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Messages - mostlyawake

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151
DFRPG / Re: Social Tank
« on: October 12, 2010, 03:03:43 AM »
I see stunts and the sheer amount they can get to be the way Pure Mortals can compete with Wizards, White Court Vamps, Knights Of The Cross, and Wereforms.

I see nothing wrong with assigning them as many of them as the player wants, and further more would rather quit a game then have a GM who would limit what I can and cannot do with MY character so long as it does not break game balance.

And as for the Deceit stunt, if that is what I as a player wants and its plausible and by the mechanics legal then I expect the GM to keep his mouth shut.

I totally agree about the stunts; as an ST I would never limit the amount someone could take.  My group is very... optimized? efficient? and so they really want to look at, "is this stunt a worthwhile investment for me", almost a bit over "does this better define my character?"  And the advice that luminos gave is fairly solid, and how my group thinks, but it's not for everyone. However, a bunch of fate points is a significant advantage for a mortal.  As an ST, I would feel obligated to point that out, and make sure to ask the player (as i did you) how (s)he felt about taking so many stunts versus leaving fate points open.  I didn't mean to imply that I thought they should be limited.

As for the deceit stunt, it's not really legal/illegal by mechanics, so it's completely fair for the GM to question it.  In fact, the mechanics dictate that there be a bit of back and forth between the players and the GM to settle on such a thing.  Reading over the example on 147YS, where the player wants to transplant dodge to guns, the GM offers two conditions: the first is that it only works when the character has a gun close at hand, the other is that it only applies to ranged attacks. So by the book, transplanting dodge deserves a limiting condition.

My real concern with it is that it allows deceit to pull double duty for defense, defending both physical and social, and that it appears without a limiting condition.  Now, the limiting condition need not be very restrictive (as above, requiring a character who has invested 5 skill ranks in guns to have the gun on-hand while dodging... not really limited).  But, as it stands, your character could be giving a speech, and someone shoots at him, and he defends with... deceit?  It conceptually makes little sense there.  I get what you are saying about feinting (and I read where someone else suggested it as more appropriate than, say, presence)... but I still don't really see it.  If I was the GM, i would probably just ask for a restriction that you must either be moving or have moved in the last turn, or for you to come up with some equivalent justification.  Hell, if you'd described your character as always moving, or constantly fidgeting, maybe with something like that as an aspect, I wouldn't ask for any more justification.

I'm not trying to argue or persuade you, just trying to offer an opinion on why that may not be as rules-solid as it first seem. It certainly doesn't break the game, but it is perhaps more overpowered than -1 stunts.


152
DFRPG / Re: Building New Orleans (City Creation As A Mental Exercise)
« on: October 12, 2010, 02:43:50 AM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie_Laveau
http://lafayettecemetery.org/ which has some very interesting info about the next link:
http://www.saveourcemeteries.org/

and at least one http://www.hauntedhistorytours.com/

I think there's something cool to be done with the concept of people profiting off of the area's roots in the occult.  Like, maybe the ghost tour guy actually has telekinesis and uses it to create ghostly happenings. Then he somehow channels the fear of people.  Basically he's using "ghost tours" to create areas of power by imbuing them with fearful people. He starts off like this, but eventually (if not stopped) he will work up to really wanting to maximize that fear, like creating his own SAW situations.

Or, he's a real magician who tries to keep everything on the DL by putting on these obviously FAKE ghost tours.  You leave feeling kind of ripped off, but more confident that magic DOESN'T exist.

Anyways, I think someone like that is a good face for whatever aspect or threat about magic you create, because his job makes it very easy to interact with him.  Like, the PCs might take the tour to recon something that they know to be more dangerous than other people think.  Then they notice this guy acting funny.



 


153
DFRPG / Re: Social Tank
« on: October 12, 2010, 01:57:28 AM »
Tbora, how do you personally feel about using so much refresh on stunts? That's the only advice I would give a player who brought this to me as an ST.  While I am not opposed to stunts, I often also limit my pure mortals to 2-3 stunts that I know will be used multiple times per session.

Like others said, I'll let you and your ST decide about the stunts. Like, I wouldn't really even let a player move dodge to deceit, even if it is perfectly acceptable by the books.


154
DFRPG / Re: Will this still work? (Secrets of Boston players keep out!)
« on: October 12, 2010, 01:46:56 AM »
Given the holy powers that allow people to show up where/when ever needed, you can totally just have a dude walk up, hand out a cloak, and say "you're going to need this."

Of course, you could totally just Deux ex machina it and have an archangel come hand it over, which might make the character feel that much more special.  Especially if the angel says something weird like "I hope it fits, I really didn't know what size you'd be now back when I made it."  And then it fits perfectly of course, despite being 300 years old. 




155
DFRPG / Re: Declaration help
« on: October 12, 2010, 01:38:08 AM »
Overusing declarations can kind of lessen the importance of maneuvers (using your turn to create an aspect); so I think it's more than fine to limit people to one declaration OR assessment per turn.  This lets you declare (guns skill to declare that the old shotgun the farmer pulled shoots high and right, which he is unaware of since he hasn't shot it in forever), OR assess (guns skill again to see if he really knows about combat, trying to uncover an aspect) in the same round that you maneuver (athletics, dive for cover), getting two aspects hopefully to use for defense... instead of three (declare, assess, maneuver).  

The reason I say this is that I found my players only wanting 2 aspects, so if they can declare and assess, then they never bother to maneuver.

Also, it makes sense to really watch what should be a declaration and what should be a maneuver: Declaring cover into existence shouldn't automatically hide you (saving you a turn).   It does kind of neatly let you do a maneuver that gets you 2 tags instead of one (because you declare the cover, which can be tagged, then get behind it as a maneuver, to tag that as well).

I searched all for declarations and the only comment I found was that they "take no time in game", which i think lends itself well to being a free action.  Assessments seem to be occasionally part of a longer action (casing the joint), but occasionally free actions... it really depends on what is being assessed.

156
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG Mechanics With A Twist: Help Needed
« on: October 10, 2010, 10:27:56 PM »
I was contemplating the idea of the Nevernever, but the party is sticking to their guns for a D&D-esque game, so having it in another dimension of the modern world wouldn't exactly help the case.

There's nothing wrong with setting it our past, either, in whatever time and place you find interesting. If you visit the oft-referenced (for good reason) http://www.rickneal.ca/, you'll find that he did just that for his DFRPG game.  If you just say that there was a time when creatures from the nevernever felt free to cross over and cause chaos (before the white council solved it? before the accords?), you get a DnD style game pretty easily.

System-wise, you don't need to change much. Unless the players are all against "guns" on their sheet, you can leave it as it already covers archery. (there's a stunt for it, maybe?). Just make the stunt the default, and make them take a stunt to use guns if some type of flintlock or such is available in your era.  Scholarship can stay the exact same, just limit the knowledge and stunts to era-appropriate, and even drive can stay (wagons, boats, ect).  So nothing has to move at all.


As for your Fate Point for Evocation: I think it would be a rather steep cost, especially if they are going for a Rote spell or something that is only causing one point of stress. I don't have a solution for this just yet either, but a Submerged Wizard should be sitting on 4 Mental Stress, and possibly a second Mental Consequence, so I haven't seen a problem with it in theory (note I haven't had the chance to get a game off the ground, so everything on my end is just theory).

I wouldn't increase the cost of casting. You're already tapping an evoker out at 4 stress before he's "out of spells".  The solution to this is two-part:  one is when you change scenes (clearing stress tracks), the other is for evokers to take some potion slots and use those for easier, often used spells.   You don't really even need to increase stress tracks if you are cutting scenes more often (one battle doesn't have to equal one scene, even if it usually does in our minds.  I have cut-scene in the middle of a battle specifically to empty stress tracks for dramatic reasons).  This clears all stress tracks, so you lessen damage as well.  

Ultimately, if you go DnD-style, or if you have smart players, they'll get armor or armor spells, plus shield spells, and you'll be amazed at how much damage gets negated by that.




When it comes to the stress vs consequences: by leaving the stress as-is, characters may be forced to take Consequences over smaller conflicts, which detracts from the heroic fantasy. While the Minor consequences heal quickly, it's those moderate ones that can leave you out for a bit. With more stress, a character can shrug off a bit more in a fight, have less of a chance for those consequences in a minor skirmish (still possible, though), and still be bruised up. If anything, perhaps a combination of the two would be in order? Minimum 3 stress, add another minor consequence (as they go away quickly enough)?

If you feel it's necessary.  I run a pretty solid combat game with rules as written (RAW). The first extreme consequence finally happened, but it happened in the epic story-arc resolving battle. Again, I'd see what you can do with armor, shield spells, and scene cuts. Plus, adding healing....

As for healing: a part of me is thinking of taking elements of Elaine's Reiki "spell" and the general theories of biomancy and tack it on to Sponsored Magic [Deity]. Keeping it base base Complexity 4 + Level of Consequence to be Lowered (2/4/6). Even a someone with a +5 relevant skill will be taking some pretty heavy mental backlash from this, not to mention the need to RP the debt with the sponsor. The Instant-Heal thing, or even resurrection in some settings, would be even bigger, meaning if a player is doing it, they may need to worry about how they'll manage it, and if it is placed at the feet of an NPC, there may be the need to expend Fate Points to "compel" the event to occur.

Healing is actually really easy.  That person with sponsored biomancy gets four freaking focus slots. So discipline 5, conviction 5, and a "healing wand" of (+2 biomancy complexity, +2 biomancy control, make sure they have requisite lore for the bonus), plus usually the sponsor gives some bonus that for a healer you could call (+1 biomancy complexity, +1 biomancy control), gives them, with no refinement, a total of +8 biomancy complexity and control.  That's all at just -4 refresh for sponsored magic. That's your mild and moderate with no backlash (assuming an even roll).  AND, that's assuming you even USE it as evocation, which you aren't obligated to do.  Post battle? Say screw it, use regular thaumaturgy, pay no stress... or take the stress as it clears when you start the next scene. Mid battle? Run around the corner, throw a circle around your buddy, and thaumaturge it for no stress. Or use potions for it (buying refinement for crafting to up potion strength, and buttloads of potion slots).

Also, consider that the group "Tank" doesn't have to be a mortal wizard.  Call it a changeling, or a god-child, or w/e, give them inhuman toughness and recovery. Extra stress boxes, clears a mild consequence for free.. ect.  

-2 inhuman recovery, -2 inhuman toughness (catch, 0 points, "inherited silver arrow once owned by Achilles to the heel" or something equally hard to obtain), +5 endurance = good group tank at -4 level. Make the catch worth more to free up refresh to buy stunts (like an extra physical consequence).  Hell, put those powers on a suit of magic armor (giving a discount to them) and a catch of "A holy weapon wielded by a righteous man" and you could end up with them costing you only 1 refresh, or giving you a better level of protection.  PLUS you could, as the ST, "enchant" the armor so that it is armor 3 or 4 all the time.  Or, armor 6 three times a session, or whatever nonsense you want to add to your item of power.

Now, that does nothing about your wizard with no endurance, 2 physical stress boxes, and all... true.  But he's a wizard! In dnd, he could die from a cat fight if it went by hitpoints.  He needs to look elsewhere (other than system changes) for his protection.

Another quick example:
Evoker/Thaumaturge (specialize spirit control +1, specialize crafting item use +1) = -6 refresh
Lore 5, Conviction 5, discipline 4 (unless limited to max of 4 due to your power level i guess)
4 available focus item slots
crafting wand = +1 item power, +1 item use (2 slots)
2 open slots = 4 enchanted item slots
slot 1 = strength 6 shield three times a session
slot 2 = armor 3 three times a session
slot 3, 4 = open for character development OR increasing armor/shield use/power

That's a pretty basic protective set-up, using just the free stuff with your two types of magic.  Now if someone hits you for over 6 stress, you absorb 6 of the attack strength on the shield, then ignore 3 of the damage due to the armor... so if someone with an arrow (weapon 2?) shot you with 8 successes (they were a master +5 archer and rolled 3 pluses), 2 get through to add to damage, so 4 total stress, you ignore 3 of it, and you take 1 physical stress before you melt him into nothingness with your magiks.  You can go pretty toe to toe with a physical opponent (not a monster, though) and probably not hit consequences beyond mild before you've killed him.







157
DFRPG / Re: A debate over crafting...
« on: October 07, 2010, 12:56:13 PM »
It's also worth noting that there is no real reason to houserule crafting even stronger. It's already considered by many to be the most potent path for games until like, 12-14 refresh.

Here's a quick view of why:

Crafter, lore 5, (thaumaturgy, specialization item use).
 5 refinement (item power +3, item use +1 (to +2 total), wards complexity +1, wards control +1 (to keep skill columns right), 4 focus item slots)
for, -8 refresh

Now has 6 focus item slots, burns just 2 on an item to give +1 crafting power, +1 crafting use, turns the other 4 into 8 enchanted item slots.

Total crafted item bonuses: Item power +9, item uses 5 per slot, 8 slots.
If one of those is a shield bracelet (9 shift shield 5 times per session), one of those is armor (armor 4 5x per session), and 6 are potions, the character now has 6 spells that he can cast at whim, declaring whatever he wants as he needs it, that are 9 shifts of power. Sure, he's limited to that 6, but he can cast each 5 times, for a total of 30 fairly powerful spells that go off instantly, cost no stress to use, and can be strengthened by fate points.

Due to mental stress and no real way to extend a mental stress track, an evoker is going to get 4 spells off before he's out of mental stress.  They are going to be limited to his conviction in power unless he finds a buff for them, and his discipline to control.. which he can also up by refinement.  So honestly for the same refresh, if he has a high enough lore (to enable good bonuses from focus items), he can get around the same power and control (+9 or +10 total).  But he gets... 4 spells per scene, before he gets in trouble.

Crafting rocks.

However, item strength is limited to lore x2, so around 12 or 13 refresh (assuming you've upped the skill cap to +6), you will see them come even, and past that the evoker will pull more power simply because the thaumaturge's refinement can no longer add to item power.

Still, he gets a crap load of free spells, and it certainly needs no buff.  


158
DFRPG / Re: To tell or not to Tell
« on: October 07, 2010, 03:31:34 AM »
It kind of depends. My group is all new to the system (as am I, as is everyone, I guess, since DFRPG is new. But we have no prior FATE experience, either), and writing up characters is a great way to learn. So we're set to have sessions where they will draw up NPCs - lovers, enemies, informants, everything.  So they'll know the stats for those npcs, which will be on google docs.


They know all of the aspects for the city, and themes and threats.  But, they know about the white court presence (one of the theme faces), with no stats.  So they don't know for sure that the Duke isn't also a sorcerer, ect.

Generally, if it's an ally, i share stats. If it's a bad guy, they know if it is a face or something, but no stats... i actually keep blank sheets and write in stats as they discover them.   Once the guy dies or is rendered moot, i share stats.

because we're playing up the detective angle of DF, i kind of can't tip my hand without ruining a mystery.  


Still, in the last battle (w/ a -19 refresh necromancer and his two -6 sidekicks) i openly had their sheets exposed so we could show how damage is tracked, ect.



159
DFRPG / Re: skill shuffle question
« on: October 07, 2010, 01:38:59 AM »
Why do you say that true shape-shifters aren't good as PCs?  Not that I disagree, I just haven't heard this before.

160
DFRPG / Re: Question about "consequences"
« on: October 07, 2010, 01:36:43 AM »
If you took a mild physical consequence, and then got into a debate and would take a mild social consequence, you would not be able to do so. You'd have to take a moderate social consequence.

Stress tracks are separate, consequences pile together.

I'm not sure of the game design "why" on this, but the only real in-game justification I can come up with is this:

You got scraped up in a car crash (mild consequence).  You probably already feel like hell, even though it's minor.  So now, when you go to that debate and lose, instead of taking it somewhat gracefully, you really blow up and lose your cool.

161
DFRPG / Re: Blessed Bullets???
« on: October 01, 2010, 08:40:36 PM »
Just chiming in to agree with it just being an aspect on the item.

The first free tag takes care of the bullet (which is gone after one use). While the extra +2 doesn't actually help with toughness, it provides enough of a bonus (you get to use the +2 to hit with, as your roll is the attack roll, and then that rolls into damage) that i'd feel okay with it. 

On a sword or the like, it's just giving one thematic bonus to the fight.  It's not truly representative of a blade blessed for a battle (which would affect every swing), but it's enough in game-terms to act as a bonus for something that is essentially a non-action for the character (it's taking him what, 5 seconds to bless the sword, and no resources?)

Another idea is to have him state the time that he wants to spend blessing a longer-use item (like a sword), and for how many extra amounts of time he spends, give him that many free tags on the item.  For instance, if you ruled that it takes 15 mins to bless the sword (completely arbitrary), then every 15 mins he gets an extra free tag.  Just beware that he could then spend 4 hours, add 16 tags, and add 32 dice to some role - enough to kill almost anything outright, as there is no limit to how many of those tags he can use at once.  A better way to do that might to be starting with instant (1 free tag), then moving up the time scale for each extra tag, making only 8 tags or so reasonable.

162
DFRPG / Re: Skills in the FATE system
« on: September 23, 2010, 05:25:39 AM »
Well the block strength, even if they overcome it, should detract from their total shifts of power for that one thing that punches through it.

So you do a block of 10.

Bad guy shoots 15 points of fire at you.

5 get through, and you have to dodge it at a 5 instead of a 15.  Honestly, I don't know if this still hits if it's actual weapon rating is 15 or 5, but I think it's the higher of the two.  Still, your dodge roll is much easier!

163
DFRPG / Re: I make a Lore Roll so I know...
« on: September 23, 2010, 05:19:42 AM »

And you can more easily warn someone if the quality of the answer is beyond the quality of the library, if they make to spend a lot of Fate points for it.


Yeah, I really like the line (for physical immunity i think) that says if the PCs blow a lot of fate points on something that is actually just impossible, the GM should refund all but one of the spent points.  I'd use that here, instead of necessarily telling them the rating of the library. Though I would hint at that rating through descriptions, and if they went to the bestest, bestest library and the question difficulty was still above that research level, then I would simply tell them that this question probably isn't answerable by a library and suggest that they try complimenting their lore rolls with contacts to see if they can find help from someone else.

164
DFRPG / Re: Regarding raising difficulties
« on: September 23, 2010, 05:14:50 AM »
Harry's statement regarding Earth Magic isn't actually a claim that HE finds it harder, but that the magic is harder in general.  I'd love the exact quote, to see if he really is talking about it through his experience, or if he mentions it being less used by other wizards due to the difficulty.  

If it's his own view - "It's harder because you have to do X instead of Y" can still be his own view, as he isn't thinking about his own trained powers in Y" - that's pretty easy to cover with the refinement differences.  If he's talking about others, well, I still don't think that's a good enough reason to make it more of a bitch for anyone to take Earth over anything else... there isn't a real mechanical benefit  to earth, so why penalize it?

As for the player who wanted to be able to shut off people from him: if he raised a wall it should be treated just like increasing a border, which I am pretty sure there's a spell strength for (isn't it just a block, really?).  Logically, yes, if he threw up a wall that's block 4 and you stated that this means it's a solid wall 10 feet high, then he has cut off line of sight and the bad guy shouldn't be able to fling a spell at him or fire a gun until he is back in sight.  So the bad guy jumps on a garbage can and now he can see you. Or he blasts through the wall with magic (overcoming the block strength with a spell) or gets you by targeting the entire zone that the wall is connected to on your side (hey, he can see some part of that zone; above your head is legit.) The werewolf just scales it.

Plus, that wall you throw up is evocation, so it literally justs lasts one action unless you pump some duration into it.  I mean, if he rips up the cobblestones and stacks them in a wall, they may not topple instantly but they will be super easy to kick down once the magic fades (no mortar).  If he summons raw earth to put there "I make a big stone", then his big stone crumbles into dust pretty easy if hit. There's no reason earth magic SHOULD get a permanent benefit (like permanent walls) that another element wouldn't get. You could be generous and leave an aspect up over the area, that can be tagged as needed and give a potential boost to the block strength there.

Hrm.. compare that to fire... you could make a block 10 wall of fire. A round later, the wall just poof, dies out, but now the ground and walls around it may have caught fire.  You can give it the famous "on fire" aspect and can that be tagged to make passing it harder.

Really, you're being generous, because his block action isn't really a declaration so he's not really creating an aspect, and he could be charged an extra 4 shifts to have a sticky aspect hang around.  But I kinda see treating the damage/long term effect as an aspect as working pretty well.


Anyways, he can block of pursuit or block line of vision.  It's just very short duration, and all he's doing is forcing the opponent to take some other action to get to him.  Seems legit.  The only issue I see is just making sure he knows that he isn't creating a permanent object, because that's not what evocation - even earth evocation - does.
 

165
DFRPG / Re: I make a Lore Roll so I know...
« on: September 23, 2010, 04:50:11 AM »
Lore (and even scholarship) can be hard to determine what to do with when your pc pulls off a more-than-legendary success.  I had the same thing happen when my group went to an occult library one afternoon to learn the true facts about Zombies, someone got like a 9 on the roll.  Fortunately, it was only zombies, so not much there that's too secret, and I just read the entry out of the book to them.

First, you have to determine what the library would have available... can it really be helpful in sussing out secrets of WCVs?  Probably not, unless that tag was WCV related.  

Hrm.. I'd probably run this more as a long term goal, assigning a difficulty of 20, 30, 40, 50 successes on cumulative lore checks to reveal more and more info about a specific thing, with a re-roll time of 1-2 weeks.  And, ultimately, perhaps you're just not going to know from a book-source stuff like "the gatekeeper's roll on the White Council."

Then again, if the character takes an occult stunt with a focus on that group, I'd be pretty generous as to what I revealed, and might let those rolls count for a little more than just allowed by the stunt bonus.

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