How to handle Cooperative Magic?

[JosephKell]

In Storm Front it is mentioned that up to 13 practitioners can work together to do a spell.

I assume this would only apply to Thaumaturgy, Evocation just seems too "quick and dirty."

Things for sure.
1.  Each participant must be involve for the entire act from the first Discipline roll until all shifts of power have been gathered (and the spell goes off).

Idea #1.
1.  Each participant must be involve for the entire act from the first Discipline roll until all shifts of power have been gathered (and the spell goes off).
2.  Each participant can add their own Lore to the complexity.  (This seems too good though.)
3.  Each participant can make their own declarations and invoke aspects to add to the complexity.
4.  Each can gather shifts of power to add to the spell.

But that taken all together means that 13 moderate Wizards can easily pull 40-50 shift thaumaturgies without skill declarations or fate points (assuming Lore ratings of 3 or 4).

Idea #2.
1.  Each participant must have an aspect similar to the purpose of the spell (e.g. Hell Hath No Fury and Left at the Altar are similar to a spell meant to curse an unfaithful man).
2.  Each participant must be involve for the entire process from the first Discipline roll until all shifts of power have been gathered (and the spell goes off).  Some declarations may be allowed to occur prior to the gathering of shifts.
3.  Pick one participant to be the leader, use that character's Lore to initially try to meet the complexity of the spell.  Only that character can gather shifts of power.
4.  Each participant can make declarations and invoke aspects to increase the effective lore to try to meet the complexity.
5.  Each participant (but not the leader) can do maneuvers to give the leader tags for the control rolls or to treat the leader's conviction as 2 higher for one control roll.

This aspect requirement is to reinforce the fact that cooperation requires a strong common belief.  While normal thaumaturgy doesn't require it, normal thaumaturgy doesn't require cooperation (and in Storm Front Dresden said that cooperative magic requires a shared belief in the purpose).  Also it means that each relevant aspect will probably be invoked (so each assistant can be expected to provide at least +2 from an aspect).

I think Idea #2 is better than Idea #1.

Thoughts?  Improvements?

[MWKilduff]

I think that the simplest method would be to have the leader and the cumulative lore be able to determine the complexity.  Each additional person after the leader can be tagged as an aspect of "additional power" to give the leader a +2 to either the complexity or discipline.

[Belial666]

In ritual magic, additional participants can take consequences and invoke aspects.
Sacrifices can only take consequences, usually unwillingly, even unto death.
Both are usually done in preparation and the casters have to be involved for the duration.


This means that with 13 wizards who each invokes an aspect and takes 2 mild consequences, you have a ritual complexity of 78 + Lore + other bonuses. Sacrificing three lives instead gives you a ritual complexity of 60 + Lore + other bonuses even for a single caster. Now, think about combining the two. Or, like, feeding a couple thousand people or devouring hundreds of powerful spirits for the ritual.

Yes. Ritual magic is scary. That's why dark wizards, who don't have a problem doing blood sorcery and ritual sacrifice, must be stopped at all costs. A single dark wizard who dominates enough people in a small town in the middle of nowhere then kills them all in a big ritual could cast a spell that erases New York from the map, makes him into a demigod, kills thousands of people that share blood anywhere in the world, or summons a major Abomination from beyond the Outer Gates.

[greycouncilmember]

I think it would be fair for two wizards to work together cooperatively in a good way with the same agenda.  it doesn't have to be dark magic that is cooperative.  Trying to locate somebody with divination who is behind a heavy duty ward requires a lot of power.  two good thaumaturgists should be able to work together.  At a minimum the other wizard should be able to add an aspect representing some power added to it.