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Messages - jonas

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286
DF Spoilers / Re: (false)peace and the second coming
« on: January 19, 2018, 07:29:03 PM »
I wouldnt say complicating things, just trying to tease out your underlying assumptions.  So, if Im up to speed with your theory, your seeing his/her roles as:

War Against the Universal Order, but also War Against TWG, specifically./
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well yes and no, I don't think TWG himself is going to twig to be a secret bad guy or something, but the order of events that lead to the coming Apocalypti is something set into motion by the way the universe is ordered itself... Say Mab and Titania are gone(with those falling stars and Mab's word) so the Mothers themselves are enforced into try to entreat a new balance? MS especially as the 'creator' and her shelf full of death jars makes me think of her as the holder of God's 7 bowls of wrath for instance.

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Meanwhile you see their expected Traits as:

- Magically Powerful
- Politically Powerful, Mundane
- Politically Powerful, Supernatural
- Atheist
- Jewish (genetic)
- Proud (as in the Sin)
- Prone to Clandestine methods
- Deceitfully Charming
- Vocally Anti- TWG
- Personally Pro-Satan/Pro-hell
- Empowered by the Forces of Judeo-christian Hell (Specifically)
- Associated with Rulership of Babylon (Literally or Symbolically?)


That about sum up your Antichrist vision?
The pieces I see in play, yea. Obviously theres some overlapping.
Wanna get real technical about it. I think Harry is THE Anti-Christ, Marcone is the one who is going to represent his dark rise and Nic is going to be the Spiritual identity we think of in it's association.
It's a theory woven through Yeat's second coming and the Gyre. I think the repeating Archatypes of Harry and Marcone equate to previously being Harry/Lucifer and Marcone Being TWC(not in a TT way, in a starborn generational way) every time history repeats itself it inverts from last time(with... apparently people/immortals from previous era's being able to fall or rise based upon being alive during said inverse actions of fate.
i'd have to organize my thoughts a bit on this one,(the inverse is hard to explain but there are examples) But basically TWC saved us by being good, Harry's going to save us by becoming Our Monster. The actual evil of TAC(the anti Christ)is going to be spread around in a balance... which I think Harry will be The Deity all other deities balance out, He'll literally be one whole side of a pantheon that everyone else balances this aspect or that one. Everythings going to change in the cosmic order.

287
DF Spoilers / Re: Queen Succession Rules
« on: January 18, 2018, 08:04:54 PM »
And yet they specifically ordered the courts the way they were for a reason, and in all of them the mirror/ladder leads up. Makes little sense to abort the process that leads to the growth from one position to another, inhibit sure.
You kill a mothers child though and the new word for the description becomes Crone, like another name for the Mothers, those who were. Another point for the Queens birthing something and the Mothers proper being from the age before that's already passed by.(also MW reference to not my knight, Scarecrow/fearbringer possessed 'served the queen since before human memory')
Spiritual entities mixed with humanity can give birth, Mab basically gave birth to Harry's Id. Even beyond the mortal aspect of pregnancy the Knight is the only one with the proper key to create a 'kid'/entity.
The references are all over how it's described in SK, Consort to the queens, different duties for each, ect.(consort is specifically a lover,)
This is why I ask about the nebulous nature of your theories. When one point is made against them(that the knight actually could take the Lady.. or that the separation of the lady from the queens power was taking place in CD) they simply change that bit while resisting the original premise from being faulty. It's like fighting the Dark Arts professor Snape! Argue(debate, whichever you prefer) this one with me now, here, without avoiding points you don't like in favor of 'how you can make it work' for you. That just sits too close to fitting facts to suite the theory for me. Your making assumptions on when and how the mantle would be destroyed I wish to refute entirely. I'll bring my bottle of disproof, I got it from the guy who was drinking the disbelief ;)

*well, i'm not personally offended about being a fool, but considering me coming to your aid when others bash my fellow forumites I AM offended as a theorist I guess. Should know better not to be That wholey flippant against an opinion based idea your not sure others might have here.

288
DF Spoilers / Re: Queen Succession Rules
« on: January 18, 2018, 06:03:38 PM »
Look at what Maeve was actually trying to do and even Lea, being beyond the WQ's control. They were trying to separate the identity from Winter rule itself. Not just replace Mab. The Mantle is spirit, tied into the forces of creation itself, the mantle itself is a container for an elemental power of reality. Destroy only the container and the spirit itself is free to find it's own manifestation, assuming it doesn't just stay with the one it already has made in response. unless intentionally subverted into a new form, as would be simply remaking the mantle. So it's impossible to take the mantle apart without birthing something new in response even if directly from a higher up to maintain a balance instead of from the resulting action itself. Probably why they are called the Mothers(also they created all the mantles, that's where they got the title so..)

289
DF Spoilers / Re: Queen Succession Rules
« on: January 18, 2018, 04:44:08 PM »
*doffs hat dramatically* Just don't call me Quinten Coldwater and I shan't be offended.

From the perspective of the destruction of the Lady mantle, the Knight could possible impregnate the Lady as long as she didn't give birth.  Since Lily and Maeve didn't give birth, given the continued existence of their mantle, I think we can assume the Knight didn't impregnate either.  I think it may be possible for the Lady to push the envelope to such a degree that they could have sex with and, if so, get impregnated by the Knight.
Transformation, Our prophet Einstein says so. If it didn't realign the courts directly it would transform the Mantle from it's current formation... in essence giving birth to a new form anyway.
*wait now, where's our current Molly's Jenny Greenteeth/high priestess?

290
DF Spoilers / Re: Queen Succession Rules
« on: January 18, 2018, 08:02:36 AM »
I think being sexually frustrated is part of the Sidhe Lady experience so a knight loophole is out of question.
Na see I figured this out too talking on facebook with others. It's summers opposition to Winter that changes the role and the outcome, the Winter Consort is meant to take the Lady, But Summer is inherently different. It focus's more upon the Husbandry aspect in the knight. The way Fix doted on her, followed her commands with a genuine affection, worried over her when she was emotional even. All the signs are there. So idk what precise things the Summer Lady has going for her celibacy. But the Knight wouldn't push. Notice also such suggestions are what drives him into a heat fighting Dresden. Take a look again at the previous Knight, Reul and his methods of protecting and shielding others. His drives are different.

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To keep arguing the Knight could impregnate the Lady is a fools errand.
*doffs hat dramatically* Just don't call me Quinten Coldwater and I shan't be offended.

291
DF Spoilers / Re: (false)peace and the second coming
« on: January 18, 2018, 12:36:04 AM »
@ Kindler... well.. the thing is is those horsemen are aspected those things by proxy. I think the original aspects break down into Fear/rage Despair/hate(there seems to be some bleed over between the two reactionary responses) Lust(which ties into Greed and maybe envy too), and basically death/non existence. I think I have the 5 primary forces that keep repeating in the DF pegged down to the reincarnation of the 4 horsemen and the Chooser of fate.
and what's more is I think you can see other incarnations and where they took those mentioned directly, war, pestilence, ect. I think all 5 exist on Archangel level but were intentionally broken down into the courts and other things so as to not be a direct mirror(like they broke down the two Mothers into whole courts under them). Ever notice the 4 Queens are all riding one of the same colors as is rode by a horsemen of the Apocalypse in SK? Harry is seen by Denton with Hwwbh as a form of Hell behind him just like he might be the earthly carnation of Death?(which I've been looking into recently under the guise that Death is what births 'the end', so time to reexamine those Daughters... :o and the idea it would have ended practitioners with a death so close to Merlin's bloodline)Uriel, decider of fate uses the 3 swords under him to achieve his goal just as death uses all three?
Red King as war makes sense kinda, but I think the Whites are connected to Lust... which translates as Famine, see Dresden's monologue on Club Zero and the end state of WCV's running things. The Horsemen are deep into the DF, Nic and co basically represent their original purpose in Greek mythos now, to spread the apocalypse out similar to the Necronomicon, the Fallen themselves mirror the holders, taking the mirroring availability away from the originals. The Archangel bit because, withing the courts there are 4 supernatural entities still holding a certain freedom of will/mortal power. EK, Kringle, and the 2 Knights. those are the bits of the graces that hold the choice of balance. Breaking it down provides more and more insulation.
When looking remember there are versions who rose and those who fell,(and those torn apart intentionally) most of those get got though.

*iirc the original translation was Hel, as in the goddess/place and before that plain Hades as the patron/place.

292
DF Spoilers / Re: Making things on DR
« on: January 18, 2018, 12:14:06 AM »
Indeed.  I just checked it out, and it does look like it could have a crystal fitted atop it.  Considering that McGrath updated Harry's staff to have the correct type of runes, it makes me wonder if the new look was based on input from JB. 

If so, it makes it *less* likely to have a spearhead atop it.
... Shxls!

293
DF Spoilers / Re: Making things on DR
« on: January 17, 2018, 01:13:59 PM »
Is the part where we suggest he puts a piece of green crystal from the caves in a slot on his pendant?  And it would allow him to remotely communicate with Alfred, control defenses, etc?
looking at his new staff on Case Files he has a spot very good for that, ask Gandalf ;)

294
DF Spoilers / Re: Book 17 Mirror Mirror? Rumor thread
« on: January 17, 2018, 12:55:38 PM »
Could you point me toward it?  I didint think we had anything specific on that link, but it's likely a post- SG WOJ that arent as thoroughly cataloged.
I second it as a confirmed rumored Woj, lol. Thought he talked about how well the circle actually contained Lasciel. I'm actually fairly certain it helped Lash in becoming her own being, in that it kept Lasciel's actual influence at bay while she deviated from it.

295
DF Spoilers / Re: Disproof
« on: January 17, 2018, 06:21:36 AM »
Cowl, just like Harry, could probably use both. Until he died that is. His corpse used outsider magic.
I disagree entirely.
For the TT theory I have here Kumori revived him to his current state the same way she did to the thug in the Alley. In a very circular way it's were she learned to do that trick.
I think in Undeath he can use both as well, just because of who he is/what he believes.
But more specifically i'd say his is different because even while Harnessing the Black he holds on to it through his belief in regular magic as it is. Harry iirc even makes a parallel between the feel of his own tainted with dark magic. Human Magic, like humanity itself should be just as 'alloyed' in it's make up, though the threat of going bonkers and being replaced by something inhuman marginalizes that fact.

296
DF Spoilers / Re: Marcone's heritage
« on: January 17, 2018, 04:44:42 AM »
His eyes being green like dollar bills was a hint- a hint that it was an author’s first book and he wasn’t a great writer. It was just a heavy handed description while trying a noir theme. That’s it. I remember reading it the first time in Storm Front and thinking how noir cliche it was.

As to his lineage, I hope he’s just some guy. Not everyone needs to be supernatural and or related.
Noooot! lol. His younger self is described with "summer hunters green eyes" in direct correlation to his fae connotations. He's as archetypal as Dresden is and one of his main Archetypes Is Erlking. His heritage is unknown but i'd like to point out, his striking similarities to Macfinn and also... Uriel, think about Uriels eyes, his hair... compare the two. 
None of this points to a precise heritage and i'm of the opinion Fae heritiage is actually effected by the current formation of the fae(meaning previously 'fae' wouldn't have been correct terminology or end state, which the Aesir and Vanir were NOT fairies but apparently were the two parties of the fairie war), But he does have something in his heritage... heck even his eye color change is something, It cooled and tempered by logical frost. one wonders if a choice wasn't attached he never even twigged to making.
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Not really.  Most people say "I believe" or "my theory is..." or "I think", making it clear it's an opinion.
Easier to remember everything is perspective but the facts pointed out directly from book or woj. of course the rest of it's opinion. Even the interpretation of those facts betimes lol.

297
DF Spoilers / Re: (false)peace and the second coming
« on: January 17, 2018, 04:30:30 AM »
Oh, come now. It’s a fun idea. Ultimate irony for Nic that Deirdre was a true believer in self sacrifice to save the universe and she returns in the opposite “court” as a figure opposed to him. Also, she said in the book that she was saving the worldin her candid chat with Dresden. Also, Nic gave her a gentle admonishment for loving too much.
I mean, technicality she might have returned in the cosmic order, but I don't see a direct JC connection. I think though, that was part of how she was safe from the 'Enemy'. In order to be reborn into the cosmic side of things I think you have to you know move on and face judgement. Which I think is the Enemy/Adversary role currently filled by Nemesis. In the Jewish Cabbalistic sense the inversion of our angel/star, God was Satan, replaced classically by Lilith, who judges imbalance in the world. I think Nemesis and the idea of Lilith meet a head in the current Adversary.
Anyway, point being I think her staying there was a way to avoid Final Judgement in favor of a purgatory type existence, in a section of the Underworlds. Plural.
*the admonishment I kinda understand but I don't have enough hard points to make. Something to do with being pure of mind/soul so as to not have any cracks. which is a paltry explanation I know, but something about what Nic said about being his path combined with what I know about Walkers and walking paths makes me think Nic is overly aware of how afterlife formalizes itself to the newly deceased, How starborn and everything else is connected. He IS a spymaster.

298
DF Spoilers / Re: White Court Anit-Love and Blood Rites
« on: January 17, 2018, 12:15:17 AM »
The relevant passage from the books regarding this is in Proven Guilty, the scene right after Harry and Thomas leave Zero.

The phrase that sums it up best (IMHO) is when Thomas says the danger occurs when the Hunger is "close to the surface." This can mean several different things; that the Vamp is very hungry, that the Vamp is very turned on; that the vamp is actively trying to feed; that the vamp is actively using some of the Hunger's energy, etc.

My guess for something like the wedding ring scar is that Lara was using her power to try to seduce someone, the game and intrigue of the situation also causing Lara to get turned on herself. As part of the seduction, she goes to hide the wedding ring from sight, so the victim isnt reminded of his true love by the sight of it, and because her Hunger is so close to the surface the ring is able to badly badly burn her. Why that is a permanent scar vs Harry's kiss or what Justine does to Madeline seems to heal completely is not addressed at all, but that could be something as simple as how intense the love was or how young Lara was when it happened.
Yea it was iirc, in that same scene too.

299
DF Spoilers / Re: (false)peace and the second coming
« on: January 16, 2018, 11:51:32 PM »
I don’t know that much in-depth about the christian myths, but, since fantasy and magic is real in the DF universe, this is perfect for Deirdre to show up with the jesus mantle later in the story. If Nic plays some significant role in the other faction, then they will have to face each other.
*facepalm* Deidre the savior... finally a theory I despise more than Simon the Cowl. Deidre died for her father, not for humanity.

300
DF Spoilers / Re: Disproof
« on: January 16, 2018, 09:50:22 PM »
But then he was still alive. You see in the original timeline simon did survive, the vampire attack failed and the outsiders could not get through that is why Cowl, who at that time was totally taken over by his outsider and was going to die, traveled to the past to kill Simon and blow things up.
Mwwaahahahaha! You forget plenty of necessarily mortal Practitioners who have inhuman aura's and what not. His reference to 'mortal magic' there was technically a distinction towards the other necromancers, whom we know to be 'human' but obviously do not use human magic. Technically, he could be an immortal possessing of Mortal Magic or some such.

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