Author Topic: Harrying House Rule  (Read 4395 times)

Offline InFerrumVeritas

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 813
    • View Profile
Re: Harrying House Rule
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2012, 07:25:02 PM »
For what it's worth, I completely agree with Devonapple's interpretation.

I do think it's at least partially a houserule, but, imo, it's a good one that makes sense and makes the game work better.

I think the problem here is the lack of differentiation between:

I agree.  This is how it works RAW.

AND

This isn't how it is RAW, but I think this is an excellent houserule.  Specifically one which addresses a problem with RAW.

I think the differentiation is important for posterity.  Specifically because if I adopt a houserule, I should let my players know.  If I'm simply enforcing RAW, than that information was available to my players at the start of the game. 

Offline wyvern

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1418
    • View Profile
Re: Harrying House Rule
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2012, 07:29:45 PM »
Well, the real problem here is actually that the RAW is exceptionally unclear.  As noted, there's exactly one side-comment in one side-bar that (arguably) supports one position on this.  Thus, I feel this is - either way - at least pseudo-houserule, since someone could honestly think the RAW went in either direction.

Offline GryMor

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 224
    • View Profile
Re: Harrying House Rule
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2012, 12:10:26 AM »
RAW doesn't seem unclear to me (but I haven't played much), your actual difficulty for an action is the highest of the base difficulty of the action, your targets defense against the action and the highest applicable simple block to the action. There isn't a sequence of difficulties, there is just one difficulty, that subtracts from the roll to determine the threshold of success (but at this point, the action has succeeded). Armor (and armor blocks) only comes into play to reduce the threshold of success.

Offline Becq

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1253
    • View Profile
Re: Harrying House Rule
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2012, 03:26:02 AM »
While I agree that devonapple is stating the RAW accurately, I thought I'd offer a shorter version of the explanation:

When performing an action that is affected as a block, you are rolling against both the defense roll/difficulty/whatever you would normally be rolling against and the block strength, in parallel.

In the case of attacks, the block doesn't add to the target's defense roll, it simply counts as a second backup roll, and the target gets to use either their own defense roll or the block, which turns out to be better.  Assuming the block is better, then the block behaves for all purposes as if it were the defense roll, meaning that even if the attacker beat the block, the number of shifts is based on the difference between the attack roll and the block.  If the defense roll was better, then the block didn't end up actually doing anything to help.  Same thing for static actions, but in this case if the block is higher than the difficulty, then the action succeed only if you beat the block, and the degree of success is determined by number of shifts over the block strength.

The advantage to armor over blocks is that armor stacks with defense in the sense that it reduces the margin of success, even after the defense roll was subtracted from the defense roll.  The disadvantage to armor over blocks is that since armor 'merely' reduces the margin of success, it can't turn a 'success' into a 'failure'.  If an attack hit, then armor can reduce the stress inflicted, but can't turn the attack into a miss.

This is particularly important for attacks with high weapon values, including spells.  Say an enemy casts a weapon:10 spell at you.  He rolls a 5 for his attack roll, and you roll a 5 for your defense.  He hits, inflicting 0+10 = 10 stress.  Ouch!  If you had had a block 6 up (only 1 higher than your defense roll) the attack would have missed.  If you had had the equivalent spell as armor (armor:3), then you'd still get hit, but for 7 stress.  Better than 10, but not as good as 0.

Changing the example slightly, say the foe cast the same spell and rolled a 6 for his attack roll, but you still rolled a 5.  He'd hit for 11 stress this time.  The block would provide only a minor benefit: your defense roll becomes 6, but the attack still hits (barely) and you take 10 stress.  (And in addition, if the block was a spell, then the block would now go away.)  The armor would be better in this example, reducing the 11 stress to 8 (and sticking around, even if it was from a spell).

Alternatively, having both armor AND block gives you the best of both worlds -- you get the backup defense roll AND if the roll hits, you reduce the amount of stress done.  The errata'd version of the enchanted item block is almost as good, allowing you to pick which of the two effects is better on the fly (but still granting only one at a time).


Offline Orladdin

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 514
  • The Undauntable
    • View Profile
Re: Harrying House Rule
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2012, 03:25:02 PM »
... The errata'd version of the enchanted item block is almost as good, allowing you to pick which of the two effects is better on the fly (but still granting only one at a time).

Wait-- there's errata?  Are we talking official errata?  Where can I find that?
There is never a blanket answer to an ethical question.  This includes the Laws of Magic.

Perpetrator of The Cold Days Release FAQ

"I never make stupid mistakes. Only very, very clever ones."
-- The Doctor, Timewyrm: Genesys

Offline InFerrumVeritas

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 813
    • View Profile
Re: Harrying House Rule
« Reply #20 on: February 10, 2012, 03:30:24 PM »
Wait-- there's errata?  Are we talking official errata?  Where can I find that?

He means the version in the final publication (not the pre-order).

Offline Orladdin

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 514
  • The Undauntable
    • View Profile
Re: Harrying House Rule
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2012, 03:44:57 PM »
He means the version in the final publication (not the pre-order).

Ah, ok.  Thanks for clearing that up.
There is never a blanket answer to an ethical question.  This includes the Laws of Magic.

Perpetrator of The Cold Days Release FAQ

"I never make stupid mistakes. Only very, very clever ones."
-- The Doctor, Timewyrm: Genesys