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Messages - Yuillegan

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DF Spoilers / Re: The Nature of the Creator
« on: January 29, 2019, 07:28:14 AM »
My recollection may be mistaken, but what I recall is that Jim said something about how Satan was "for" creation's existence but had a philosophical disagreement about it with TWG that humans couldn't/wouldn't understand. I'm also sure I'm slightly mischaracterizing it.

Yeah, TWG either was an Outsider or created the Outsider's too. Jim has said that the Creator created the inside and told the Outsiders to stay out, and they did because he was the Creator. I can't remember what term he used for the Creator, but the implication is that the Creator is more powerful/as powerful as all the Outsider's put together.

Pretty much spot on, we as humans cannot grasp fully the complexities of the whole argument as we are too limited. But what he is against was humanities Free Will.

Yes I agree, the implication is that He is stronger. Though I wonder if that is because He can create a Cosmos, or because inside his Creation he is the Boss. The whole weird thing with Outsiders is they look different depending on which reality they are trying to enter - which I think is a bit of hint to the whole thing.

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DF Spoilers / Re: Black Council/The Circle/Nemesis
« on: January 29, 2019, 06:06:44 AM »
Good ideas all, but I seem to remember in one of the more recent novels that Harry has an epiphany where he realises what he assumed, in his arrogance, was a group of dark wizards could be something much larger and more complex and diverse in it's affliates and members.

I think this is when he is getting a better idea about Nemesis etc.

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DF Spoilers / Re: The Nature of the Creator
« on: January 28, 2019, 01:16:20 AM »
Great stuff Serack, certainly all very plausible. I can certainly see how Mother Winter and other destructive Powers might have Outsider origin, but as they are not "true" Outsiders they are still "for Reality". They are also able to fulfill their various duties as cleaners, wardens etc. Winter serves a special purpose in the DFU, and Summer exists to check and balance it.

I do think that a small spanner in the works is the Prince of Darkness. He isn't against Reality per se, according to WOJ, but he is against the idea of Free Will (or something to that effect). I do wonder about his purpose (either initially or currently). Interestingly, Lucifer is means "Lightbringer" normally interpreted to mean the knowledge-bearer (and if there is a theme in the Genesis, it is that knowledge is dangerous), but he is often referred to as The Prince of Darkness (named in DF) which is almost the complete opposite - these two ideas seemingly at odds. Perhaps he went beyond the borders of Reality and found knowledge that drove him to rebel against his Master and/or Creator? Perhaps he acquired some dark powers in the Outside? Did his nature change or did he fulfill his purpose? Or are they even the same being (we know one can be two...)?

The Dragons (like Ferrovax) also are hard to place. They are clearly high level cosmic beings, and had important jobs in the early days of creation (described as geological movements etc). So where do they fit in?

In my opinion, it was always obvious that TWG and the Outsiders/Old Ones were linked. By definition - TWG (as Creator) came before Creation, so must have come from "Outside" of it. That would imply some level of bond - even if distant - to the Outsiders. Garth Nix's Keys to the Kingdom series touches on this, with the Architect (creator) coming from "Nothing" (a similar concept to Chaos/Outside) and being a type (perhaps the first type) of Nithling (Nix's version of Outsiders). Nix never does go into why no other similarly powerful being then emerged after, however.

What will be interesting to see is whether any other Outsider Lords/Old Ones are of similar power to TWG, and why TWG chose to break away - even if it was just pure instinct. In a strange way, it reminds me of the Warhammer 40k Chaos God Malice/Malal, who represented Chaos' nature to turn against itself.

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To answer the OP - yes there is. Search in the Reference collection or WOJ.

Initially Jim said that Archangels and the Faerie Queens and Gods were of the same level. This was established in the early books but has essentially been retconned. TWG/Almighty is considered the top of the food chain (though what exactly it is has not been explained). Archangel are the tier below that (Jim called them VP's of Creation - these days in corporate they would more likely be SVPs and Officers, but I will get into that in a second). Archangels have been said to have the power to annihilate galaxies with their thoughts, take apart all the worlds everywhere etc. This is both WOJ and in the later novels. A particular Archangel (the Prince of Darkness) has been called an "officer" of Hell. This was met with some confusion by fans when Hades (the god) is considered the CEO of his own little company, but Lucifer is an Officer. In current corporate lingo, an officer is generally one of the highest executive positions (and includes the CEO, and sometimes Chair and/or President - the terms generally amount to the same thing). This resolves the confusion somewhat, that as a senior Archangel Lucifer is up the top, but as we don't know much about Hell or how it functions or it's purpose, we cannot understand why Lucifer might not be the Chairman. My guess is technically TWG is Chairman as Hell serves a purpose, and as constantly stated around the books, Power has Purpose.

Of note, recently we discovered that the Walker He Who Walks Behind is considered on the same level as an Archangel. This was odd as the other Walker, He Who Walks Before, was considered as "big as Mab, but unimaginably deeper". This suggests we don't fully understand how the Power levels really work yet.

The Mothers are also considered as high as Archangels, and have been described as orders of magnitude greater than the Queens.

The next level are Gods, Queens, Dragons, Angels, Fallen. Depending on how much they are involved depends where they fall but it is clear from WOJ that just because you have more brute force, doesn't mean you have more influence or are more deadly. Often the inverse is true. Compare Vadderung/Kringle and Hades. Hades might well have more muscle these days, Vadderung has seemingly sacrificed much of his former Power to retain influence in the world. On the other hand, his influence seems much more pervasive and dangerous comparatively. Drakul, Ferrovax and the council of Black Court Elders are on this level. Also to some degree, the Lords of the Outer Night. Various demons and Outsiders exist here and below.

The Leansidhe, Eldest Gruff, the Erlking and Kringle are the next level. I would say that Mouse when in the Carpenter's home and Ivy fall in somewhere around here. I put Kringle here as Vadderung's power and influence jumps around - he sits on a few levels depending on the mask he wears I suspect.

Below them is the Ladies and possible OG Merlin and perhaps Morganna Le Fay, maybe Kemmler. I would hazard that the Ladies have more brute force because of what they represent, but not necessarily more influential than the others. OG Naagloshii.

The Senior Council types and some others are probably next - maybe some of the Bigfoot types. The Cantrev Lords of the Formor are also somewhere here. Regular Skinwalkers.

Finally regular Wizards, fae etc.

Vanilla mortals - which as JB keeps stressing, should not be mistaken for harmless, especially when massed, planned, well researched and angry. We did invent nukes after all.

Side note - The Old Ones (possibly the Old Gods - there is some confusion on this) who a race of demon gods that ruled the Earth and were banished or locked away and rule the Outsiders, are not included in this list. That is because we know almost nothing about them. Bob mentioned they could cross a threshold and do all kinds of damage - which was considered pretty bad, he also compared them to a big old god. I suspect that en masse they could well challenge TWG himself. Why? Because of a little known WOJ. In it, he describes that Lucifer is nowhere near the biggest bad on the tree for the simple fact that he is FOR REALITY. Lucifer is having an existential argument with TWG that we can only vaguely grasp. But it seems his is Team Reality. The Old Ones wish for no more reality it seems. Which is why Jim considers Nicodemus more dangerous to reality than Lucifer, in some ways. Both Vadderung and the Mothers have described the twin events of the prisoners of Demonreach getting free and the Outsiders breaking through the gate as not merely catastrophic, but the end (or "everything stops. everything" as Mother Summer put it). The term Empty Night seems to be a big hint, as has been thrown around a few times in the series.

Hope that helps :)

1265
DF Books / Re: If I were Jim...
« on: December 07, 2018, 07:30:23 AM »
Then lucky it isn't you then. He also has spent the last 4 years with his new wife eh? Not to mention, I am actually proposing to make his life easier unlike the rest of you who are determined to work him into his seventies...I don't want him slaving over this forever.


1266
DF Spoilers / If I were Jim...
« on: December 06, 2018, 02:21:04 AM »
I would probably take a good look at the series and go, it has been a while ride but 22 books (plus 3 mega books) is too much. I would condense the next 6 books into 1 or 2 books, and make the capstone trilogy just one book. Then continue on with new works or prequel stuff etc.

I know it is harsh, and he has had more than enough personal woes, but it is probably the most sensible option. Take the pressure off and enjoy his life. But some closure for the fans - that won't take another 20 years would be great.

I fully respect his ambition and his will power to create his achievements over the past two decades, but another two just seems a bit ridiculous.

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DF Books / If I were Jim...
« on: December 06, 2018, 02:20:32 AM »
I would probably take a good look at the series and go, it has been a while ride but 22 books (plus 3 mega books) is too much. I would condense the next 6 books into 1 or 2 books, and make the capstone trilogy just one book. Then continue on with new works or prequel stuff etc.

I know it is harsh, and he has had more than enough personal woes, but it is probably the most sensible option. Take the pressure off and enjoy his life. But some closure for the fans - that won't take another 20 years would be great.

I fully respect his ambition and his will power to create his achievements over the past two decades, but another two just seems a bit ridiculous.

1268
DF Spoilers / Re: Random things I noticed in Proven Guilty
« on: November 18, 2018, 09:11:09 PM »
I think WOJ is everyone who knows the 4-1-1 is grabbing power and preparing. I think that Lara has finally had a peek behind the curtain and is acting accordingly.

Excellent analysis kbrizzle. Especially the 2 stories in one. That is very Jim and mark of a skilled writer.

1269
DF Spoilers / Re: Harry's lack of research
« on: November 05, 2018, 04:08:49 AM »
I know. I mean obviously that is just how Jim is drawing out the story, but I guess after 20 years a few things get lost. I just think he needs to at least have a passage with Harry putting together a string diagram trying to piece it all together.

Another mystery, in Cold Days Maeve says that Mab is mad and and intends to unleash chaos and destruction not seen since the fall of Atlantis. Like I know the guy is busy, but wouldn't you go "hey, might be time to ask what happened to Atlantis" to someone who would have the true story.

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DF Spoilers / Re: Harry's lack of research
« on: November 05, 2018, 03:14:13 AM »
Well true. But he did want to know his past in Ghost Story. Lots of Clues in that book. But he chose to ask about his current problems - classic Dresden style. He sees a problem and goes straight at it, and think barely two moves ahead. No real sense of the long game. Which is incredibly weird for a Wizard, especially one in his forties. But then again, that is who he is.

Another mystery that hasn't been addressed from Ghost Story, for instance, is who the enemy are. When Dresden first is in Between (which we don't really know what that is), he sees an angel called Amitiel. Jack tells him that is a clue to who cheated in order to kill him. Dresden responds with actual Fallen angels, and Jack says
Quote
Not exactly. But if you want to think of it that way, it works. Sort of. What you need to know is they're the bad guys

So what the hell does that mean, pun intended. The opposition to angels should be the Fallen, and yet are not. But it is something very similar. Is he implying it was the Denarians or the Circle or something else? And I can assure you, if someone/thing was messing with my life like that, I would be pretty keen on finding out who tricked me into killing myself. But Dresden hasn't even approached that, and likely won't for some time.

The only correlation I can think of is Nemesis/The Enemy. Jack says to Harry (when referring to those that compromised his death) "You were getting in their way. They wanted you gone. They broke the law to make that happen". Rashid in Cold Days says something similar "Unwittingly or not, virtually your every action in the past few years has resulted in a series of well placed thumbs in the adversary's eye"

Harry has a lot of the information he needs to solve the puzzle, but more people on these boards have connected the dots than he has.

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DF Spoilers / Harry's lack of research
« on: November 04, 2018, 11:40:16 PM »
I know we have a lot of information Harry doesn't, but it really astounds me for a guy who is meant to be a big knowledge seeker (as a Wizard) that Harry does so little. He spends so much time fighting, which is interesting, but at some point wouldn't you make a list of all the weird stuff you might need to know?

For example, one of the biggest mysteries is Harry's mother. Who she was, what she did, what she was a part of etc. Harry has been told repeatedly of her dangerous activity, her disregard of the council, her anarchist/activist nature and that she was involved with some really bad people (Lord Raith, Justin, Lea, Nicodemus, Ariana etc). But he has done almost no research into this. Why not call up Lea and say "Hey I need to know about my mother etc?"

And there are many more: What is a Starborn? Why do I have power over Outsiders? Maybe ask Mab a bit more about the Outsiders. He certainly should be having a larger chat with the Gatekeeper about all of that. Definitely some research into Kemmler would likely prove fruitful. What about asking Ebenezer about Drakul, Kincaid, how the supernatural nations hitmen work? And he really needs to read Merlin's journals, and maybe all those other ones. Which likely for plot reasons will only happen when Eb dies. How about the really weird mystic anomaly in Ghost Story where the "Shade" of Dresden is able to appear on Holy Ground, when others cannot e.g. Kravos. I think that the current theory is because Harry was not actually a "shade" but part "soul" as well. But still never explicitly answered.

I do understand that all will be revealed in time, plots need to form there own way. But surely you would ask more of these questions as it seems to affect just about everything you do?

Anyone got any other areas Harry should be researching?

1272
DF Spoilers / Re: Vadderung former Gatekeeper.
« on: November 04, 2018, 11:27:39 PM »
And also to add to your eight, LaFortier/Christos, Kemmler/Cowl, Kemmler/Grevane, Kemmler/Corpsetaker. Can't remember any others of significance off the top of my head.

The more I read stuff about Christos, the more I remember how he is such a likely candidate for Black Council/Circle. Could be Cowl, but I suspect they are just playing on the same team.

Oh yes, the Odin/Harry parallels are strong. I do wonder if Jim is setting something up, even if Harry doesn't = Odin. I think he has set up a few things like scars on purpose. Considering what we know about Vadderung and his foresight and planning, likely none of Harry's encounters with him were not pre-planned, even if Harry thinks they were. And Vadderung would definitely know of their connection. I am sure he has kept an eye on Merlin's bloodline and his line of apprentices, no doubt. Not to mention all the other reasons he has shown an interest in Harry.

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DF Spoilers / Re: Vadderung former Gatekeeper.
« on: November 04, 2018, 07:24:27 AM »
Bad Alias, the theory could still be true that Odin, Merlin and Harry are related (assuming Merlin isn't TT Harry or the Harry isn't Odin etc.) I mean they could all be the same guy, some have proposed. But if they are all separate individuals and they did all teach their blood relatives it could work. But we have no confirmation of any of this so it is all wild speculation.

All we do know is Odin taught Merlin and Merlin teachings have passed down the line, presumably to Harry.

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DF Spoilers / Re: Madeline Raith and Christos
« on: November 03, 2018, 05:05:08 AM »
Yeah I think KurtinStGeorge is right, Arjan. Peabody has been dead for too long, if you were gonna reveal it was him he has had ample time to do it. And the whole Egypt thing is a big mystery.

Some Black Council/Circle activity is definitely based there. There was some dark stuff in that Ghoul/Goblin series based there. And there was that massive destruction of the communications centre there where a senior regional commander (warden) was captured. Such a significant threat the Senior Council went out to fight. And of course as Morris says, the second step of the journey to Chichen Itza was a definitely a clue.

He has done a fair amount of foundational work around Egypt. I suspect he has something planned.

Morris - definitely could be a far future thing, especially if you buy into the GUMCT theory that is floating around. I think it was Serack's big cosmology/mythology of the universe. And quite a good one. Could indeed be that the Giza Necropolis Nevernever part is future/past or another universe. He has left the door open on it.

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DF Spoilers / Re: Rashid the Gatekeeper, Intellectus, Foresight.
« on: November 03, 2018, 04:56:12 AM »
Haha well how about that. Bone-fire...bon fire. Makes a lot of sense. Especially as in many myths and stories, burning the bones is a way to destroy the spirit. Perhaps that was the intention?

Haha Good on you, well maybe you can offer to ghost-write a few novels for him then! Certainly you'll have to get him to tell you the ending before you go. At the current rate though Jim might not outlast the series either! 25 years till the BAT at current rate, who knows how long those will take - he keeps saying they are each going to be enormous!

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