Custom Powers Master List (Work In Progress)

[Sanctaphrax]

Yes, of course. Thanks for catching that.

In a great number of ways. Self-Sponsored Magic is a type of Power, examples of which you can find on the Sponsored Magic Master List. Soulfire is a specific Power which may be Sponsored or Self-Sponsored depending on your reading.

Not sure what you mean.

[Locnil]

Well...

SPONSORED THAUMATURGY [-3]
Description: You have access to a sponsor's magical power.
Musts: You must select a Sponsor when you take this Power.
Note: If you have the Thaumaturgy Power, then reduce the cost of this Power by 1 and ignore the item slots that it normally provides.
Skills Affected: Conviction, Discipline, Lore
Effects:
Sponsored Thaumaturgy. You may cast rituals as though you possessed the full Thaumaturgy. This does not allow you to use Thaumattugy with the speed and methods of Evocation, and any special extra benefits provided by the selected Sponsored Magic are not available to you. But you may take Sponsor Debt normally.
Item Slots. Sponsored Thaumaturgy comes with two free Focus Item slots.

Basically, Sponsored Ritual, but upgraded to Thaumaturgy.

[Locnil]

Also, shouldn't it be Thaumaturgy at the speed and methods of Evocation?

[Sanctaphrax]

Not really a fan of Sponsored Thaumaturgy. Just take Thaumaturgy, and a Sponsor. Because the Sponsor isn't meaningfully affecting your spellcasting abilities.

(There really should be a -0 Power that just gives you a Sponsor.)

And yes, it should be Thaumaturgy with the speed and methods of Evocation. What can I say, my mind is elsewhere.

[Sanctaphrax]

So, is anyone willing to help me test Flurry?

Given how many words have been spent calling it broken, shouldn't someone be willing to try and prove it?

[ways and means]

Combat with equally strong fighter based characters seems the only way to test it.

So you have two skill 5 fighters one using a true aim variant the other using your ability.

This is my opinion on how such a fight would go without numbers.

Round 1
True Aim guy attacks martial arts masters, martial Master spends 1 mental stress to boost defense and takes weapons rating worth  of damage just over half the time.

Martial Arts guy them flurry's 3 (attacks at once) at a -2 as opposed to his opponents +1 the chances of these attacks hitting are less than 25%.

Martial Arts guy flurries with 2 (for 3 stress) instead for a -1 vs a +1 the chances of hitting are still less than a third. 

Round 2
True Aim guy attacks again and again Martial arts guy spends his 1 mental stress on a defense boost granting him just under 50% chance of not taking damage.
Martial Artist attacks using his last mental stress to have an slightly over 50% chance of damaging his opponent.

[UmbraLux]

A sponsor should affect what magic you can create - it's just up to the players to make it so.  Like most narrative related mechanics. 

So, is anyone willing to help me test Flurry?

Given how many words have been spent calling it broken, shouldn't someone be willing to try and prove it?

I'm not certain we were discussing Flurry specifically - it's why I clarified my statement to:

Multiple effective actions in one turn is overpowered. 

You could presumably limit them so much they aren't very effective but then why bother?

If Flurry can only use the two "Enhanced" attack modifiers it looks more like it's in the 'why bother' category.  If I have interpreted correctly, it's probably never going to be worth giving yourself a mental consequence to hit for one extra physical stress in an exchange. 

On the other hand, if you can add Holy Strike you do 7 extra stress at a cost of 8 mental.  Add Piercing Attack and you're doing 12 extra stress (assuming everyone has Armor:1 it's 17 more if you make it Armor:2) for a cost of 11 mental stress.  Add Whirlwind Attack and you'll do that 12 or 17 extra physical stress to everyone in the zone for 14 mental stress.  Do note, that's extra stress - a Claws opponent is doing 3-5 per exchange depending on armor.  Ms Flurry is doing that 3-5 plus the listed extra.

So it goes from worthless to near take out to OMG you wiped a zone!

Which is why I'll repeat:  Multiple effective actions in one turn is overpowered.

Edit:  Also have to say the +X mental stress cost seems overly complex.  I used a spreadsheet to calculate the numbers above.  Not going to pull up Calc in a game.   

[Silverblaze]

I'd be up for a test fight sometime.  I'm just not sure how such things work over the internet.   Never done it. 

My schedule is odd, but I could work something out.

I enjoy being proved wrong when I'm a pessimist. 

[THE_ANGRY_GAMER]

For a Sponsor Power, how about this:

Sponsor [-0]: Your character is sponsored by a higher power.
Effects: Sponsored assistance: You may invoke an aspect in exchange for a point of debt to your sponsore, as per the Sponsored magic rules (YS288)

[Tedronai]

It costs too much.

[THE_ANGRY_GAMER]

Wait, the sponsor power? [-0] is pretty good, I feel.

[Locnil]

It's a supernatural power. If you take it and nothing else, you don't get the Pure Mortal bonus. Meaning it's going to cost two points of Refresh.

That's what Tedronai was referring to, I think.

[Tedronai]

Locnil has it right, more or less.
The ability to have an entity separate from yourself loan you power (when doing so suits them, and for a price to be named at some later date, at that) is neither mechanically nor thematically sufficient, in my opinion, to deny a character the benefits of being a Pure Mortal.

[THE_ANGRY_GAMER]

Ah OK. Logically, though, if they have a Sponsor, they *aren't* a Pure Mortal anymore. If you want characters to keep some of their Pure Mortal refrsh bonus, you could make it a [+1] for that template. Already-supernatural characters should not get anything, though.

[Tedronai]

Logically, though, if they have a Sponsor, they *aren't* a Pure Mortal anymore.

This depends entirely on the nature of the Sponsorship arrangement.
The character need have no supernatural power of their own, or even any control over the power negotiated for by the player via Sponsor Debt.
Some nameless supernatural entity meddles in their lives offering to help them if they perform some favour in return at some future date.  That is all that is required, thematically, to justify the ability to take Sponsor Debt.
Simply interacting with powerful supernatural entities does not render someone no longer a Pure Mortal.

Already-supernatural characters should not get anything, though.

Which is why I advocate a cost of [N/A].