Dresden Files MUSH

[Anher]

The main things I had on my high priority list were, in no particular order:
a fully functional circle system (to concentrate or isolate energy sources, etc.)

 I think that this is actually not terribly important with the way the rules are for casting in DFRPG. Mostly that would be something I would think a spell caster would use for color in a pose. I suppose you could code something in, but it just seems unnecessary to me.

[xanaphel]

The main things I had on my high priority list were, in no particular order:
a fully functional circle system (to concentrate or isolate energy sources, etc.)

Soem sort of fleshed-out magic system is definitely key.  Anher suggests that the details of the circle might be more than necessary, but it could be worth considering!

a 'mortal' world map with a nevernever analogue that would partially match up with the mortal world, but not tied directly to it, and various ways of crossing between the two. (i also planned for a third out of character realm)

That would be good.  Certain 'hub' locations that connect to the opposite realm.  Like a doorway into the other (uniquely-gridded) plane.

firearms

For sure.  Bang bang.[/quote]

tracking capabilities and a good map - tracking via scent, magic and also a 'mortal' tracking skill based upon environmental clues
burial sites with different age levels of bones for necromancy down the line

Scent is slightly tough because everything (and players) must have scents defined.  Of course, they could just be more generic scents unless otherwise specified...

'focus items', things like harry's power rings and shield bracelet which are imbued with energy and abilities

The ability to build a spell into an item would surely be needed, I agree.  Whether it's defensive or wand/potion-like.

without digging into my notes, those are things things i was most concerned about off the top of my
i think the idea of building a framework directly around the fate system might have definite benefits, although i have no idea how fred and co. would feel about it. once that framework was finished, it could then be fairly easily converted for any particular system based on FATE.

I sent a PM to Fred Hicks to see his thoughts and whether or not it's a feasible plan, we'll see what the response is!

if you set it up with DM and player tools, it'd be different from what i think of as a mud/mush but it'd be great to play in.

I'm thinking more standard MU* style, that way a DM isn't required for folk to play and have fun.  What would make this world come alive would be for people to be able to create magnificent plots on their own.

[derek]

I think that this is actually not terribly important with the way the rules are for casting in DFRPG. Mostly that would be something I would think a spell caster would use for color in a pose. I suppose you could code something in, but it just seems unnecessary to me.

Yeah, but I wasn't creating an online version of DFRPG.

I was working on a mud rather than a mush, so I was more concerned about those kinds of mechanics.

[Anher]

I was working on a mud rather than a mush, so I was more concerned about those kinds of mechanics.

I would think a lot of that sort of coding could be found and ported over from some other coding bits and then tweaked, at least for a MUD.

[derek]

Yeah but it's often just easier to write your own code for something like this, though. It's nice when you can grab big chunks and drop them in but it's not always feasible. Just kind of depends on what you're trying to do.

[xanaphel]

Yeah but it's often just easier to write your own code for something like this, though. It's nice when you can grab big chunks and drop them in but it's not always feasible. Just kind of depends on what you're trying to do.

I'd definitely take this approach - I much prefer a highly customized, perfectly fitted system.  Not always easier, but much more rewarding!

I'm leaning towards a mix of MUD/MUSH.  I have an eye on a MUD codebase, though I prefer the MUSH style focus on RP, which I plan to draw heavily from.  Surf down the middle and see about appealing to both sides, I figure.

[derek]

The main conceptual problem I ran into with creating a mud out of this world is figuring out how to handle experience for non-mortals. Because they grow differently (or at least the fae do) from learning/experience, it's going to create balance issues with mortal characters.

I never fully fleshed this out but what I'd intended to do is have mortals level up 'normally' on the mud, while non-mortals would be able to save up xp and go from one static set of abilities to the next...if that makes sense. They'd be able to either buy a new block of abilities/characteristics or even bump their character up to a more powerful form of critter.

(note: I intended to make remorting cheap and easy, so this played into that sort of gameplay.)


I suppose I'm drifting to the point where we might be better off discussing possible mechanics and such elsewhere but what the heck.

[xanaphel]

I'm more for MUSH-style trappings, myself.  I'm not sure the world lends itself quite so nicely to hacking down mobs and leveling.  Rather, XP through roleplay, weekly/staff awards, accomplished tasks (small XP bump when you successfully make a potion, for instance?).

The learning curve could fairly easily be represented by requiring more chunks of XP to be spent at a time, I think- a mortal could spend 1 point, where a fae might have to spend 5 at a time (and thus have to save it up).

Again, I suppose, this comes back to what makes DF suitable for a MU*.  For me, it's the depth of the world and endless possibilities for roleplay and character development.

And it gives me an excuse to finally make a cell phone code.   

[Lanir]

I'd be interested in this but I don't really have much to offer. I've tried helping people flesh out grids before and while the results are okay, it takes me way too long to be worth it. I'm good at making systems do what I want, but my coding skills are pretty lousy.

Thinking the main code you'd need would be something for the magic. Stuff like circles could just add to the difficulty, which you'd have to plug in manually in too many cases to be worth the headache of trying to automate a guessing system. Item code and rote spells would just be shortcuts that give the spell code values for you.

Scent would be a bit troublesome to really do right. Best you could get would be a generic system that works but doesn't tell you much or a more detailed, realistic system that was very patchy. Well sketched out in some places, virtually absent or extremely generic in others. Scent would also need to be on locations and would give you clues about some things if you go more realistic.

One odd question is MUSHes have varying degrees of consent. Would probably have to think a bit about that and make sure it plays nicely into the ideas DFRPG uses for concessions. This one's just a random thought, I need to re-read that section to see if it's actually something to think about or not.

[Linnemir]

What about Tiny Mux? Good, solid code, and it's been around for a long time. Brazil is still doing upgrades.

Or - what about one of the rp chat rooms? You/we could get a private room to start and jump directly into rp at http://worldbroadcastingsystem.com/ - Ask for an admin named ruthe, and I can guarantee that you'll get service with a smile without any deals with the fae!

[xanaphel]

Code: [Select]

[quote author=Lanir link=topic=172.msg1173197#msg1173197 date=1311135270]
I'd be interested in this but I don't really have much to offer. I've tried helping people flesh out grids before and while the results are okay, it takes me way too long to be worth it. I'm good at making systems do what I want, but my coding skills are pretty lousy.[/quote]
Once it gets going (hopefully very shortly; as soon as this book is done!), whatever you found yourself able/willing to toss in would be welcomed.

[quote author=Lanir link=topic=172.msg1173197#msg1173197 date=1311135270]Thinking the main code you'd need would be something for the magic. Stuff like circles could just add to the difficulty, which you'd have to plug in manually in too many cases to be worth the headache of trying to automate a guessing system. Item code and rote spells would just be shortcuts that give the spell code values for you.Yeah.  It shouldn't be too bad, really - just break magic down into its different types (Necromancy, Psychomancy, Thaumaturgy, etc...), and Evocation, and just define what can be altered/controlled by the type of magic.  I would like to make it generally more free-form, or at least, for evocation.  Such as "evoke fire at bob" would attempt a fireball at bob, whereas "evoke fire" would do so at the room, and "evoke fire as shield" would make a barrier.

Scent would be a bit troublesome to really do right. Best you could get would be a generic system that works but doesn't tell you much or a more detailed, realistic system that was very patchy. Well sketched out in some places, virtually absent or extremely generic in others. Scent would also need to be on locations and would give you clues about some things if you go more realistic.

I always wanted a scent system, honestly, but it's difficult to do correctly.  Every person could have a generic scent that changes depending on their activities: rooms they hang out in (stinky if they're a sewer lurker), flowery if they dose up regularly with perfume, and so on.

One odd question is MUSHes have varying degrees of consent. Would probably have to think a bit about that and make sure it plays nicely into the ideas DFRPG uses for concessions. This one's just a random thought, I need to re-read that section to see if it's actually something to think about or not.

A great point I hadn't even considered.  Myself, I lean more towards non-consensual, if for no other reason it allows for more fleshed out, unexpected play.  I would say either non-consensual, or only require consent for extreme action (i.e. murder).  If anything that might be ill towards you had to be consent, it always felt to me more like a narrative than a multi-person, cooperative story.  That might just be due to the game environments I grew up in though.

[xanaphel]

Or - what about one of the rp chat rooms? You/we could get a private room to start and jump directly into rp at http://worldbroadcastingsystem.com/ - Ask for an admin named ruthe, and I can guarantee that you'll get service with a smile without any deals with the fae!

Honestly, part of the reason for this is that I want to make a game!   

What about Tiny Mux? Good, solid code, and it's been around for a long time. Brazil is still doing upgrades.

I'm entirely unfamiliar with MUSH/MUX code, personally, and always felt they were handled a bit rough-around-the-edges.  To make a game especially unique, I found it best to start from the ground up... and if you start with a code base that has much existing, you spend too much time/effort modifying/removing the systems that aren't right, which often results in breaks...

The only hard part is nailing down the specifics - how stat systems should work, magic, and all that.  If it's more roleplay-geared, than the majority of it (like fight code and all that) isn't so essential.  As long as there's good support for dice rolls and folk to resolve disputes, it should give good grounds  to flourish.  I sent a message to Fred asking if it was possible to use the systems found in the DFRPG, and if so, that answers a lot of questions.  If not, it still shouldn't be too troublesome!

[Linnemir]

Honestly, part of the reason for this is that I want to make a game!   

I'm entirely unfamiliar with MUSH/MUX code, personally, and always felt they were handled a bit rough-around-the-edges.  To make a game especially unique, I found it best to start from the ground up... and if you start with a code base that has much existing, you spend too much time/effort modifying/removing the systems that aren't right, which often results in breaks...

Better your than me, then! I set up the TinyMux code on my pc, and actually had a few friends playing, but it was a ton of work and mainly beyond my knowledge base (Brazil helped me a whole lot!) 

The only hard part is nailing down the specifics - how stat systems should work, magic, and all that.  If it's more roleplay-geared, than the majority of it (like fight code and all that) isn't so essential.  As long as there's good support for dice rolls and folk to resolve disputes, it should give good grounds  to flourish.  I sent a message to Fred asking if it was possible to use the systems found in the DFRPG, and if so, that answers a lot of questions.  If not, it still shouldn't be too troublesome!

As a player, I always found the Mush/Mux etc. a difficult environment, but I don't use it often and just don't remember the codes to make things happen. I'm 'way more familiar with the chat room setting. It's also a plus to me that I don't need anything more than my browser to play there!

But I was just throwing the idea out ... no problem ...

[xanaphel]

Better your than me, then! I set up the TinyMux code on my pc, and actually had a few friends playing, but it was a ton of work and mainly beyond my knowledge base (Brazil helped me a whole lot!) 

As a player, I always found the Mush/Mux etc. a difficult environment, but I don't use it often and just don't remember the codes to make things happen. I'm 'way more familiar with the chat room setting. It's also a plus to me that I don't need anything more than my browser to play there!

But I was just throwing the idea out ... no problem ...

Using a MUD base, and starting from the ground up, allows me to make it as easy as possible for people to use, intuitive and simple.  Someone I know built a browser-based MU client that is most excellent, and I'll for sure set that up as well - so if you don't want to, or can't, use a desktop client, your browser is all that would be needed.

I usually felt like MUSH/MUX games had too steep a learning curve just to understand commands and everything, which is another reason I hope to stray from it.  I'd like to make somewhere that any Dresden Files fan can pop in and play, after learning some basic commands (movement, emote).  Complexity/depth for those who seek it, but not necessary upfront. 

[Linnemir]

I usually felt like MUSH/MUX games had too steep a learning curve just to understand commands and everything, which is another reason I hope to stray from it.  I'd like to make somewhere that any Dresden Files fan can pop in and play, after learning some basic commands (movement, emote).  Complexity/depth for those who seek it, but not necessary upfront. 

Totally agree on the learning curve. I used to play several mu's and still have the Simple Mu client on my comp, but if you don't use those commands regularly, you really *do* forget what's what and how to do which! I think that offering both options (client AND browser-based) would attract a much greater number of people. Gotta remember, not everyone who reads our beloved DF books is a computer geek or gamer!