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Messages - Orbweaver

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16
DF Reference Collection / Re: [SERIES SPOILRS] Wow there is a lot to learn from some research on Tam Lin
« on: April 23, 2013, 02:23:51 AM »
Well. If the Sidhe do indeed have a debt to Hell that is paid on a once a decade basis, based on the Tam Lin research- we may have how Jim came up with the plot for this book. Rather than the usual terms of the debt being met, Mab (or someone on Hell's side) negotiated the theft of the artifact in Hades' lair for Skin Game instead.

It strikes me as being a bit off, though, because the original terms were more about mortal sacrifice- something Hell regards as its bread and butter. Holy Grail Speculation about the artifact's nature coming in three... two... one...:D

17
Display Case / Re: Perfect Casting, part 2
« on: December 25, 2012, 09:25:22 PM »
I'm going to do something crazy, and suggest Tilda Swinton as Mab.

18
DF Reference Collection / Re: [CD spoilers] Small Favor
« on: December 16, 2012, 05:59:22 AM »
Quote from: the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh on December 14, 2012, 08:16:07 PM
This is a remarkable piece of work.  Well done indeed.

Question it raises for me, though; if Nemesis-through-Namshiel is working towards entrapping and infecting the Archive, what's Nemesis-through-Maeve's motive in sending in the hobs ?  Crossed wires or variant motives among the Nemesis hosts seems to run counter to what we are told in CD about the nature of Outsiders.

Possibility: Nemesis is keeping the identities of those it has infected separate from infected hosts. The right hand, so to speak, does not know the left's intentions, motivations, or identity. That way, if one infected agent is coerced into revealing information, he or she effectively cannot present a list of other infected members to an enemy. It presents a huge logistical problem in terms of a pawn's plan countering or even nullifying other plans of equal import by another pawn, but this is counterbalanced in that one agent may not effectively expose the rest. It was oft repeated in Cold Days that identifying the presence of Nemesis is far from a simple task.

Edit: This does seem to beg the question of what happened when Mab asked Lea who else was infected.

19
DF Reference Collection / Re: A Badelynge of Quackiness, Part Two
« on: December 16, 2012, 03:08:15 AM »
Quote from: wizard nelson on December 16, 2012, 02:51:50 AM
anyone notice harry was gollum in changes compared to susans frodo? or is that backwards?

I just thought about the Ring being Maggie in either case, and I got very creeped out by the image of Harry throwing his own kid into an active volcano. This is why I don't try to do analogies to other characters in other books. It never ends well, either for me or for the initial characters.

20
DF Reference Collection / Re: The Red Court Lives....sort of (Spoilers Changes, GS, and CD)
« on: December 15, 2012, 02:16:53 AM »
Quote from: wizard nelson on December 15, 2012, 01:46:27 AM
orbweaver, liverspots was fully human when he cast his death curse, albeit a weak pansy ass one... he was practitioner enough without the coin, so i don't think that counts as non human. a half blood like martin or even thomas might have one too if they knew magic. bianca was full vamp. pretty sure even denarian with a coin is still technically human anyway.

I knew there was another case I was forgetting! Thanks, Tarion. Ebenezar did say Mavra was capable of one, I think during the course of Blood Rites or Dead Beat. Then again, Mavra has shown herself to be far from your typical newbie Black Court vampire.

Yes, Cassius was human when he threw the death curse- but the thing is, the Nickelheads are still human as well (though they have an extremely inhuman element riding shotgun). Again, how human is human?

21
DF Reference Collection / Re: The Red Court Lives....sort of (Spoilers Changes, GS, and CD)
« on: December 15, 2012, 01:22:09 AM »
Quote from: wizard nelson on December 15, 2012, 01:06:02 AM
i thought death curses were a human thing?

How human is human, again? :) We know the Denarians can throw one, and they're definitely not attached to or using the most human of abilities. Even wizards are considered to be slightly different from vanilla mortals, thanks to that nifty little gene that lets them use greater magical talents.

I don't think it's entirely species related, as it pretty much just requires a character to be able to tap into their life force and burn it out.

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and this hasn't really been brought up that i've seen but, DR says burst from skull yes? well i think harry just assumed it would physically burst from his skull, due to preconceived notions about the word 'burst' in corrallation to his experiences eg, facehugger from aliens. the thing is DR isn't an elequent speaker. indeed he barely spoke more then a few sentences before CD. i think this is a miscommunication. it WILL metaphysically burst from his skull, not physically. as a spiritual being. if my other theories are correct 'lash' will then be housed in bobs new vessel, becoming harry's new info source.

I'm more worried about the price that's going to get asked of Harry in order to remove the parasite.

Whether DemonReach meant a physical bursting, a metaphysical bursting, or a mental burst (might leave Harry in a coma again) isn't known at this point, any more than we know how long it meant by "Soon" in response to when it would grow so large it couldn't remain contained in Harry any more. I think a lot of people are hoping DR wasn't being literal, just on account of them not wanting anything bad to happen to Harry (heh, heh, heh... they're reading entirely the wrong series).

A metaphysical bursting, though, would have some equally bad ramifications if it happened. Harry might lose his access to soulfire, if it damages him at the metaphysical level DR seems to think it will. Or the parasite might drain him to the point where he no longer has a soul, taking all of it with itself when it finally emerges.

Back to the theory, though: There's been a lot of speculation that any Ramps who were in the NN at the time the bloodline curse was triggered were not affected by it. (Mostly because, in a creepy way, I think a lot of the forum members here liked the Eebs.) If Arianna's "spirit" got sucked into Dresden right before her physical self died, I'm thinking some of what remained of her would be manifesting either through Harry's thoughts or actions. He *does* think about going for Maeve's throat in Cold Days. But before that, and especially during Ghost Story, Harry doesn't seem to be thinking along the lines of a Red Court vamp.

22
DF Reference Collection / Re: A Badelynge of Quackiness, Part Two
« on: December 13, 2012, 01:13:18 AM »
Quote from: Ms Duck on December 13, 2012, 01:00:27 AM
as to soul energy being relased by the destruction of matter.. its possible, but im not aware of people glowing light blue lately.

my theory is based upon the idea that:

Magic comes from living things
the energy for life comes from the sun

if a being has more energy than can be explained by solar output, then obviusly they have soem other source. th easiest explanation for this is the (largely proven) existance of other worlds to draw on.

 ;D

Mmm. Bob stated that Uriel is made of nothing but soul- and via a WOJ, he can obliterate planets just by thinking about it.

I think there is most definitely evidence that Souls are either (a) their own source of energy, or (b) their own material, from which energy can then be derived. The Darkhallow and most necromantic acts would be indicative of B, although (a) is also possible as Harry wound up 'discorporated' thanks to Eternal Silence in Ghost Story. Souls can be affected by things like time, other energies (Corpsetaker vs. Harry), will, and a lot of other 'primal' forces.

Harry danced around the subject of what would happen if he threw a punch with all his heart, soul, and mind behind it against the Skinwalker in Turn Coat. It's possible that by entwining Sacrificial energy with that derived from his soul, something on the level of God's son dying on the cross would have come charging out at Shaggy that night. And/or obliterated the island along with everything in Chicago, but again, Jim couldn't have Harry dead until the next book, so we missed out.

Overall, Duckie, do you think souls are their own form of energy- or that they're made of something, from which energy is derived? Or both?

23
DF Reference Collection / Re: [CD spoilers] Mother Winter, the Blackstaff, Death and the Raven Banner
« on: December 07, 2012, 12:49:21 AM »
Interesting... the White Council acquired the Blackstaff sometime around 1065. The other important date mentioned in CD is 1066, when the battle of Hastings happened and Titania spoke one-on-one with Mab.

So Mother Winter lost her walking stick, and the Blackstaff changed hands in 1065. It may be that the year the 'walking stick' actually passed from Mother Winter to the Council was in 1066- which would put Mother Winter at Hastings.

If she was there- were the Outsiders there as well?

24
CD Book Club / Re: Cold Days Book Club - Chapters 45-53 **MAJOR SPOILERS**
« on: December 06, 2012, 05:29:14 AM »
Quote from: huangjimmy108 on December 06, 2012, 04:53:13 AM
Small favor chapter 28:

“It is a metaphor,” he said quietly. He had a good voice, mellow and surprisingly deep. “Look at them. Swimming. Eating. Mating. Hunting, killing, fleeing, hiding, each to its nature. All of them so different. So alien to one another. Their world in constant motion, always changing, always threatening, challenging.” He moved one arm, sweeping it in a wider gesture. “They cannot know how fragile it is, or that they are constantly surrounded by beings with the power to destroy their world and kill them all with the twitch of a finger. It is no fault of theirs, of course.” Nicodemus shrugged. “They are simply…limited. Very, very limited. Hello, Dresden.”


Nick almost talking about the outsiders here.

Is that why he took up the dinarian coin in the first place?

I (and I think the rest of the Dresden fans) would just about kill to get backstory on how Nicodemus got saddled with Anduriel. His partnership with his fallen is completely unique in that there is, supposedly, an equal footing between the two. Presumably, this is because of some sort of understanding that was reached, and has resulted in 2000+ years of dead Knights of the Cross, the Black Death across Europe and the surrounding countries, the Archive being completely overwhelmed and hundreds of other dastardly deeds coming to fruition.

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Is the outsiders have something to do with lucifer and the fallen angel's  rebellion?

Butcher once mention a crazy archangel who interferes and destroys the balance, is this it?


Most of us are fairly certain that the angel who went 90 degrees north of true is a reference to Satan/Lucifer, who is known amongst other things to be the "Father of Lies". There is also suspicion that Nemesis is responsible for the fall of the angels, and the ex-Archangel, Lucifer.

None of this is proven, yet.

25
DF Reference Collection / Re: [CD spoilers] Small Favor
« on: December 04, 2012, 12:52:40 AM »
Quote from: narphoenix on December 04, 2012, 12:49:26 AM
Here's the thing: they /couldn't/ have infected Ivy. If they did, the world would be SCREWED. Ivy can deseminate information about all the Old Ones ever written. She could make so many 7th Lawbreakers that the Council wouldn't know what to do with them. And of course, she could have killed Harry like /this/.

Nemesis, though, isn't *banking* on only one entity to bring Empty Night in. In all likelihood, it's going to sit inside the higher level beings it infects (through the exchanges of power and promises that tend to go hand-in-hand with making it to the top of the supernatural hierarchy) until such a time as it is best placed to bring most of the Outside Inside. (Assuming that's the motivation it has.)

It would do far better to simply start wiping out those who are responsible for removing the information about its allies. I suspect the Venators are about to get hit, and HARD.

Think about how most of mortality started treating Stoker's book a few decades after it was written. Hollywood all but bastardized the thing with Twilight. Getting information out is important- getting it to the right people is even more so.

Edit: I also suspect that the reason the Winter Knight mantle messed with Harry's emotions and thoughts as much as it did during Cold Days was because Harry picked up the Nemesis infection pretty early on in the series. Nemesis is what allowed Lash to come into her own as an individual entity. 

26
DF Reference Collection / Re: [CD spoilers] Small Favor
« on: December 04, 2012, 12:44:40 AM »
Quote from: Blackblade on December 04, 2012, 12:34:48 AM
That seemed more like Ivy rebelling against the Archive.

The problem is that in giving Ivy her own identity, he made it possible for Nemesis to amplify the use of her Free Will over the Will of the Archive.

Remember what happened to Mother Winter when she tried to pin Harry down using only her will? It's the same thing... only about a thousand times worse, because Ivy's wishes are not always going to be in line with the Archive's. If any of the Denarians who captured her was corrupted by Nemesis (and I think there's a large likelihood that Namshiel or Rosanna probably were/are), there's a *high* chance that Ivy has Nemesis inside her. Provided that Nemesis uses Ivy to act against the Archive's wishes, the Archive cannot act to override Ivy's free will. It can offer a strong emphasis on what she should do, but that's it.

One other thing to remember about Mab: She only has so many resources. Most of them are committed to the fight at the Gates, but she also has to keep a few at the home base (in case of something like Summer fire being poured into Winter's Wellspring or an uprising like the one Lea tried). The hobs might have been all she could spare to tip someone off that Nemesis was up and running.

27
DF Reference Collection / Re: Cold Days Spoilers- Who isn't your Nemesis?
« on: November 30, 2012, 01:16:47 AM »
Quote from: knnn on November 30, 2012, 01:11:09 AM
Remember that it was Maeve who slowed time in Winter, ostensibly to allow Summer time to orchestrate a smack-down on the Rampires.  If Maeve was already infected by then, then perhaps this also served to keep the Outer Gates undefended a while longer?

It was likely also to make sure the Red Court got infected, and at the highest level possible.

28
DF Reference Collection / Re: Cold Days Spoilers- Who isn't your Nemesis?
« on: November 30, 2012, 12:28:14 AM »
Why is everyone assuming that Nemesis would automatically ramp things up to 11 and do something so obvious to betray the fact that it infected a high-level being?

From what we've seen, Nemesis doesn't do that. It's going to sit in the host and slowly move pieces into place so that a major event happens with little or no room or time (or both) to stop it from happening. It took Lea a long time between Grave Peril and her coup attempt before Proven Guilty.

And if Nemesis is an aspect of TWG at work, the entire Christian pantheon is probably subject to being infected. I don't think you can discount any of them, because Nemesis seems to have two goals: To turn the host's nature against itself and, in turn for that, to grant abilities or information the infected entity would not otherwise have had access to.


29
CD Book Club / Re: Cold Days Book Club - Chapters 45-53 **MAJOR SPOILERS**
« on: November 28, 2012, 04:13:18 PM »
I have to admit, I never saw Jim writing a conversation between Harry and Titania about gay men. Then again, I never saw Mab as being the type to head to Disneyland. Both those moments really shone as going to show we don't know everything about Mab or Titania yet.

30
DF Reference Collection / Re: CD Spoilers: The Case of the Stolen Walking Stick
« on: November 28, 2012, 04:08:45 AM »
Yep. First thing that came to mind when Mother Summer said that Mother Winter lost her walking stick was the Blackstaff.

As to how she 'lost' it is anyone's guess at this point. We've seen some pretty scary things starting to move around in Cold Days, some of which are on par with Mother Winter in terms of ability. Harry was able to use his will to repel her, it's possible that the staff was lost if Mother Winter came into contact with the Original Merlin and/or an Old One- and then it found its way/was passed down over the years.

But I'm kind of suspicious. If Mother Winter lost something, she'd have had to gain something in another area. It's technically what the Sidhe are. So if she lost the Blackstaff... what did she gain?

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