Psionics in Dresden

[arthurfallz]

The reason for that power is to avoid magical mechanics as a whole (fallout, stress, thresholds, weaknesses etc the whole bundle) and all of the pre-attached baggage that came with it. Yes Spirit Magic can move stuff without touching it using conceptual constructs and magic energy and yes you could build a telekinetic template with it, it was just not the kind of telekinetic I was aiming for.

That's precisely what I was aiming for. Magic should be magic, and it seems (though it's hard to say) that psionic powers operate under different rules. Has Jim made any comments about them as an aside?

A lot of the previous posts are great! I'll use them for my game, help solve the problem we were having statting out our resident psychic.

[Sanctaphrax]

There are meaningful differences between this and Channeling. As ways and means says, Channeling has rather a lot of baggage.

Will write a revised version of Telekinesis shortly.

[devonapple]

I think taking Breath Weapon (possibly with control-related stunts) may be the best way to go with telekinesis: since we generally want it to do damage and perform maneuvers, and use no Stress.

[Blackblade]

I think taking Breath Weapon (possibly with control-related stunts) may be the best way to go with telekinesis: since we generally want it to do damage and perform maneuvers, and use no Stress.

This is exactly how I would do it; make it run off of discipline instead of weapon, and call it a day.  Charge -2.

[zenten]

The reason for that power is to avoid magical mechanics as a whole (fallout, stress, thresholds, weaknesses etc the whole bundle) and all of the pre-attached baggage that came with it. Yes Spirit Magic can move stuff without touching it using conceptual constructs and magic energy and yes you could build a telekinetic template with it, it was just not the kind of telekinetic I was aiming for.

No power is going to let you avoid thresholds.  But yeah, I see what you're saying with the rest of it.

[Sanctaphrax]

Breath Weapon is too limited. You can't move a sofa with Breath Weapon.

Decided to allow grapples with the base power.

Finished Telekinesis power. Please tell me what you think of it. Even if you hate it. Especially if you hate it.

I may have gone a little overboard with the upgrades, here. I admit, it's a vice of mine.

TELEKINESIS [-2]
Description: You can exert physical force with the power of your mind alone.
Skills Affected: Conviction, Discipline
Effects:
Mind Over Matter. You may use your mind to exert force upon targets within one zone. This allows you to use all trappings of the Might skill at a range of one zone, using your Conviction skill instead of your Might skill.
Telekinetic Attacks. You may make physical attacks against targets within one zone using your mental powers. These attacks are aimed with Discipline and may be made with or without a weapon.
Blades Of Force [-1]. When using Telekinetic Attacks without a weapon, your attacks are weapon: 2.
Mind Like A Rocket Launcher [-1]. (Requires Blades Of Force) When using Telekinetic Attacks without a weapon, your attacks are weapon: 4.
Force Field [-1]. You are protected by a shell of telekinetic power. You may use your Discipline skill to defend against physical attacks or to create physical blocks.
Enhanced Range [-1]. You may use this power out to a range of 3 zones.
Infinite Range [-1]. (Requires Enhanced Range) You may use this power against any target within your line of sight.
Telekinetic Self-Propulsion [-2]. Your telekinesis is strong enough to let you carry yourself. This allows you to fly as though you had the Wings power, using Discipline instead of Athletics to control yourself in the air.
Metaphysical Strength [-0]. (Requires Inhuman Or Better Strength) Your Strength powers apply to your Telekinesis rather than to your physical body. This increases your Conviction when using it to lift or break things, helps with your mental grapples, and increases the stress inflicted by your Telekinetic Attacks.
Unification Of Mind And Body [-1]. (Requires Metaphysical Strength) Your Strength powers apply to both your Telekinesis and your physical body. This provides all the benefits of Metaphysical Strength alongside all the benefits of ordinary strength.

[Belial666]

telekinesis

More or less OK, since it gives both range and changes a skill's worth of trappings.

Blades of Force

OK

Mind Like A Rocket Launcher

The name seems silly to me - but that may be just me. Mechanically it's OK.

Force Field

OK

Range

Both range upgrades are OK

Telekinetic Self-Propulsion

Overpriced. Why should it cost twice as much as "Wings"? And how far can you move (not just control yourself), is it still based on Athletics or Discipline? It should be clarified.

Metaphysical Strength

OK

Unification Of Mind And Body

Suppose someone with just Metaphysical strength wants to grab someone else. Is there something preventing them from using their mental strength at melee? If not, then why would they need to use their physical strength? Also, if they are grabbed, does something prevent them from using their mental strength to break a grapple? If not, then why would they need to use their physical strength?
(in short, it is a power where you pay refresh without getting any tangible benefit)

[UmbraLux]

Finished Telekinesis power. Please tell me what you think of it. Even if you hate it. Especially if you hate it.

I may have gone a little overboard with the upgrades, here. I admit, it's a vice of mine.

Yeah, you may have.     Overall impression - it's a lot of refresh to dump into a single power.  Particularly since Telekinesis (-2) plus blades of force, mind like a rocket launcher, force field, enhanced range, and infinite range (-5) total up to -7 refresh and are still less useful than Channeling - with the exception of mental stress.  But I don't think avoiding mental stress is worth 5 refresh. 

Telekinetic Self-Propulsion [-2]. Your telekinesis is strong enough to let you carry yourself. This allows you to fly as though you had the Wings power, using Discipline instead of Athletics to control yourself in the air.

I'd keep the same cost as Wings. 

[The Mighty Buzzard]

Mind Over Matter. You may use your mind to exert force upon targets within one zone. This allows you to use all trappings of the Might skill at a range of one zone, using your Conviction skill instead of your Might skill.
Telekinetic Attacks. You may make physical attacks against targets within one zone using your mental powers. These attacks are aimed with Discipline and may be made with or without a weapon.

Delicate work should be done with Discipline rather than conviction.  Work it the same way and don't require many shifts of power but make the aim difficulty higher or require several successes at a lower difficulty, depending on the situation.

[Tedronai]

Base power still makes no mention of grapples, let alone simpler blocks, and now no longer makes mention of maneuvers.

[Sanctaphrax]

Aha!

Now this, this is a good response.

Mind Like A Rocket Launcher is indeed a silly name. But it was 2 am and I was thinking, "I'm not going to sleep until I finish this." So I got kind of desperate near the end. I'm open to suggestions for a better name.

Not sure what The Mighty Buzzard is trying to say. Would appreciate clarification.

Unification Of Mind And Body is an extra cost for versatility. If you want to make a character with both super-strength and massive telekinetic power, you shouldn't have to buy your Strength powers twice. But applying Strength to both should not be free, because then there would be no good mechanical reason ever to make a character with super-strong telekinesis who wasn't also super-strong physically. Think of it as like buying extra elements with Refinement.

Force Field does stuff that Channeling doesn't, so UmbraLux ought to remove it from his example. As for the rest, Channeling has a number of random drawbacks. Backlash, fallout, rolling to control, taking mental stress, limited duration, etc. So it's not a great comparison. A comparison to Breath Weapon would be better, I think. And in that, Telekinesis looks pretty good.

The base power is supposed to allow blocks and maneuvers and grapples. "All trappings of the Might skill" was meant to include those. If it doesn't, I'll rewrite.

Telekinetic Self-Propulsion costs 2 for three reasons:

1. Wings is underpriced, I think.
2. When a thread discussed #1, people said that Wings without physical wings would be a -2 power.
3. It includes a stunt letting you move around with Discipline. That's pretty useful for a character with low Athletics.

[UmbraLux]

Force Field does stuff that Channeling doesn't, so UmbraLux ought to remove it from his example.

How do you figure?  It's just creating a reflexive block.  Only difference is mental stress.

As for the rest, Channeling has a number of random drawbacks. Backlash, fallout, rolling to control, taking mental stress, limited duration, etc. So it's not a great comparison.

Backlash and fallout aren't negatives, they're positives - they allow you to turn a failed roll into a success.  Rolling to control / hit is something you're doing with both channeling and tk.  Mental stress is definitely a difference.  So is duration - but it's worse than channeling not better if you're basing it off of Might (takes action to maintain every exchange). 

A comparison to Breath Weapon would be better, I think. And in that, Telekinesis looks pretty good.

If you rolled blades of force into the base power it would equal Breath Weapon - a power many think isn't worth 2 refresh.  Without adding the +2 damage it's significantly underpowered even compared to BW.

The base power is supposed to allow blocks and maneuvers and grapples. "All trappings of the Might skill" was meant to include those. If it doesn't, I'll rewrite.

Telekinetic Self-Propulsion costs 2 for three reasons:

1. Wings is underpriced, I think.
2. When a thread discussed #1, people said that Wings without physical wings would be a -2 power.
3. It includes a stunt letting you move around with Discipline. That's pretty useful for a character with low Athletics.

Shrug, I think this was argued sufficiently in other threads - I won't continue it here.   

[Blackblade]

I agree with Umbra: the base power is a overpriced.  Adding Blades of Force to it might make it more worthwhile.

[The Mighty Buzzard]

Not sure what The Mighty Buzzard is trying to say. Would appreciate clarification.

Just meant that not everything you could conceivably do with TK is combat/kerblooie based and offered suggestions for how to deal with something like yoinking the manacle keys from the keyrack across the room and using them to uncuff yourself.  There you're not needing a ton of power but you are needing a ton of Discipline.

Say a control roll for pulling them off the rack, another getting them between the cell bars, and another to get them in the manacles and turn the key.

That would be for time critical situations though. If you had all the time in the world, anyone with TK would eventually succeed.

[UmbraLux]

For ease, I'd have Discipline limit Conviction when precision matters.  That would be some attacks (precise blade of telekinetic force vs blunt wall of force) as well as things like keys or pushing buttons on a keypad.