Questions on White Court Virgins

[Crion]

Now that one of my friends has been asking more details about the White Court, he has the urge to play a White Court Virgin, which has lead to even more questions. I've been okay for the most part, but I still have my concerns.

Just to be certain I read this correctly:

1) White Court Virgins only have Incite Emotion and Emotional Vampire as their powers, and these do not cause Hunger problems.
2) They can use these powers "safely," but it does ride the edge of changing over.
3) When a White Court Virgin feeds (i.e. uses Emotional Vampire), they make the transition to becoming a full White Court Vampire.
4) White Court Virgins can purchase other White Court Vampire powers (and need to take Feeding Dependency for it), but this leaves them ravenous (rightful compels of the high concept or possibly taking enough Hunger stress to be Taken Out).

Did I misread any of those points? I'm a bit shaky on #3 and slightly concerned with #4, which is why I'm bringing it up.

So, unless I am misreading it, when a White Court Virgin feeds with Emotional Vampire, they will end up killing their victim and making the change? Or can they keep control and just take "sips," even though their Hunger isn't really out in force yet?

For the most part, I'm mainly curious how people have handled White Court Virgins in their games. Have you had anyone shift from being a Virgin to a full Vampire? What was the cause of that change?
Also, would you allow a White Court Virgin to acquire other emotions to "feed" upon, or a ranged Incite Emotion? (I'm personally against it, but again, that's just my thought).

Any thoughts and views from other eyes besides my own would be appreciated!

--Crion

[John Galt]

1. True.  If they want to take any more powers (usually inhuman strength, speed, etc...) they need to take feeding dependency.
2. Correct.
3. No.  Only if they kill.  They roll discipline against the value of the power they used to avoid taking a hunger stress hit.
4. They're only ravenous after using the powers.  If the WCV takes a supernatural powers but never uses them he doesn't need to feed.  This is straight from the books.  Thomas only looks ravenous after he exerts a lot of superhuman strength or speed.

No.  When a White Court Virgin feeds he can stop whenever he wants to.  When a GM makes a compel against his high concept he is compelling him to feed because there is a strong emotion that the WCV likes nearby.  The WCV gets a fate point for that compel.  He then rolls discipline to resist that temptation.  Whether his roll succeeds or not is irrelevant to the compel.  The compel was for the temptation to feed, not feeding itself.  The GM can't compel a WCV to kill his victim without dishing out about about a hundred fate points unless the PC is the unluckiest dice roller in existence. 

Remember, each time he feeds it's a mental attack of Deceit vs. Conviction.  So to kill your victim in one feeding you'd need to roll +7 more deceit than your victim rolled conviction.  It's much more likely that it'd take about five feeding attacks to take out a victim (kill him/her) and thus any WCV has five tries to resist through a discipline roll.

[Ala Alba]

Actually, if I'm remembering Blood Rites correctly, Thomas(or someone) mentions that the first time they feed is ALWAYS fatal. Unless he was just talking about the first time they have sex.

[Wordmaker]

Thomas was referring specifically to his family. Many White Court families keep their children in the dark about their true nature, so the first time they have sex, they're almost guaranteed to end up fatally feeding from their partner and becoming a vampire. It's reasonable to deduce that a WC virgin who was aware of her condition could attempt to restrain herself.

I don't actually remember if Thomas indicated that the first feeding had to be fatal in order to turn the person.

What's also worth considering is, for lust-feeding WC vampires, is it at all possible for them to have sex without feeding?

[John Galt]

Actually, if I'm remembering Blood Rites correctly, Thomas(or someone) mentions that the first time they feed is ALWAYS fatal. Unless he was just talking about the first time they have sex.

True.  There's two explanations.

1. The RPG thought a True Mortal with only incite emotion was a boring build and thus changed the WCV from the lore.
2. The only reason the first time was always fatal for the Raiths was because they were told they were mortal since birth and they feed on lust (lots of fun) so they have absolutely no reason to even try to make a discipline roll on their first feeding.

I tend to think the second one is true.  Inari had no clue she could hurt Harry by seducing him, and I imagine that's true for all of Lord Raith's virgin children.  Remember that White Court victims die in pure sexual ecstasy so there's obviously no indication to the unlearned WCV that they are hurting their victim.

[John Galt]

What's also worth considering is, for lust-feeding WC vampires, is it at all possible for them to have sex without feeding?

I imagine there's only two ways.

1. They're raped
2. They have sex and through it experience true love, and thus are cured anyway.

[Deadmanwalking]

I'm not sure that first one would work to avoid feeding actually. I'd think only the person they feed on needs to feel lust for their power to kick in...and it kicking in as a defense mechanism makes a great deal of sense.

Disturbingly enough, I actually have a White Court character in my game who has that as part of her backstory.