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McAnally's (The Community Pub) => Author Craft => Topic started by: gravesbane on May 05, 2008, 12:23:28 AM

Title: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: gravesbane on May 05, 2008, 12:23:28 AM
Is there a way to get ideas to JB? Of course these ideas would be free for his use and no acknowledgement required. These are just a few things that could be funny to see Harry deal with.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 05, 2008, 12:29:26 AM
I doubt there's any kind of formal thing to do with that, and it can get dicey if the copyright lawyers get their fingers in it, but rumor has it that he used one of Bob's ideas in Small Favor which was quite thrilling.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Yeratel on May 05, 2008, 06:49:24 AM
Most authors, and their publishers, avoid unsolicited ideas like a plague infested copyright lawsuit. Jim Butcher did on one occasion post a survey here to see which characters people would like to see more of, and said he got inspired by reader discussion in the forum to throw in something on Marcone's character development, but in his position, I would shred unread any suggestions received in the mail. There are too many hungry lawyers out there to take a chance, even if you do have a better idea of where his characters should go and what they should be doing than he does.  ;)
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: trboturtle on May 09, 2008, 08:04:23 PM
I think that Jim should neither ask for or take ideas from the public on any story idea. Because when it comes down to it, he is the sole author and the Dresden files is his, lock, stack and barrel. He may ask his circle of pre-reraders about what reads better in a scene, but he should be the only one to chose what he writes. Now, he may be influenced by public opinion, but it shouldn't be his sole decision.

Craig
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 09, 2008, 08:19:11 PM
I don't disagree with you, Craig, but consider that none of us live in a vaccuum. In a You Tube videos from the recent Small Favor signings called Originality (or something similiar to that) JB talks about how he *thought* he had this fabulous 'original' idea for Bob as a skull with glowing lights for eyes and he was so excited he'd come up with something so awesome that had never been done before... and then he sat down with his son and watched the opening sequence of Scooby Doo. Obviously, his unconscious nabbed the image and ran with it.

In the case with Bob, I think Jim saw a post Bob made here that likened
(click to show/hide)
, and used it as only JB can, expertly weaving the train of thought into the plot of Small Favor. While the idea itself pretty much is public domain, Jim had the class to mention to Bob after the fact that he'd swiped his idea cause he thought was a good one, and useful, and man, it made Bob's day!

Mind you, I think this is pretty much a unique scenario, (using a fan's idea) but I gotta give the man kudos for giving credit where it's due and never being arrogant or aloof about his talent.

Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: trboturtle on May 13, 2008, 12:24:49 AM
Quote from: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 09, 2008, 08:19:11 PM
I don't disagree with you, Craig, but consider that none of us live in a vaccuum. In a You Tube videos from the recent Small Favor signings called Originality (or something similiar to that) JB talks about how he *thought* he had this fabulous 'original' idea for Bob as a skull with glowing lights for eyes and he was so excited he'd come up with something so awesome that had never been done before... and then he sat down with his son and watched the opening sequence of Scooby Doo. Obviously, his unconscious nabbed the image and ran with it.

In the case with Bob, I think Jim saw a post Bob made here that likened
(click to show/hide)
, and used it as only JB can, expertly weaving the train of thought into the plot of Small Favor. While the idea itself pretty much is public domain, Jim had the class to mention to Bob after the fact that he'd swiped his idea cause he thought was a good one, and useful, and man, it made Bob's day!

Mind you, I think this is pretty much a unique scenario, (using a fan's idea) but I gotta give the man kudos for giving credit where it's due and never being arrogant or aloof about his talent.



True, but He shouldn't be in the position of accepting ideas as a matter of course -- the "What if?" question.....

Minor things are one thing -- Marcone easily slides into the role of robber baron, and it gives the character a little more death, and Jim acknowledged where the idea came from. But "what if?" questions should come from him and him alone, because "What if?" are plot related.

For example, say I EMailed Jim with "What if Harry Dresden won the lottery for $300 million, moves to California, and becomes Tom Cruise's personal soothsayer?" (It's the most off the wall idea I could think of, and I'm sure Jim is not going to be desperate enough to come close to using that -- I hope! ;D) First, the idea is so off the wall, Jim will quietly dig a hole and bury it in the garden. So, say for the sake of the argument, he sends back a little note, saying "thanks, but no thanks." So, I have wasted my time and his, maybe set myself up for a disappointment.

But, suppose he's working on a plotline that very closely resembles that? That opens up a whole can of worms, maybe leading to legal action down the road if I was prissy enough. I know of at least one fantsy novelist (whse name escapes me at the moment) who had to defend herself in court because some person had written a fanfiction that greatly resembled her recently published novel. It was so bad that she actively goes after fanfic authors who use her series for their stories. I know that JMS, the creator/guiding light behind Babaylon 5 had to scrap a storyline because somebody mentioned the idea on the main B5 forum whilew the storyline was being developed (I also heard that the fan sent a notizied letter to WB, declaiming all rights to the idea, and they dusted off the storyline and use it in a later season.)

So taking ideas is a very risky thing to do. If Jim came on and said, "I need a name for this character," That's one thing. But he shouldn't, IMHO, come on and say, "I need help with this plot point." Jim is a better writer then that, plus it's less hassle for him that the main ideas come from him instead of us.

Craig
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 13, 2008, 01:40:01 AM
Agreed. And Jim doesn't do that.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Shecky on May 13, 2008, 02:29:12 AM
It's been stated clearly for quite some time that he doesn't use others' story ideas. His use of Bob's phrase is something that's definitely in public domain (I mean that the phrase itself is common-usage), so it's clear of any legal trouble (not to mention that Bob's a good guy who wouldn't be a litigious twit over that LOL); other than that, he's always said that the answer is "no". It's purely preventative maintenance here; he has a really good connection with his fans and supporters and is very communicative with us, and he wants to KEEP that good connection by not opening the gates to some yet-unseen whackjob, even when it means keeping that gate closed to the vast majority who ARE on the up-and-up. He's insulating himself so he doesn't have to defend or distance himself.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: AverageGuy on May 13, 2008, 02:56:10 AM
Quote from: trboturtle on May 13, 2008, 12:24:49 AM
But, suppose he's working on a plotline that very closely resembles that? That opens up a whole can of worms, maybe leading to legal action down the road if I was prissy enough. I know of at least one fantsy novelist (whse name escapes me at the moment) who had to defend herself in court because some person had written a fanfiction that greatly resembled her recently published novel. It was so bad that she actively goes after fanfic authors who use her series for their stories. I know that JMS, the creator/guiding light behind Babaylon 5 had to scrap a storyline because somebody mentioned the idea on the main B5 forum whilew the storyline was being developed (I also heard that the fan sent a notizied letter to WB, declaiming all rights to the idea, and they dusted off the storyline and use it in a later season.)

So taking ideas is a very risky thing to do.
It's not, really.  It could lead to time in court, which would cost the author time and money they might not have, but copyright law's kind of sketchy when it comes to ideas, so odds are the author would win.  The problem is when specifics come in, but even there I'd take it on a case by case basis. 

But authors already tend to know where they want to go; plus, I imagine that they, and their publishers, don't want the appearance of impropriety.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Noey on May 13, 2008, 12:12:28 PM
I think the litigation reason is why the mods even watch ideas around here, too. There's a thread on the forum somewhere, I think in the Dresden Files Book Club, where someone had an idea about Elaine a long time ago. Mickey had to go all through the thread and delete the idea because it cuts too close to something Jim might actually want to do one day. So, instead of the idea, it all reads, "So, what if Elaine was edited by Mickey." All to make sure to protect JB, and it makes sense to do so.

In other news, I think Elaine should get a job at a newspaper and be edited by Mickey.  :D
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: gravesbane on May 13, 2008, 01:47:56 PM
I think you all are getting away from my original premise. That these ideas would be given to him to use as he sees fit without credit or reinburstment.

Also, I was thinking more in the line of little bits or gags not major story lines or plot points. Such as I am a barber by trade and over the course my career I have noticed that some women will not enter my shop at all. They stop at the threshold and will not cross it. I thought Dresden would be getting a haircut at a local shop notice this while he's there and comment on how their is far more to magic than he has imagined. (JB if you see this, it is your to use as you will)
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: gravesbane on May 13, 2008, 01:50:51 PM
Sorry about the mispell in my last post. :-[
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Noey on May 13, 2008, 01:53:01 PM
Gravesbane, I see what you're saying, but I think it's a matter of better safe than sued in Jim's case. It only takes one bad apple with a lawyer to ruin it. Besides, the books are Jim's vision and I'd hate to mess with that by making him feel obligated, or bad because he hurt feelings because he used one person's thing and not another person's contribution.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 13, 2008, 03:15:43 PM
And while you, gravesbane, may be an honorable person with altruistic intent, there are people out there who "flip" after the fact.

The conversation might go something like this:

*sitting at a bar* "Yeah you know, JB used one of my ideas in his latest book. I gave it to him free and clear, I'm just so happy he used it."

*Lawyer listening nearby* "You mean he used one of your ideas and didn't compensate you? Dude, he's a NY Times bestselling author, do you realize how much money he's making off you right now?"

"I don't care, I didn't do it for the money."

"But, hey man, he's living high on the hog on your idea. Without even a thank you in the dedication? Why should he get all the bennies? I'll bet that book wouldn't have been nearly so great without your idea. You should at least be compensated. Don't tell me you couldn't use an extra $10,000."

"Well, I do have a new baby on the way, and eldest is gonna need braces."

"Think of it this way. Any publicity is good publicity, right? We'll get him tons of publicity with this. It'll help sell even more books."

"Yeah, that'll be nice. All I really wanted to do was help the man out in the first place. *thinks in half drunk daze* Yeah. Let's do it. Let's sue him! It's a win win for everybody!"

And that's how they get you. Happens all the time.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Adam on May 13, 2008, 03:22:43 PM
I'm going to patent English and sue anyone who uses it.   :P
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 13, 2008, 03:24:35 PM
Dude! Think big! Copyright the alphabet!!!
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Adam on May 13, 2008, 03:54:33 PM
And punctuation.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 13, 2008, 03:56:27 PM
There you go. But punctuation is really a side stream... almost no one uses it right anyway!  :D
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Adam on May 13, 2008, 04:27:24 PM
Patent English and punctuation so everyone will be forced to use Internet slang or learn Esperanto.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 13, 2008, 04:28:04 PM
*dies*

No seriously.

*swings from self-made noose*
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Adam on May 13, 2008, 04:59:52 PM
ZOMG? WTF?!  LOLz!!111  tHeN wE cAn AlL dO tHiS!
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 13, 2008, 06:27:11 PM
ROFLMAO!

*sends Adam invoice for ruined keyboard*

Does anyone know how to get lime green koolaid out of a laptop??
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Madd on May 18, 2008, 08:07:01 PM
Idea sharing can be dangerous.  What if someone other than JB decides that THEY want to write a fantasy/detective novel, and they start using ideas from this board.  A shitty thing to do, but some people are that way.

I'm not saying we can't speculate as to where character development may be going, just that we shouldn't be trying to provide story lines.

Hell, I've loved the books this far, and they only get better.  I think JB is doing pretty damned well  :P
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: Murphy's Stunt Double on May 19, 2008, 03:18:18 AM
Hear Hear, Madd. Couldn't ask for better.
Title: Re: Does JB accept any ideas from his fans?
Post by: gemstone on May 19, 2008, 01:16:34 PM
This refers to the TV series, but I am sure to the books as well:

  http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,151.0.html