My take on Ferrovax.

[Wordmaker]

Remember though that Harry's still a PC, and at the highest campaign level, Submerged, the skill cap is Superb.

[Belial666]

Harry at Storm Front was submerged. He could barely take on one lousy demon.
Harry at Death Masks is considerably stronger. One of the weaker Denarians is in his league or just a bit over.
Harry at Dead Beat has grown in power. He almost matches wills with Corpsetaker and captures the Erlking.
Harry in Small Favor kicks serious ass. Magog, Thorned Namshiel, Tessa can attest to that.
(changes spoiler)

(click to show/hide)

Harry in Changes as Winter Night is major badass. It takes an entire group of the Lords of Outer Night to contain him.

So yeah, I doubt he's still anywhere near submerged level.

[Wordmaker]

How about some spoiler tags for those of us who haven't finished Changes?

[Archmage_Cowl]

i did my own personal stats for mister ferro, but they use so many house rules you guys would laugh at them so i'll simply say... he's tough. I also statted mab and i made him stronger than mab so yeah... dont mess with mister ferro lol.

P.S. Not sure how this is relevant to the discussion.

[vultur]

Hmm. Personally I'd figure Mab, Titania, Ferrovax and the like at about -50 refresh cost, Lea/Eldest Gruff in the -30 to -40 range (my stats for Leanansidhe came out to -38 Refresh; EG is likely somewhat weaker), and the Faerie Ladies and Senior Council -26 to -30 (the given stats for the latter two seem way low to me).

[Belial666]

Except that it would take the entire White Council (Senior+Wardens+all qualified wizards) to overcome Mab or Ferrovax, if they could even do it. That's not only 20 pts of Refresh above them.