Are Readers Growing Tired of New Urban Fantasy?

[Madd]

Probably.

I'm not, but the only UF I've read was The Dresden Files and The Nightside series by Simon R. Green.  I prefer sword and sorcery/high fantasy generally, but good authors always pull me in no matter what the setting.

I'd love to write an UF series, not for others but just for me.  To see where things would go.  Alas, the time the time...

[hank the ancient]

Here's my 2 cents. I want the oldey but goody stuff back. I miss the comic relief of eighties horror movies, not slasher, horror. I miss the star trek idea that yeah, the future maybe is gonna be a good place with good people in it. I miss fictional characters you aspire to be like rather than reality tv stars that lower your expectations of humanity. I miss the clever heroes that win by showing bright, not might, makes right. I miss the stories where the good guy doesn't get the girl, because yes, Rick is the good guy. I miss comedies that aren't all gross out humor or kick the protagonist, let Neidermeyer get the abuse. I miss vampires being the bad guys. I miss the occasional western.  etc.etc. etc.

I believe that the popularity of different stories and genres goes through cycles based on freshness for the audience. Certain things get popular then get overdone and have to take a rest because low quality stuff jumps on the bandwagon. You can tell when it is time for a change when it becomes the new, new, new, new version of the old stories rather than their return. The need to "make it fresh" kills the core values that make certain stories great to begin with.

I don't think readers are tired of urban fantasy, I think they are tired of the gimmicks that get slapped on to the point where it just becomes mass marketed cliches aimed at spoiled teenagers and later to be produced by michael bay starring the latest pop singer.

[Madd]

Here's my 2 cents. I want the oldey but goody stuff back. I miss the comic relief of eighties horror movies, not slasher, horror. I miss the star trek idea that yeah, the future maybe is gonna be a good place with good people in it. I miss fictional characters you aspire to be like rather than reality tv stars that lower your expectations of humanity. I miss the clever heroes that win by showing bright, not might, makes right. I miss the stories where the good guy doesn't get the girl, because yes, Rick is the good guy. I miss comedies that aren't all gross out humor or kick the protagonist, let Neidermeyer get the abuse. I miss vampires being the bad guys. I miss the occasional western.  etc.etc. etc.

I agreed with your whole post, but wanted to highlight this section, mostly because I'm pretty sure you are secretly recording me and my wife's personal conversations 

[synthesis]

I actually like the Ilona Andrews husband wife team.  The wife ilona writes most everything, except the scenes with the male leads.  Then the husband writes at the male part.  It leads to a certain consistency with the man/woman dicotamy you normally run into with a single sex author ( not sure I used the right descriptor here  ).

Yeah, you are write about the "Andrews team"--the relationship development in those books is probably amongst the best I've ever read.  Very natural and not forced.  The Kate Daniels series along with Patricia Briggs' series, are my favorites in the Urban Fantasy category (along with, of course, the Dresden Files) because the focus is not on the whole "romance" thing, but on the actual story. 

So many of the books that have flooded the genre are really just serialized romances with a paranormal element thrown in.  And the vast majority of them suck

[The Deposed King]

Yeah, you are write about the "Andrews team"--the relationship development in those books is probably amongst the best I've ever read.  Very natural and not forced.  The Kate Daniels series along with Patricia Briggs' series, are my favorites in the Urban Fantasy category (along with, of course, the Dresden Files) because the focus is not on the whole "romance" thing, but on the actual story. 

Yeah its pretty natural.  I really only found one scene I thought Curran failed at, back in book two.  I messaged the author(s) about it.  Actually got a couple back and forth responces about it.  (One of the two or three highlights of my e-mailing established authors out of the blue with complaints.)

On a slightly tangential note, and I've probably already mentioned this somewhere.  It was cool to read when ilona posted, that there were several complaints from a few female readers about Currans lack of emotional/indepth feelings/monologue during the Curran POV scenes.  Ilona pointed out that since her husband wrote most of the thing and she just cleaned it out for read-ability they were getting the actual male perspective, from the male half of the team.  Sorry if they didn't like the actual look inside the thought process.

So many of the books that have flooded the genre are really just serialized romances with a paranormal element thrown in.  And the vast majority of them suck

You're right.  There's a lot of drek out there. 


Have a blast!


The Deposed King

[Snowleopard]

Here's my 2 cents. I want the oldey but goody stuff back. I miss the comic relief of eighties horror movies, not slasher, horror. I miss the star trek idea that yeah, the future maybe is gonna be a good place with good people in it. I miss fictional characters you aspire to be like rather than reality tv stars that lower your expectations of humanity. I miss the clever heroes that win by showing bright, not might, makes right. I miss the stories where the good guy doesn't get the girl, because yes, Rick is the good guy. I miss comedies that aren't all gross out humor or kick the protagonist, let Neidermeyer get the abuse. I miss vampires being the bad guys. I miss the occasional western.  etc.etc. etc.

I believe that the popularity of different stories and genres goes through cycles based on freshness for the audience. Certain things get popular then get overdone and have to take a rest because low quality stuff jumps on the bandwagon. You can tell when it is time for a change when it becomes the new, new, new, new version of the old stories rather than their return. The need to "make it fresh" kills the core values that make certain stories great to begin with.

I don't think readers are tired of urban fantasy, I think they are tired of the gimmicks that get slapped on to the point where it just becomes mass marketed cliches aimed at spoiled teenagers and later to be produced by michael bay starring the latest pop singer.

I'm with you, HtA all the way.  Tell it, brother.
I'm so very, very tired of nasty, nobody reality stars, dumba** humor, stories that depend on explosions and special effects instead of a Good story and characters you can get behind.

[cenwolfgirl]

my book dosent have a singla exsplosion 

[Shecky]

You're right.  There's a lot of drek out there. 

I wouldn't call it dreck. Paranormal romance, although not something that's to my personal taste, is a legitimate subgenre. Besides, Jim's wife writes paranormal romance, and I am NOT going to slam her work.

[Madd]

I wouldn't call it dreck. Paranormal romance, although not something that's to my personal taste, is a legitimate subgenre. Besides, Jim's wife writes paranormal romance, and I am NOT going to slam her work.

I've never read a word of her writing, but I'm a huge fan of it nonetheless!

I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that my wife is an avid reader.....and that it makes her frisky.  Nope, nothing to do with it at all 

[whingnut]

I wouldn't call it dreck. Paranormal romance, although not something that's to my personal taste, is a legitimate subgenre. Besides, Jim's wife writes paranormal romance, and I am NOT going to slam her work.

I ,a quite heterosexual man, has read Shannon Butcher's first paranormal romance and while not to my tastes it's a DAMN GOOD BOOK. Jim joked he wanted to steal her monsters and I can see why they are fantastic. Also when I got to tell her I had read it in person she said " REALLY? You're brave they are totally not for dudes" so I've got that going for me.

[Ziggelly]

Fantasy in general seems like it's turning over a new leaf with authors like Rothfuss, Lynch, Abercrombie, etc. No trolls or elves to be found in that lot.

And dragons. Don't forget the dragons. Dragons have been done to death. But Rothfuss ended up winning my heart forever with his draccus. "It's like a big cow." It was brilliant. So there's something to be said for genre expectations. You just have to know what you're doing with them. Like Jim: He's got vampires, werewolves, and faeries, but that doesn't make him like all the other UF authors out there.

[The Deposed King]

I wouldn't call it dreck. Paranormal romance, although not something that's to my personal taste, is a legitimate subgenre. Besides, Jim's wife writes paranormal romance, and I am NOT going to slam her work.

The Genere is very legitimate.  And perhaps I let a little bit of my own disgust with paranormal romance writers who come on over to the fantasy scene and try to sell me, 'paranormal romance' packaged as urban fantasy.

That said.  Just as there are hum-de-dum writers in the fantasy scene who are more interested in their word count than producing a believeable story with consistent characters, in my few experience the paranormal romance scene has its fair share of inconsistent characters and books that are light on consistent believability as origionally put to paper by the writer and later modified to suit whatever fancy they felt like writing that day.

I've seen good and I've seen bad.  I wasn't labeling the whole genre with a wide brush.  I was just pointing to the stinky underbelly.

And yes I'm a little biased.


The Deposed King

[OZ]

The Genere is very legitimate.  And perhaps I let a little bit of my own disgust with paranormal romance writers who come on over to the fantasy scene and try to sell me, 'paranormal romance' packaged as urban fantasy.

I think this is where I have a problem as well. I have no problem at all with paranormal romance. I don't like it when it is deceitfully packaged. When I pick up a book about a tough, no nonsense monster hunter and find that the main character spends three fourths of her time thinking about one (or two, or three, or...) of the other characters looks, charm, voice, etc. it annoys me greatly. On the other hand I have absolutely problem when a good author has some overlap. The previously mentioned Kate Andrews books are a good example of this. The romance is a definite part of the stories but, for the most part, it has not threatened to become the main plot.

[Shecky]

The Genere is very legitimate.  And perhaps I let a little bit of my own disgust with paranormal romance writers who come on over to the fantasy scene and try to sell me, 'paranormal romance' packaged as urban fantasy.

That said.  Just as there are hum-de-dum writers in the fantasy scene who are more interested in their word count than producing a believeable story with consistent characters, in my few experience the paranormal romance scene has its fair share of inconsistent characters and books that are light on consistent believability as origionally put to paper by the writer and later modified to suit whatever fancy they felt like writing that day.

I've seen good and I've seen bad.  I wasn't labeling the whole genre with a wide brush.  I was just pointing to the stinky underbelly.

And yes I'm a little biased.


The Deposed King

I have sort of the same feelings, but not singling out authors in a particular genre; it's more towards authors who are... well, just not up to snuff, period. I do have my preferences and personal tastes, sure, but it's more a question of "Did the author execute exactly what he/she intended to do? And did they do so in a way that's smart, readable and not dumbed-down?" If so, then they have my respect, regardless of genre. If not... you can figure out the rest. But in the end, what it comes down to is this: if they're published, that's a real achievement and not one to be sneered at.

Stephenie Myers is a perfect example. Her writing is NOT to my taste. And some of the underlying concepts in Twilight's characters set my teeth on edge. I tried to read her stuff, I truly did, but I couldn't make it far at all. Be all that as it may, she had a target with her writing, and she nailed it dead center. For that, she has my sincere respect.

[OZ]

I did not care for Stephanie Meyers' books either (actually I should say book since I only read the first one) but when my friends complain about her I always tell them that I imagine she was writing her books to sell to more than just me and in that she was wildly successful. Like you I respect her for that.