Does the DresdenVerse default to Ultimate Good or Ultimate Evil?

[eri]

Nice character concept, but it's not what we are talking about.  An assertion was made that a PC could go from "I have the were form Template" to "I now fly and shoot lightning from my butt" using the RAW.

A custom template could do it.  Maybe a Changeling or Scion could develop a were form.  That's fine.  But I still can't see how a PC can go from "I have the were form Template" to "I now fly and shoot lightning from my butt" using the RAW.

You'd just have to become an Emissary of the right Power. I don't know what Power that would be, specifically, but I'm sure a sufficiently creative player could think of a story.
Someone's even metioned it before. Let me see. Here:

You could say you were always such a being but simply didn't know about it until your powers manifested recently. Or just start the game with the template, possibly claiming you can shapeshift becuse of your lineage. Failing that, there's still Emissary of Power, for taking whatever powers you feel like.

My emphasis

And you can certainly take that after character creation and have it on top of other templates

"Billy, wouldn't Vittorio Malvora qualify as an Emissary of Power in the WHITE NIGHT casefile?" "Probably but he would already have the White Court Vampire template, so I thought that might be confusing as an example." "Real life doesn't always fit into neat little boxes."

[devonapple]

Here is the line I quoted - with the stuff underneath it.  Please point out the weredragon line:

The Dresdenverse is rife with shapeshifters of all stripes (many nonhuman). Some humans have learned (or were simply born with the capability) to take on the form of a beast; when that beast is a wolf, we call them werewolves, but there are many other were-forms out there. The animal in question isn’t supercharged or innately magical (other than the fact that it has a human intellect kicking around in its noggin), but with some practice, the shapeshifter can use it as easily as his human form, within the limits of what that animal can do. Unlike lycanthropes, loupgaroux, and some other types of shapechangers, most were-form shifters are entirely in control of their change. There’s no full moon business going on with us.

Ummm, RIGHT below that (on YS 82, for those following at home), there is a note from Bob explaining "William, just as a note, there are some wereforms that are supercharged or innately magical." It's in red.

That said, some folks here dismiss the parenthetical commentary and sidebars as optional rules, and not to be taken seriously as what happens to be in a paragraph with black serif font type. If commentary and sidebars are indeed optional, then that means weredragons are not RAW.

[UmbraLux]

I do have a reference.  For Changelings, please see Summer Knight. 

Where?

For White Court Virgins, please see Blood Rites.
"Want doesn't matter," Bob said. "They feed on pure reflex. It's what they are."

"Let me guess," I said. "The first feeding is lethal."
"Always," Thomas said.

Err, this states "feeding" - as I'd thought.  Do you have a reference stating "sex"?  Perhaps it's worth noting, the act of sex isn't what they feed on.  WCVs feed on emotion. 

[Richard_Chilton]

Ummm, RIGHT below that (on YS 82, for those following at home), there is a note from Bob explaining "William, just as a note, there are some wereforms that are supercharged or innately magical." It's in red.

Darn, I just went to the end of the section and stopped.  Sorry, you're right.

Which makes the weredragon PC I'm writing up a bit easier to write up.

Richard

[devonapple]

Darn, I just went to the end of the section and stopped.  Sorry, you're right.

Not as bad as me missing an entire OGL page ::blush::

[Richard_Chilton]

Where?

I'm sorry, if you haven't read the book then I can't quote the entire "what changelings are" section for you.  A few lines, sure, but after that copyright kicks in.

Err, this states "feeding" - as I'd thought.  Do you have a reference stating "sex"?  Perhaps it's worth noting, the act of sex isn't what they feed on.  WCVs feed on emotion.

Here's a bit more from that section:
"Killer sex," I said. "Literally."
"To die for," Bob confirmed.
An eerie thought, and one that disturbed me a lot more than I thought it should. "What if the vamp doesn't want to feed on someone?"
"Want doesn't matter," Bob said. "They feed on pure reflex. It's what they are."
...

Richard

[Viatos]

Just because the RAW allows you to make custom <x> does not mean that custom X is part of the RAW.  It means that you can add to the RAW in your way and I can add to the RAW in my way.

Exactly! So it's RAW to develop a custom template in general. That's my point!

On templates: We know when Changelings develop, but not when a Scion's abilities manifest, which could differ dramatically depending on nature. A half-Foo Dog might be very different from a middle-aged mailman named Prince of Djinni by a dying fire elemental, or a young woman who accidentally ingested a Blackened Denarius as an infant, and some unique void in her soul devoured the Fallen and absorbed its powers. You could spend seventy years as a weredragon, and then unexpectedly manifest your heritage as the foretold Sword-of-Typhon, resulting in the growth of tentacles and Thaumaturgy specialized in Monsteromancy or something.

By-the-by, I think "child of Mouse and Terra West" would be pretty awesome for a Next Generation-style DFRPG game.

[UmbraLux]

I'm sorry, if you haven't read the book then I can't quote the entire "what changelings are" section for you.  A few lines, sure, but after that copyright kicks in.

Could have sworn I'd asked "Where?" - that usually consists of directions on how to find something.  Not wholesale copying.    Shrug. 

As for the other, sex != feeding - even if there is often a correlation.  (True love comes to mind as an obvious exception - thought not necessarily the only one.)

[Viatos]

As for the other, sex != feeding - even if there is often a correlation.  (True love comes to mind as an obvious exception - thought not necessarily the only one.)

Notably, Thomas and his sensual haircare.

[Richard_Chilton]

Could have sworn I'd asked "Where?" - that usually consists of directions on how to find something.  Not wholesale copying.    Shrug.

Where? Summer Knight.  A big chunk of it is when Meryl and the others ambush Harry then offer him a job, but Changelings are mentioned in several places.

As for the other, sex != feeding - even if there is often a correlation.  (True love comes to mind as an obvious exception - thought not necessarily the only one.)

You did read that quote, right? Sex = Feeding.  They can't help themselves.   After the "killer sex" line it's quite clear:
"What if the vamp doesn't want to feed on someone?"
"Want doesn't matter," Bob said. "They feed on pure reflex. It's what they are."

Re-read the bit where Inari returns the then unnamed puppy to Harry.  She is not making a conscious decision to feed, yet feeding begins after a few kisses.

They can feed in other ways but sex = feeding.

Richard

[Tedronai]

They can feed in other ways but sex = feeding.

No, (for Raiths) sex therefore feeding.
Note the difference?
The act of sex is not the act of feeding.  The act of sex is (barring exceptions) accompanied by the act of feeding.

And for Houses other than Raith we have essentially no information as to how 'first feeding' generally comes about.

[UmbraLux]

Where? Summer Knight.  A big chunk of it is when Meryl and the others ambush Harry then offer him a job, but Changelings are mentioned in several places.

It really took a "big chunk" of a book to state changelings and scions always find out / gain powers in puberty?

I'll look but I don't remember any such emphasis.  I suspect I would if the book had really devoted large sections to the subject.

So far, the case for that assertion is even weaker than the second.

[Sanctaphrax]

YS 72: "It may be possible to combine some of these templates, if you can afford each template’s musts. However, it will be rare that those costs work out. We haven’t seen a Wizard-Lycanthrope-Red-Court-Infected-Changelingpotamus in Harry’s casefiles, and you certainly won’t see one as a playable character in this game. For good reason—bring that much mashed-up mojo to bear in one character and you’re on a fast train to negative refreshville."

Not what I meant.

There are rules for starting with multiple templates. But there are no rules for changing templates in game, or for adding on new templates.

So one could argue that by RAW Harry cannot become the Winter Knight. Because his template is Wizard.

You could also argue that he can't have Lawbreaker, because Lawbreaker isn't among the options for the Wizard template.

Which is of course silly. Point is, taking the RAW too seriously is a bad idea.

[Richard_Chilton]

It really took a "big chunk" of a book to state changelings and scions always find out / gain powers in puberty?

I'll look but I don't remember any such emphasis.  I suspect I would if the book had really devoted large sections to the subject.

So far, the case for that assertion is even weaker than the second.

READ THE BOOK.

Then give me all the evidence you find that Changelings discover what they are during their adult life.

Richard

[UmbraLux]

READ THE BOOK.

Read it.  Enjoyed it.  Didn't see support for the absolute assertion you made.

Then give me all the evidence you find that Changelings discover what they are during their adult life.

I'm not the one making an assertion.    I simply recognize that seeing green leaves doesn't mean every leaf is green.