Demon-possessed PCs (Darkblade-type setup) - Now with Demonhost Template!

[THE_ANGRY_GAMER]

I'd like to know everyone's thoughts on how to run a PC posessed by a Demon - not just sponsored by one, but actually sharing the bod of the PC. If anyone's read the Malus Darkblade books, this is the kind of setup I'm going for.

I was thinking Sponsored Magic (Hellfire) would be logical, and some kind of debt/stress system to temporarily buy powers such as Inhuman/Supernatural Strength/Speed/Toughness/Recovery, Claws ect. with the caveat that, if the powers exceed the PC's refresh limit or some other limit (this is where the idea of a 'demon' stress track comes from), the Demon takes over, and the more the PC draws on the Demon's power, the more likely it is to try to take control.

The Demon taking control would take the form of a temporary blackout, with the PC waking up to find themselves in a bad situation (for example, running along the edge of a canal in the middle of a thunderstorm three hours later with armed cops in pursuit) and having to find out what the Demon did.

Thoughts?

[Sanctaphrax]

I suggest avoiding an explicit demon control threshold/stress track. Just use Compels.

If you want to grant Powers with magic, Magical Self-Enhancement might be handy. (It's on the Powers master list.)

Also, the right to take Sponsor Debt would make a decent -0 Power.

[Tedronai]

For the foundation of this character, I would suggest leaning heavily on Sponsore Debt and the Temporary Power rules, as you suggest.  I'd likely limit spending on Temporary Powers exclusively to Sponsor Debt.  No real FPs.  MAYBE an occassional tag on some Declared 'credit' aspect, or something of the sort.
I would only actually buy powers to represent what the character can 'safely' use, without adding risk of the demon exerting control.
I'd probably start, not with Hellfire, but with Modular Abilities, with a scope of 'stuff [this demon] can provide' (which might or might not include Hellfire), though obviously spelled out more clearly than that.

Also, the right to take Sponsor Debt would make a decent -0 Power.

Actually, for some limited purposes (including Temporary Powers), 'the right to take Sponsor Debt' is expressly suggested as a default, without needing any Power to open up the possibility.

[Sanctaphrax]

Actually, for some limited purposes (including Temporary Powers), 'the right to take Sponsor Debt' is expressly suggested as a default, without needing any Power to open up the possibility.

If I had my druthers, taking it'd be a default possibility for everyone. But I'm pretty sure you need a Power to use it on attacks, by the RAW.

[THE_ANGRY_GAMER]

Cool suggestions. Temporary powers would be an extremely good way to model it. In the Darkblade books, the character can draw on hte demon's powers temporarily, but the more he does it, the closer he slips to losing his soul to the demon (in game terms, NPC-dom).

How would you guys handle the Demon taking over temporarily? Obviously, it would take over whenever the PC took temporary powers over his spare Refresh, but I want it to be a risk whenever the PC draws on the demon. The Sponsor Debt system definitely would work, but I though Comels had to be for relatively minor stuff? The demon taking over and killing twelve innicents (for example) seems a bit out of that scope.

[Lanodantheon]

Don't forget about Demonic Co-Pilot.

[Sanctaphrax]

Obviously, it would take over whenever the PC took temporary powers over his spare Refresh...

What?

The Sponsor Debt system definitely would work, but I though Comels had to be for relatively minor stuff? The demon taking over and killing twelve innicents (for example) seems a bit out of that scope.

Compels can be whatever you want. If they're too hard, the player can refuse them. Or you can offer multiple FP.

PS: Please forget about Demonic Co-Pilot. It is bad, at least in my opinion.

[Tedronai]

If I had my druthers, taking it'd be a default possibility for everyone. But I'm pretty sure you need a Power to use it on attacks, by the RAW.

Well, I did say 'for some limited purposes'.

But if we're going to houserule a power that grants access to Sponsor Debt, and does nothing else, in a way that is reasonably balanced, the only cost I could conscience would be '[NA]'.

How would you guys handle the Demon taking over temporarily? Obviously, it would take over whenever the PC took temporary powers over his spare Refresh, but I want it to be a risk whenever the PC draws on the demon. The Sponsor Debt system definitely would work, but I though Comels had to be for relatively minor stuff? The demon taking over and killing twelve innicents (for example) seems a bit out of that scope.

I would just use the Compels.  Large or egregious lapses in control would simply be represented by the Demon 'cashing in' on more than one point of Debt to Escalate the Compel.

Don't forget about Demonic Co-Pilot.

No, forget Demonic Co-Pilot ever existed.  Wipe it from existence as you would an Outsider.  It is an abomination of bad writing.

[Sanctaphrax]

Well, I did say 'for some limited purposes'.

But if we're going to houserule a power that grants access to Sponsor Debt, and does nothing else, in a way that is reasonably balanced, the only cost I could conscience would be '[NA]'.

N/A would be better, but 0 will do.

[THE_ANGRY_GAMER]

What?

I like the idea of the PC taking more power than he normally could, thus becoming an NPC for the duration for these powers, with the Demon in control. Possibly having a Mental contest for control of the body every exchange - if he loses, the Demon stays in control and keeps killing pretty much indiscriminately; if he wins, he's stuck in the middle of a combat situation without any of the powers from the Demon, plus any consequences the Demon has absorbed/negated with powers. This way, there's an actual demonstration of what happens if the PC draws on hte demon too deeply.

Compels seem a lot simpler than this, granted. I'm kinda new ot FATE and RPing in general.

Sponsor Debt seems a good way to do it - one point per Refresh?

Just to clarify - the PC isn't taking Sponsor Debt - the demon is. They're two seperate entities, they just happen to share a body. Granting access to sponsor debt is a cool idea, but I think there should be repurcossions of people using that power.

[Sanctaphrax]

I like the idea of the PC taking more power than he normally could, thus becoming an NPC for the duration for these powers, with the Demon in control. Possibly having a Mental contest for control of the body every exchange - if he loses, the Demon stays in control and keeps killing pretty much indiscriminately; if he wins, he's stuck in the middle of a combat situation without any of the powers from the Demon, plus any consequences the Demon has absorbed/negated with powers. This way, there's an actual demonstration of what happens if the PC draws on hte demon too deeply.

You can do all that with Compels.

Sponsor Debt seems a good way to do it - one point per Refresh?

Yes.

Just to clarify - the PC isn't taking Sponsor Debt - the demon is. They're two seperate entities, they just happen to share a body. Granting access to sponsor debt is a cool idea, but I think there should be repurcossions of people using that power.

Sponsor debt is the repercussion. So if the demon takes the debt when the human buys temporary Powers, then it's the demon who suffers the consequences for the human's use of his power.

[THE_ANGRY_GAMER]

You can do all that with Compels.

Cool. Didn't realise they were that powerful. Damn.

Yes.

Nice. Good to know I seem to understand the way the system works. How would you handle the PC making one of the 'temporary' power permanent? Like permanently accepting that much loss of his mortality/soul/freewill (not sure how to phrase this - in the books, it's the character's literal soul he's giving up, but I'm not sure how to adapt this to the DV). So, the PC is no longer drawing on Sponsor Debt, but the power is still tied to the demon - spending a Refresh point, but gaining a worsening of the 'possessed' aspect? Or perhaps a negotiation of a 'Standing' point of Debt?

EDIT: another solution is having both: spending a point of Refresh, AND having a 'permanent' point of Sponsor Debt, limited to a minor compel (so not taking over and killing stuff, but having people be unconciously averted from you by the presence of the demon).

EDIT 2 - ELECTRIC BOOGALOO: What kind of Refresh cost would this have? Sponsored magic ranges from -4 to -2, but this grants a lot more than spells.

[InFerrumVeritas]

Compels are a way to "force" the characters to act a certain way.  They can be refused by players.  A compel has to be in line with an aspect, but can basically be anything that passes muster with the table.  "I compel you to blow your brains out" wouldn't, but "I compel you to start drinking again" might.

[Praxidicae]

Nice. Good to know I seem to understand the way the system works. How would you handle the PC making one of the 'temporary' power permanent? Like permanently accepting that much loss of his mortality/soul/freewill (not sure how to phrase this - in the books, it's the character's literal soul he's giving up, but I'm not sure how to adapt this to the DV). So, the PC is no longer drawing on Sponsor Debt, but the power is still tied to the demon - spending a Refresh point, but gaining a worsening of the 'possessed' aspect? Or perhaps a negotiation of a 'Standing' point of Debt?

As a characters remaining refresh post character-gen is supposed to represent his free will, I would allow a PC to convert a temporary power into a permanent power relatively easy. Just allow a 1 to 1 conversion of debt to refresh. Wiping the relevant power (and related debt) from the sponsor's record in return for the greater loss of a portion of his/her soul.

[THE_ANGRY_GAMER]

As a characters remaining refresh post character-gen is supposed to represent his free will, I would allow a PC to convert a temporary power into a permanent power relatively easy. Just allow a 1 to 1 conversion of debt to refresh. Wiping the relevant power (and related debt) from the sponsor's record in return for the greater loss of a portion of his/her soul.

Cool

Compels are a way to "force" the characters to act a certain way.  They can be refused by players.  A compel has to be in line with an aspect, but can basically be anything that passes muster with the table.  "I compel you to blow your brains out" wouldn't, but "I compel you to start drinking again" might.

So, would 'The demon takes control and kills a load of people' would be beyond the scope of a single compel? Maybe it would take multiple points of sponsor debt being wiped?