toughness entirely. However, since that would be a little bit weak for one refresh, I'd let it also reduce the toughness power of any outsider by one step. And no extra bonus, that's too much rolled into one.

You could add another [-1] power, that adds 2 stress on successful hits against outsiders. It would stay the same cost, since we increased the discount above.

[-1]The Quest. This item is unbreakable as long as it is used in the service of the family destiny. If it is ever used to further the aims or ends of Outsiders it looses it's magical properties until the user redeems himself or it passes to a new member of the Akai family.

I'm pretty sure, this does not need a refresh point to be active. An item of power is always unbreakable, and it will always be undone, if it is used against it's purpose. Of course, that might mean, that it can't even be used to battle faeries or wizards or anything that isn't an outsider. You should talk about what the purpose of the sword allows and what it doesn't with your player.

[-1]Spirit Sheath.Up to Four times a day you may use the sword to generate a strength 7 Block against magic on yourself.

Um... No. This is really odd. First of all, a flat out number like that is kind of wrong. If there are numbers like that, they are usually 2 or 4, the equivalent to tagging an aspect or two. Then the "four times per day" is also kind of strange. Those things are usually measured in "per session", which is how long you play (unless you allow the item to replenish earlier, because you are playing extra long, or enough time has passed ingame, and so on).

Now I kind of see what he did there, but I am still questioning the "strength 7" part. You can buy 4 enchanted item slots for 1 refresh (the 4 uses). If you have thaumaturgy or evocation, you can create enchanted items that hold spells, for example block spells. Those spells have a base strength of you lore skill. Now for the sword, it doesn't have to be the lore skill, you could replace any other skill for it. Weapons (without any increases from stunts and powers) would be the one to go for here, probably, or you take an arbitrary number, since one of his ancestors created the weapon, and he would have probably also laid down the enchantment.

Though I have to say, this would be easier as a stunt, again. Make it a stunt that allows the wielder to do a weapons block against magic, per the standard (as in: not magic) block rules. It kind of amounts to the same thing, but he can keep it up indefinite if he has to, as long as he rolls the block each exchange as his action. He can also, if need be, increase his roll with fate points and tags, which would not be possible in the current form.

So yeah, that's what I got. hope that helps.

[Taran]

Also, four times a day with a set effect like that isn't really a "power", and it's way above the guidelines for what a 1-refresh power should be.

If anything, I'd say make that power allow the player to make a block against magic using some specific skill (Conviction comes to mind, given the flavor of the sword; maybe Discipline) at a bonus.

Why not make it a stunt that allows you to parry magical attacks with weapons as long as you have the weapon drawn.

@ Haru:  why can't the sword meet the catch for outsiders.  It's less specific than one particular outsider but more specific than holy.

[Haru]

Why not make it a stunt that allows you to parry magical attacks with weapons as long as you have the weapon drawn.

Oh, god call, that'd work very nice, too.

The only difference would be, that you wouldn't be able to shield other characters like you could with a block.

[Mr. Death]

Why not make it a stunt that allows you to parry magical attacks with weapons as long as you have the weapon drawn.

That works, but since the OP phrased it as a block, I figured I'd stay as close to that as I could. That and--

The only difference would be, that you wouldn't be able to shield other characters like you could with a block.

Damn, Haru beat me to the punch.

Come to think of it, I added exactly that to my write up of the Sword of Truth, and was told to just make it an equivalent to the Footwork stunt that lets you just defend against everything with Weapons.

[Haru]

Damn, Haru beat me to the punch.

Meep Meep 

[Deadmanwalking]

Also, four times a day with a set effect like that isn't really a "power", and it's way above the guidelines for what a 1-refresh power should be.

If anything, I'd say make that power allow the player to make a block against magic using some specific skill (Conviction comes to mind, given the flavor of the sword; maybe Discipline) at a bonus.

Eh. A level of Refinement allws 4 Enchanted Item slots and it's roughly on par with what a Warden's Sword does (which is only two item slots). I'd allow it.

So far so good, but here is the first time it gets weird. A weapon like that has a purpose, and a purpose no less, that is mentioned already. I would therefore only grant the +1 when the wielder is fighting outsiders, not as a blanket bonus. This is basically a stunt that is attached to the weapon.

Swords of the Cross do it. No reason this shouldn't too. Gives it some usefulness aside from fighting Outsiders, too, which is good. Items of Power should be cool to have or what's the point?

The wording here is a bit off, and I think it grants too much power for one refresh. Since the sword was made to fight one specific outsider, I would only allow it to cut through that outsiders toughness entirely. However, since that would be a little bit weak for one refresh, I'd let it also reduce the toughness power of any outsider by one step. And no extra bonus, that's too much rolled into one.

Having a specific weapon meet the Catch of a creature type is an established thing. Normally I might not even charge Refresh for it, actually, but Outsiders are specifically tough enough with a rare enough Catch that -1 seems appropriate.

Reducing defensive abilities is more typical of magic, and just generally wonky mechanically. It's much easier to just say 'This satisfies the Catch of X'

Why not make it a stunt that allows you to parry magical attacks with weapons as long as you have the weapon drawn.

This is also a valid way to do it.

[Theonlyspiral]

Awesome. This is exactly the kind of feedback I needed. I like the idea of the blade parrying Outsider magic a lot more than than it putting shields up on everyone. So to take everyone's advice into account the sword would look like:


Akai Family Spirit Blade [-2]
Description: An unassuming Japanese Katana that has gained significant magical powers over the past several centuries.
Musts: You must be a descendant of the Akai family, and Have a High Concept related to the family Destiny.
Skills Affected: Weapons
Effects:
[-1]Forged By the Real. This blade inflicts 2 additional stress on a successful strike against an Outsider.
[-1]Memories of the Ancestors. The wielder of this sword gains +2 Weapons while wielding it in combat against Outsiders.
[+2]One Time Discount. You're not Duncan Macleod. You can't hide a Katana on your Person.
[-1]Outsider Bane. This sword serves as the catch for any supernatural toughness abilities possessed by (Insert Outsider Name here). The sword additionally reduces any toughness ability possessed by any outsider it strikes by one step.
[+0]The Quest. This item is unbreakable as long as it is used in the service of the family destiny. If it is ever used to further the aims or ends of Outsiders it looses it's magical properties until the user redeems himself or it passes to a new member of the Akai family.
[-1]Spirit Sheath.While wielding the Family Blade you may Parry magical attacks as if they were Weapon attacks.

[Deadmanwalking]

I'd seriously go with the original Memories of the Ancestors. Though the new one works too, if you really want.

Additionally, as written, both Forged By the Real and Outsider Bane are too weak. After all, you can get +2 stress vs. everything for one Refresh. They should be combined into a single -1 ability...or you should go back to the original version.

[Tedronai]

I really don't think satisfying the Catch for Outsiders' toughness powers should cost refresh.
Most Outsiders will have a Catch of 'Holy stuff' or something similar, meaning that any 'Holy' weapon will do the job for most of them.  Such a weapon will also satisfy the Catch for many many other creatures.
Being 'Holy' doesn't cost refresh.  The Catch of Outsiders will come up less often then a Catch of 'Holy stuff'.  Satisfying the Catch of Outsiders should not cost refresh.

[Taran]

So, as far as parrying attacks against other people, I think you could do that with a FP.  Also, for blocking, couldn't he just use weapons to put up a block?  I mean, you can just do that anyways, especially if the weapon allows you to parry magic.