What Is the Purpose of An Arcane Library?

[GM_Withdrawal]

So after reading the section of the quality of workshops I am a little confused. The Resources skill entry says that the difficulty or complexity is limited by the quality of your workshop. So if I have a Superb Lore, but only a mediocre workshop would I be limited to only +1 complexity thaumaturgy spells? If not what does the Arcane Workspace limit?

[Deadmanwalking]

An Arcane Workshop appears to be a remnant from a previous rules iteration, and currently have no use. It's role has been entirely subsumed by using Resources to make Declarations on Thaumaturgy.

An Arcane Library limits arcane research (such as looking into what the hell that thing you just fought is), and is thus an extraordinarily useful thing to possess.

[Doc Nova]

As is, Deadmanwalking is spot on.  To give them function, however, I could easily see them acting as a modifier to Lore when assessing a powerful foe.  Likewise, I could see them modifying your thaumaturgical studies, as well as crafting enchanted and focus items, as well as potions.

Keep in in mind that when I say "modify" I am meaning the idea of compatable and comparable skills where you Resources could either reduce or increase your appropriate skill by +/- 1, making an arcane library helpful.  Of course, if you want them to be even more of an influence, you could hard cap Lore and such at the library's level...or reverse my above idea...have the library provide the base level and have your Resources then modified by Lore, or whatever.

I could also see a flat ruling that most Catches can not be learned without access to an arcane library, at least not without solid justification.

[Mitchell Powers]

So after reading the section of the quality of workshops I am a little confused. The Resources skill entry says that the difficulty or complexity is limited by the quality of your workshop. So if I have a Superb Lore, but only a mediocre workshop would I be limited to only +1 complexity thaumaturgy spells? If not what does the Arcane Workspace limit?

This was talked about on another post that I saw. And from everything I've read they are very useful.
(Seriously recommend viewing this post as it has responses from the Developer(s)
The 2 that I have seen responding on the boards are Iago (Fred) and  LCDarkwood (Lenny) )
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,17919.msg807955.html#msg807955
But remember to look at the date on the posts because some changes have occurred and they have
updated and clarified things.


First(Unless I've got everything WRONG)
- They do not take away from your skill.
- What they do is give you the power to make declarations, and invoke aspects to help you meet the complexity of a thaumaturgic ritual.

Specifically 'well stocked workshop','made my own tools', 'crafted symbols for spell', etc....
(Basically whatever you can come up with that is reasonable and you can get your GM to agree with!)

HOWEVER, that being said, under workshop it also states in the rules that the
QUALITY of the item that you can create is capped by the rating of your workshop.

So if you have a workshop rating of 1 you can only make

See page YS320 where it talks about this in some detail.

Those circumstances revolve mainly
around three attendant factors: tools, materials,
and time.

And page YS249 where it goes into 'Tools and Trappings' and page YS312 where it talks
about 'preparation' and how it can increase your difficulty if you DON'T have the tools
(or access to them) that are needed.


Also note that the 'Arcane Workshop' is really just a specialty workshop, which is why it is now
just under 'workshop'. 

Simalarly for the Arcane Library and Sanctum, the arcane library can come into play when doing
research on an adversary, condition, place, ritual, etc....whereas the sanctum can come into play
for special prep, above and beyond what you would normally need.

Rick gives a large list of possible aspects on his blog at http://www.rickneal.ca/?p=639

But it is most certainly not a 'remnant' or useless from a pure numbers standpoint, and
 it can add a lot of 'flavor' and background to your character as well.

It is in point of fact of GREAT USE if you plan on doing a large amount of Thaumaturgy.

You can more easily expect to get your DM to approve those Aspects you want to make your complexity
requirement if you actually HAVE those Libraries, Workshops, and Sanctums!!!

Side note to remember - Thaumaturgic Effects tend to be stationary (per the devs)
and wards must be attached to Thresholds.(Although they are so wonderful to make!!)

And, crafting with Thaumaturgy, Transformation is only a skill check IF you are
doing something that could normally be done with the skill. Full on transmutation...now that
starts racking up the complexity FAST.

So you COULD make some things if you have the raw materials but not have the workshop(s).

Ex: You could have a thaumaturgy ritual mix together all the ingredients
for a cake(if you had the ingredients on hand), then heat the cake batter to bake it,
and then at the end you have a cake, but didn't actually change anything directly with
transformation. ( but you would still have to have the ingredients and such ). And you don't need
to increase any duration, because nothing that you made is being held together by the magic.

This is all just my $0.02 on how I've read the rules and poured over the forums
for the Developer's response to these sorts of questions.

That is how it looks, unless the developers come in and say I am completely off the mark.


Hope this helps someone else.
I know this gave me fits for a couple days tracking it all down
initially since I want to play a Thaumaturgist and NEED ways to get those complexities down!!

[theDwarf]

That is how it looks, unless the developers come in and say I am completely off the mark.


Hope this helps someone else.
I know this gave me fits for a couple days tracking it all down
initially since I want to play a Thaumaturgist and NEED ways to get those complexities down!!

Thank you.  I had already located most of these but it is good to have them all gathered in one place!  Also, I figure my response is a good way to help your post stand out.



To reiterate and expand slightly, beyond the sections on spellcasting the following is a list of applicable pages on workspaces probably applicable to researching or building things using arcane labs & arcane sanctums including possible ramifications if they are insufficient:

• pp.139-140 has basic information on workspaces (library, lab, workshop, arcane library, arcane sanctum)
• p.141 has brief blurb on Research & Lab Work, etc, which may be of use
• p.249 has information on preparation in Tools & Trappings.
• p.312 has information of the affects of being Ill-Prepared (which is likely what having too low level a lab or library would cause)
• p.320 has more on prep and workspaces.  In this case it is talking about workshops but still applicable. Also on Jury-Rigging.
• I would also add pp.322-323 on Resources which includes info on the probable legality of items, etc.

So, hope that all helps some