When I was first recruiting for the game, I was lucky to get 4 people. They had a blast. Then it was 6. Then I got pickier on recruiting. Then it was 7 and 8 and I "closed" the table. Well, one old friend and original invitee worked out a whole character concept with one of the other 8 players. Fine, fine, he can play, but 9 is a lot. Then ANOTHER guy did much the same and it was 10 players, but only 9 made it to last game. Now it looks like one of them is moving away, so I'm down to 9 ... but I am still getting requests. I'm turning them away, but it kinda sucks. I would split the group into two groups of 6 and have two decent-sized groups, but they don't wanna do that ... sooooo ...

I don't feel like I'm doing anything crazy with the game. Everyone seems to be having fun every time we play, and that's really the important part. I have not really challenged them a whole lot, though the Denarian they faced last game gave them a good run for their money.

More tools for me, that's all I want. :-)

I've seen the character sheet in LibreOffice and the .NET application ... each have their own merits.

I'm thinking of something that looks like a Joomla! module or other web plug-in that could be added to a bulletin board for play-by-post folks. It would be a way for the GM to summarize different aspects, skills, powers, etc. as well as offer "save to PDF" for the players.

Anything like that out there? If not, is there any demand for such a thing (beyond myself)?

I'd be willing to pay a bounty for it, or I may be willing to develop it, myself ... depends on how much "free time" I have in the coming weeks.

@sinker - I have explained all of the stress things you suggest, and we are at about 10ish games, now. It is very common to get through a combat with very few characters having a scratch on them (consequence). My 3rd plot was more tighly paced and they ran into some stiffer competition (some Denarians). However, a group of 9 characters with 25-30 skill points WILL take out a heavyweight bad guy just due to the combat system. I've had to fudge that quite a bit to have "boss fights" ... the bosses always have to get extra attacks. Once the group was over 6, there were times the enemy would get one or two shots, then done. A creative group of folks with fate points will ruin your boss in an exchange that is 6 of them, 1 boss, 6 of them, 1 boss ... repeat until one of them might be scratched and/or the boss is dead.

I have had NPC's concede, but with the exception of a government agent, it's all stuff they would rather have dead. They assume it works the other way, too ... which is so not the case. The next plot will be a lot tougher in this regard because most of their enemies will be "human." Of 9 players, 3 are wizards, and they can heft crazy damage once or twice a game. It's one thing to drop a Denarian by soaking up a moderate consequence and dropping 8-10 damage on them. It's another to slice a human in half in the same fashion (I'm sorry, didn't you READ the First Law?).

As far as "good" and "bad" being different, that's a personal take. I've heard from the makers of this game, "The powers of darkness are always willing to help." And I let the players know, "Hey, there's power out there if you want it." Of course, they are terrified of that. They are more afraid of having "strings attached" than anything. I get that from Harry's world, right? Sure, Mab is more than happy to offer you power. All you gotta do is ... whatever she wants. The idea that they have different impact on the world is more of a Star Wars idea - there is light and dark and they affect things differently. The dark side guys have lightning and choking and stuff. I think it's a good companion for this game because of how Butcher has presented the power brokers in the Dresdenverse.

I posted this as a reply in another place, but decided it deserved it's own thread. I'm curious what other GM's think of this concept and there is a question at the end on which I would like some feedback.

Karma Stones

The world of urban fantasy is rife with shady actions and heroic feats. Particularly heroic things, you know, the kind that would make the evening news, should have a reward of some sort. Especially dirty deeds also deserve "special" treatment, and this is the work of "karma stones."

I keep two piles of glass stones (one white, one black) with the GM's stuff. When players do something particularly douche-bag-ish, I hand them a black stone. This is, of course, "bad karma." Saving a little girl from a burning building (that the party did not set on fire in the first place) is the kind of thing that might earn a white stone, or "good karma." At the end of a recent adventure, we tallied up over 25 Red Court dead - a force that was kidnapping and taking from all over the city. In addition to refresh and normal character growth, I also ended up rewarding every member of the party a white stone.

To "cash in" a stone means to be granted a favor from the forces of light (or darkness). You are saying, "I've done this for your side, can you help a brother out?"

To "carry" a stone means you are trying to accumulate a particularly powerful positive or negative energy. The concept is based on "The Force," if you will, with particularly powerful dark or light characters being granted additional abilities after having 3 or 4 stones accumulate (GM discretion).

A black stone might be spent to help "enhance" the reputation of a mobster. It might be spent to "darken" an aspect. It could be spent to bolster particular skills or stats. Darkness always has "strings attached," so such upgrades to a character sheet should come with a form of "payment" or at least balance with positive and negative (reputation works both ways - other mobsters may fear and respect you, but the cops surely don't like you). I have allowed players the opportunity to get rid of "bad karma" by turning hits into misses in a fight, or otherwise allowing different outcomes that reflect "bad luck," not just darker soul energy. If a player uses a stone to enhance their skills, it should be a +2, -1 effect. The Dark Side can make you powerful quickly, but there should be a cost elsewhere.

White stones are easier because, as Uriel puts it, "We are big fans of free will up here." Players have used these to make hits when the probability was far stacked against them doing so. They have used them to enhance skills. Some have simply used them as they would a Fate point (which I typically will not allow if they do not actually have a fate point to spend). If a player uses a stone to enhance a skill, it should be a free-and-clear +1 to that skill.

Most of all, like everything else in DFRPG, have fun with it. If it makes your game less fun, stop doing it. I introduced it as part of the very first game session, and here are the effects it has had on my group:

• I did not tell them anything about it. When a Russian mobster in the group started to "shoot first and not bother asking questions," he earned his first black stone. People asked, "What does that mean?" I just smiled and replied, "What do you think it means?" "Well ... those aren't fate points, right? We have these clear ones ..." "No, it's not a fate point ..." After awhile, he earned a second one for "breaking and entering," though later, I found his purpose wasn't as sinister as I originally thought. Even so, now he had two. Toward the end of the first session, a party member protected and mended a "bad guy" that was fleeing and would normally have been shot and killed. After patching him up, I gave him a white stone. (He would normally have been rewarded with information, but this NPC could not really give any - so it was an act of kindness without other "compensation.") Now the players all started chattering. Well, those must be "good," and his must be "bad."
• During the second game, when the mobster had "hit" one of his targets, I offered that he could get rid of a black stone if he wanted to miss, instead. This touched off another chain reaction at the table, and again, much to my own sadistic amusement. "Now I know they are bad!" people said. "Well," I started, "They are not necessarily bad. They just mark important deeds. What would you like to do with them?" Everyone was clueless. "You guys don't really know what they are for, but I'll tell you at this point some of what you have guessed. They are 'karma stones' and are earned by particular actions."
• After Plot 1, Game 2, the mobster called me and e-mailed several times on how to "atone" for the stones. "But, they don't work like that," I tried to explain, but it was no use. By the time the next game rolled around, he was donating to Eastern Orthodox orphanages and all kinds of things to get rid of them. "They haven't even impacted you," I said, still incredulous at the (over)reaction I was getting.
• The group has expanded a lot. Next game will either be "Plot 3, Game 5," or "Plot 4, Game 1," so we have had many good games over the past year. Last game, there were 9 players at the table. It has been extremely hectic, but when I threatened to split the group into two smaller parts, it was roundly vetoed. The group is VERY cohesive and compatible. Part of this is because the entire table have turned into lily-white crusaders. This is a bit of an unexpected side effect, and not always desirable for an interesting game.*
• The group does not "accumulate" the stones. They are viewed as a sort of currency, and I suppose they were sort of intended that way. However, the cumulative effects have never made it into my game. When the characters get "into a jam,"** they spend the stones freely. I'm not sure what I can do to get them to save them up and "discover" the additional impact. I may just have to tell them, and probably at the end of this plot, I'll do so. I do not give them out lightly - probably 6-10 fate points get spread around for every karma stone. You would think this would make them less apt to spend them, but not so.

*Q1: The players see EVERYTHING as black and white. Even US government entities, clearly neutral parties of other varieties, and the Winter Court (who don't really process "good" or "bad") are "black." If you have read Harry Connolly's novels (and you should), they have an "all enemies" attitude. How can I get them to see shades of gray? They owe the Winter Court a favor (residual from Plot 1 - they did something with highly un-anticipated consequences), and they cannot understand that WC is on the side of WC. They fear that this favor will be dark and sinister (it's honestly not, but I'm SO tempted just because of their reaction) and will taint their souls evermore. Anyone else have a game out there like that? I'm not even talking about actions worthy of a black stone (some of which might even have POSITIVE game ramifications), just anything that isn't snowy white. It's weird. Especially for some place as dark as the Dresdenverse. What do you guys think?

**Q2: Getting someone to mark off a stress or two is like asking them to shred their character sheet. We've played probably 10 games, plus e-mail, Facebook, and phone calls with several players, and the idea of hitting max stress is unthinkable. In the last game, I had a player finally hit max physical stress and get knocked out. During the rest of the fight, he made a new character. Seriously. Look, damage isn't fun, but even so, it's not fatal, either. How useful is a dead guy? This was a fight with a Denarian and there were free coins in the area. The Denarians were actively recruiting and would see this guy no differently. Why kill someone you can have on your side? But the players absolutely do not think about that - to be at max stress is equal to death in their minds. Perhaps too much D&D where 0 HP = Dead? Despite repeatedly explaining that "stress" is not really the same as "hit points," they all view it this way and will "pull out all the stops" to avoid checking that last box. This is a group of 9 characters, I might add. So, even toward the end of a fight with 8 of them still standing, they just can't bring themselves to "pass out."

These do look amazing and are a great idea ... but ... "declaration" is misspelled "delaration."

I have just been using clear glass beads, but something with more "heft" would be nice. I also have a "karma" system in my game whereby a particularly douche-like action earns a "black stone" and advancing good causes earns a "white stone." I started this system before the players really understood how to even use the markers (and they are still largely clueless), but they became terrified of me bringing them a black stone very quickly ... which I found greatly amusing.

Another approach:

A "shadow" may have Free Will. As "malleable" as the stuff which contains the shadow, or some such line. This is not defined explicitly, but I would say the longer the "copy" lived in the host, the more chance of straying from the original.

A Denarian is evil. While an interesting plot point akin to something in a Simon R Green novel, there has to be a line, somewhere. To make a Denarian change sides would be messing with a precious few artifacts (30) in a way that would not normally make sense. The Swords of the Cross "can't be used for evil" or they are unmade. A Denarian that reaches redemption ... I would similarly "unmake" and remove from the world (re-ascend?).

A character who is living with a "demonic copilot" could be persuasive enough to overcome the shadow. However ... the forces of darkness are always willing to help, and the more a player drew upon that power, the more I would compel them in morally gray situations.

Wards = Your will ...

You may not desire to kill anyone, but there clearly is a reason why killing with magic is different than killing with a big rock. As mentioned above, if your wards kill someone, that goes on "your tab." You may not be considered a huge threat (the first time) and it may be pretty explainable as "self defense," but it's your magic that killed them in most cases. YS277 makes it pretty clear that "landmines" in your wards are your responsibility.

I've come around to thinking of this as "The Wardens will want to have a talk with you" and they better like what they hear if you don't want separation anxiety with your cranium.

Personally, I would put this on a geometric scale if you are using Thaumaturgy or Evocation to accomplish it. Any "maneuver" spell is a default of 3 shifts - something that would put an aspect on you or change your nature. I would think that is a "minimum" starting place, and then I would say you want 1 Fate worth of ability - add 1 shift for a 4 total. Then double and add for each additional. 2:3+3, 3:7+3, 4:15+3, etc. Mythic strength would be 6:63+3 ... likely beyond a reasonable thaumaturgy working without "Blood of David Banner."

At least ... that's how I'd do it.

Edit: Oh, and duration. I'd add 1 shift for every rung on the time ladder you wanted this buff to last. You get "instant" by default, but if you want to be the Hulk for a few hours, it's going to cost you another 7-10 shifts.