Ghost Story Book Club - Chapters 46-FINISH **MAJOR SPOILERS**

[habu987]

Was there ever a real chance of a Harry/Molly romance?  Even leaving apart the age difference, the sheer inappropriateness of a romance between a wizard and his apprentice, and the Doom of Damocles, you'd think even Harry would know better than to risk being torn limb from limb by the only dark power that even he fears.   I refer, of course, to Molly's mother, Charity.  And Michael would let her do it.

The age difference ain't bad, especially given their potential life span.  Molly's about 25 and Harry is 38 or 39, I believe.  

Molly isn't his apprentice anymore, or if she still is, she won't be for much longer.  Harry pointed out numerous times throughout GS that she was operating near or at full White Council levels.  In regards to the Doom, I think both Harry and Molly are a bit beyond that, in regards to things they worry about.

As far as Charity goes...all bets are off!

Really, though, I don't know how she'd react.  She has substantially warmed up to Harry in the last few books (although warmed up for her is a relative term).  If they know what Molly's been up to lately, who knows, Charity and Michael could see Harry being someone who could get her back on track.

[john4200]

That's true!  It's been stated over and over in the books that the Sidhe don't lie, but then Uriel states it plain as day here... curiouser and curiouser...

It is an unprovable assertion that a person cannot knowingly lie. It can only be falsified, but never proven. At best, an omniscient truthteller could verify it, but does Harry know an omniscient person who never lies? Maybe Ivy, but she can probably lie, and she is not quite omniscient, and she would not tell even if she did know. Maybe Uriel, although he is not omniscient or he can lie (or at least fake) since he either did not know, or pretended not to know, about Captain Jack's statement to Harry about the three friends in trouble. But Uriel is probably the closest thing to omniscient and truthful that Harry is likely to meet, and he called Mab's statement "Lies."

So, I think Harry's assumption that the Sidhe cannot lie is rather weak, especially with the evidence in Ghost Story where Mab comes very close to knowingly lying. Some have posted arguments that Mab did not REALLY knowingly lie, but I think that is splitting hairs.

[ColdFront]

i have a few questions that i cant think of a answer to
-so if Bob lost the fight to Evil bob would it be possible for Evil Bob to "eat" bob and gain all the knowledge
-did Harry instantly wake up after Uriel brought him back or was there a time elapse
-what does Demonreach exactly mean when it calls harry its custodian
-and since harry is winter knight and alive does he have to live in the NN or does he have to commute to chi

[nanuq]

and since harry is winter knight and alive does he have to live in the NN or does he have to commute to chi

Considering Demonreach's role in the resurrection, I'm assuming the island and Mab would have joint custody of Harry.

[Lord Kasavin]

I for one am a "dies alone shipper."

Romance is schlocky and for chicks who can't get dates (yes, I am being overly harsh and simplistic, sorry).  There are only two kinds of romances a guy like me likes in their fiction.  The first is a long time couple trying to make things work after being together so long.  Think Everybody Loves Raymond.  The second is a guy who through hard work, can do attitude, honesty, and good nature scores a chick outside his league.  When a character is one of the most powerful humans on the planet, the outside his league thing is off the table.

So, give me a Dresden continually confounded by love and all on his own trying to right by the people in his life.  I really do hope the "Die Alone" death curse is still in effect.

On another note, does anyone think the voice at the end of Changes might be an angel of death?  At first I thought it was Lash, and then I thought is was Mab, but upon rethinking the book, the angel of death, like the one waiting to take Forthill's soul, makes a lot of sense as well.

i have a few questions that i cant think of a answer to
-so if Bob lost the fight to Evil bob would it be possible for Evil Bob to "eat" bob and gain all the knowledge

Who knows, Bob sealed away Evil Bob, and then permanently split with him creating Evil Bob in the first place.  I suppose if the two rejoin there would be a battle to see who would take control and seal the other away.  More likely, Evil Bob remains as a villain and thorn in Harry's side.

-did Harry instantly wake up after Uriel brought him back or was there a time elapse

Presumably right away, but GS did the time skip thing to start, so it might have done it again.  Dresden's revival is in the hands of 3 nigh on immortals: Mab, Uriel, and Demonreach.  A month or a year is all relative to them.

-what does Demonreach exactly mean when it calls harry its custodian

Well, Dresden did form a simbiotic relationship with Demonreach in Turn Coat, turning it into a Spirit Sanctum or something similar.  We don't know anything more than that, except the White Council views the island as special.

-and since harry is winter knight and alive does he have to live in the NN or does he have to commute to chi

The Summer Knight killed in Book 4 lived in Chicago.  I imagine Dresden will be able to establish a residence in Chicago and use the Ways to go to the Nevernever when needed.

[huangjimmy108]

Okay, I reread the flash back part with he who walks behind. There is nothing I could find which shows that Harry had give the outsider a nickname or something like that. So if the speculation that Harry is some sort of a namer is true, it doesn't seem to have anything to do with his potential powers over outsiders. Please inform me if I miss something.

[rose29206]

I for one am a "dies alone shipper."

Romance is schlocky and for chicks who can't get dates (yes, I am being overly harsh and simplistic, sorry).  There are only two kinds of romances a guy like me likes in their fiction.  The first is a long time couple trying to make things work after being together so long.  Think Everybody Loves Raymond.  The second is a guy who through hard work, can do attitude, honesty, and good nature scores a chick outside his league.  When a character is one of the most powerful humans on the planet, the outside his league thing is off the table.

So, give me a Dresden continually confounded by love and all on his own trying to right by the people in his life.  I really do hope the "Die Alone" death curse is still in effect.

On another note, does anyone think the voice at the end of Changes might be an angel of death?  At first I thought it was Lash, and then I thought is was Mab, but upon rethinking the book, the angel of death, like the one waiting to take Forthill's soul, makes a lot of sense as well.

Who knows, Bob sealed away Evil Bob, and then permanently split with him creating Evil Bob in the first place.  I suppose if the two rejoin there would be a battle to see who would take control and seal the other away.  More likely, Evil Bob remains as a villain and thorn in Harry's side.

Presumably right away, but GS did the time skip thing to start, so it might have done it again.  Dresden's revival is in the hands of 3 nigh on immortals: Mab, Uriel, and Demonreach.  A month or a year is all relative to them.
Well, Dresden did form a simbiotic relationship with Demonreach in Turn Coat, turning it into a Spirit Sanctum or something similar.  We don't know anything more than that, except the White Council views the island as special.

The Summer Knight killed in Book 4 lived in Chicago.  I imagine Dresden will be able to establish a residence in Chicago and use the Ways to go to the Nevernever when needed.

Them's fighting words, haha. If that were true, then why would girls feel the need to drag their boyfriends to chick flicks?

And cold, man, cold.

While I hope (and trust) that romance won't become the center point of the DF, I do hope that Harry ends up happy with someone (or at least happy with friends). I took the "Die Alone" thing to be less referring to only romantic relationships than complete isolation (I mean, hey, most of the people in the series are not going to live as long as Harry can). I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

[MX]

Bah, Harry should live on DR when he needs to be in Chicago.  Any other time he can tell whomever of the Winter Court to give him ar room.  I mean, who else other than Lea or one of the Queens  might survive tat argument?

Of course, we might find out the other side of DR is hospitable for Harry and just as much of a power boost to Harry there as on the island.

[Glorificus]

i have a few questions that i cant think of a answer to
-so if Bob lost the fight to Evil bob would it be possible for Evil Bob to "eat" bob and gain all the knowledge

Since Bob cut off that "part", wouldn't Bob be bigger and stronger? Like in a fight, who would win, your amputated left hand  (Evil Bob) or all the rest of you (Bob)?

Morgan's sword - so it just sits in the scrap pile until Luccio or someone gets their skill back?

[dantesparadise]

I think someone in this forum had speculated before that maybe that Harry is some sort of Namer. The end of Ghost story, where Yuriel seems to be really upset when Harry shorten his name to Yuri but blink and said that calling him Mr. Sunshine is appropriate is quite a circumstancial evidence on that theory. What do you guys think?

the "El" Part of any angel name means God (i.e. MichaEL, GabriEL, RaphaEL, et.) so to remove that is highly disrespectfully bordering on blasphemous.  And I'm inclined to think angels take a dim view of blasphemy.

also Uriel = Light of God
Without the EL he would just be light and ymmv on this one but The Light is one of the the references to Lucifer so he would be really have a reason to demand his full name

[flamingmonkey----]

the "El" Part of any angel name means God (i.e. MichaEL, GabriEL, RaphaEL, et.) so to remove that is highly disrespectfully bordering on blasphemous.

Great insight!

[Cipher]

I am glad I am not the only fast reader, the book was waiting for me when I got home from work at 6p and I was done by 11p.  May have to re-read to pick up nuances but can wait until rest of the family finishes reading it. 

All I could think of when I was done was O.M.G.  (My daughter just finished and wants the next book now.)

I loved the Molly Enterprise & her Illusion power, Bob's pad, Butter's & Mortimer's stepping up to the plate when needed most.

I do think the Carpenter's will do right by Maggie.  I also think that Murphy is going to take the fact that Harry is back very hard since she had just acknowledged to herself that he may in fact be dead.  Harry will have to tread very lightly around her for a while.

[Mister]

-- Fitz -- what's his ongoing role? I think he was introduced pretty thoroughly for the relatively small part he played in the story. Will he be brought into the Chicago Alliance?

I suspect that Fitz will end up as Morty's apprentice.

[rbette1299]

Two quotes are explanation enough for me as to the identity of the whisperer.

"You...just get to whisper in my ear?" To whisper seven words, in fact, he said.

And a voice-very calm, very gentle, very rationale voice whispered in my ear, "Lies. Mab cannot change who you are." I struggled and twitched my fingers. "Five," I muttered, "Six. Seven. Heh." I couldn't help it. I laughed again. It hurt like hell and and felt wonderful. "Heh. Heh."

Seven word equals Uriel.

[john4200]

Two quotes are explanation enough for me as to the identity of the whisperer.

Seven word equals Uriel.

Was anyone doubting that the second whisperer was Uriel?

The question on most people's minds, I think, is who was the first whisperer. The dark shadow, the Fallen, from Changes, who was pointed out to Harry in Ghost Story by Uriel, but not identified by name. If I were Dresden, I certainly would have asked Uriel its name. I think Harry has a right to know that.