So, LaFortier was *NOT* the prior Warden of Demonreach!

[g33k]

"Who was prior warden" has been a popular discussion.  I've seen some fan-theories, but none have fully convinced me.  LaFortier is a popular one, and I've thought it one of the better ones:  LaFortier being murdered not just to frame Luccio but (in the bigger picture) to remove the Warden, so someone else (e.g. Cowl) could move in and become Warden.

See below for the Bold Italic Underlined bit (B+I+U added by me for emphasis) in that final paragraph...

Priscellie:
In terms of how long someone is a warden, I'm sure it varies from case to case but how long does wardenship typically last?

Jim:
It depends on how quickly it gets you killed.

Priscellie:
Is that the only way out?

Jim:
I'd say it's not the only way out. You can definitely walk away from it or be dragged away from it or driven away from it. And then if somebody else comes along and challenges Demonreach then it's their island if your influence isn't there anymore. By the time Harry got there nobody had been there in a good long while because among the people who are in the know on the council it would be suicide to go try and do that. If one of the senior council guys got it all the other senior council guys would be like "yep he's the bad guy he's definitely corrupt and serving evil". And then Dresden walked into it and it was just such a stupid move they all kind of looked at him and went "I think he was he was being dumb? Do you think he was being dumb? Yeah it looks dumb. It looks like he was just being stupid, oh my god, we do need the firepower", you know, like that. The poor council, they find themselves so strapped for resources in so many ways that they keep having to tolerate Harry Dresden.

So:  nobody was Warden for "a good long while" before Harry.

Kemmler had been Warden up until 1961; then there were two others; then the gap (until Harry).

I think we can presume those two are known figures, named characters, in the Dresdenverse.  Possibly even significant ones (unlike the minor figure of LaFortier, whose only named/onscreen role is as "Mr. Body").  PROBABLY significant ones, since IIRC Jim has dodged this question more than once.

Was Margaret LeFay once a Warden of the island?  Maybe she lost it during some deep-Nevernever time-dilation, someone moved in & sniped it?

Maybe Ebenezer sniped it, to "save" her from the darkness there?  Then just... walked away, as Jim says can be done?

What about Justin?  Dark power looks right up his alley...
 
Can a nonwizard become Warden?
Maybe a Whampire, or a Faerie?
Because if we rule out the Senior Council (which WoJ says would push the other SC's to DefCon5) there aren't a lot of named wizards that could manage the deed...  Fewer still whom Jim would be so squirrely about not naming...

[Conspiracy Theorist]

Demonreach confirms he has had no warden on site for decades, my theory is that La Fortier took it and did absolutely nothing with it and this was so secret even Peabody had trouble ferreting it out, kill the wrong Senior Council Member you risk tipping off the others. The Red Court attack on Simon may have been a first attempt to identify and kill the Warden.

[Mira]

I'd say it's not the only way out. You can definitely walk away from it or be dragged away from it or driven away from it. And then if somebody else comes along and challenges Demonreach then it's their island if your influence isn't there anymore. By the time Harry got there nobody had been there in a good long while because among the people who are in the know on the council it would be suicide to go try and do that. If one of the senior council guys got it all the other senior council guys would be like "yep he's the bad guy he's definitely corrupt and serving evil". And then Dresden walked into it and it was just such a stupid move they all kind of looked at him and went "I think he was he was being dumb? Do you think he was being dumb? Yeah it looks dumb. It looks like he was just being stupid, oh my god, we do need the firepower", you know, like that. The poor council, they find themselves so strapped for resources in so many ways that they keep having to tolerate Harry Dresden.

Or is it that the Council feels that way out of ignorance?  Or call it fear or jealousy of the kind of power it puts in the hands of it's Warden?  So far the realities of the place while it does imprison the most dangerous and evil of beings, isn't in of itself shown make it or it's keeper evil.

[Conspiracy Theorist]

There were two North American based Senior Council member McCoy made a third later on, this meant there was already concern over them becoming a dominant faction, so inevitably the Wardenship could not go to either.

Fortier’s interests and power base was Africa and Asia he had no interest in North America making him the perfect candidate.

[spiritofair]

Wait a minute, where is it said that Kemmler was Warden until 1961? That's awful specific, and I don't remember seeing it anywhere.

[vincentric]

Probably an extrapolation for the time. Kemmler was supposedly Warden when he was finally stopped and some of the timelines list that as 1961.

[g33k]

Wait a minute, where is it said that Kemmler was Warden until 1961? That's awful specific, and I don't remember seeing it anywhere.

Probably an extrapolation for the time. Kemmler was supposedly Warden when he was finally stopped and some of the timelines list that as 1961.

Yes, 1961 as the date of Kemmler's death.  Not just "some of the timelines" but specifically the one adopted on Jim's official website (based on fan work... but collaborative & obsessively-cross-checked fan work!).  It may still be wrong (or get retcon'ed), but it's specific & clear:

1961: Kemmler is killed (again). Justin Dumorne acquires Bob the Skull from the smoldering ruins of his lab.

_{-- https://www.jim-butcher.com/timeline}

I honestly hadn't even considered that Kemmler might have allowed some other wizard to "snipe" Demonreach out from under him... I had presumed Kemmler would have left the genus loci with explicit orders to insta-kill any wizard who stepped foot on the island.

And, thus, to have retained the Wardenship until he died.

[Mira]

    1961: Kemmler is killed (again). Justin Dumorne acquires Bob the Skull from the smoldering ruins of his lab.

-- https://www.jim-butcher.com/timeline

I honestly hadn't even considered that Kemmler might have allowed some other wizard to "snipe" Demonreach out from under him... I had presumed Kemmler would have left the genus loci with explicit orders to insta-kill any wizard who stepped foot on the island.

And, thus, to have retained the Wardenship until he died.

Hint that it might be true, but I'm not positive on this point, in Cold Days did Alfred ask Harry to get Bob to translate all he needed to tell and instruct Harry or was it Harry's idea to steal Bob from Butters to help him understand what Alfred was showing and trying to tell him about.  If the former, how did Alfred know about Bob unless Kemmler had him on the island with him while he was Warden.

[vincentric]

Hint that it might be true, but I'm not positive on this point, in Cold Days did Alfred ask Harry to get Bob to translate all he needed to tell and instruct Harry or was it Harry's idea to steal Bob from Butters to help him understand what Alfred was showing and trying to tell him about.  If the former, how did Alfred know about Bob unless Kemmler had him on the island with him while he was Warden.

Harry took Bob from Butters to ask him how to kill Maeve. He then carried him to the island to examine the wards on the cabin. Alfred noticed Bob through his intellectus and used him to translate. Bob was just a convenient spirit Harry had with him, there was no indication of a prior meeting.

[Mira]

Harry took Bob from Butters to ask him how to kill Maeve. He then carried him to the island to examine the wards on the cabin. Alfred noticed Bob through his intellectus and used him to translate. Bob was just a convenient spirit Harry had with him, there was no indication of a prior meeting.

 Thanks, its been a while since I read Cold Days. 

[Conspiracy Theorist]

Demonreach is a super computer which only speaks in German, Bob was a German to English translator App.

[g33k]

Harry took Bob from Butters to ask him how to kill Maeve. He then carried him to the island to examine the wards on the cabin.

In between those is when Molly rescued Harry (and Bob) from Lacuna &crew.
It was Molly who told Harry the island was about to blow, which is why Harry went out.

... Alfred noticed Bob through his intellectus and used him to translate. Bob was just a convenient spirit Harry had with him, there was no indication of a prior meeting.

Alfred's first remark upon noticing Bob was, "Another one."
That sounds like Alfred hasn't seen Bob previously, but *HAS* seen the same "type" of spirit.  Maybe that was Bonnie; but also, maybe not:  Bonnie was still unborn.

(If Bonnie wasn't what Alfred was meaning, then who/what, and when?  Jim sometimes drops these tidbits multiple books ahead of time...)

[vincentric]

Pretty sure that it was Bonnie. Alfred had extensive interaction with her while working to save Harry.

[Mira]

Alfred's first remark upon noticing Bob was, "Another one."
That sounds like Alfred hasn't seen Bob previously, but *HAS* seen the same "type" of spirit.  Maybe that was Bonnie; but also, maybe not:  Bonnie was still unborn.

Or possibly, Alfred knew Evil Bob, who wasn't named at the time that Kemmler had him as far as we know, and while he knew that Bob was the same kind of of spirit, he didn't know that it was the same spirit, different personality... If that makes sense, Evil Bob blocked, so still Bob, but not that Bob....   So seeing it as the same kind of spirit that Kemmler had when he was Warden, he simply said another one, not realizing it was the same one with a few changes.