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McAnally's (The Community Pub) => Author Craft => Topic started by: Malakai Jones on May 01, 2008, 07:59:09 PM
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Would any of you enjoy reading a "dresden-esque" novel with heavy christian undertones? I feel that we christian readers don't have books that could be classified as "action/fantasy" usually. (Most christians are discouraged from reading books with wizards and witches..lol). Anyway, give me some opinions, some feed back . Thanks a lot, have a great day! ;D
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Not sure that it would be commercially viable, even if you could find someone sufficiently skilled to not let the religious message dictate the plot and characterizations. Now if Jim ever decided to write a novel about the Knights....
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I'm actually writing the book, I'm not really looking to make any money off of it really, just a hobby and I have a lot ideas. I've got several chapters down already, just wondering if a thing like that would interest any christian readers who are into more "fantasy" based stories.
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How do you define heavy Christian undertones?
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Would any of you enjoy reading a "dresden-esque" novel with heavy christian undertones? I feel that we christian readers don't have books that could be classified as "action/fantasy" usually. (Most christians are discouraged from reading books with wizards and witches..lol). Anyway, give me some opinions, some feed back . Thanks a lot, have a great day! ;D
Yes, I could enjoy such a novel. But you'd be treading dangerous ground and at risk for all kinds of pain due to the sensitive nature of fiddling with peoples heart felt beliefs. The Chronicles of Narnia succeeded though. Contrary to another poster, the religious message should help dictate plot and characterization or you are wasting the chance to appeal to Christian readers.
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How do you define heavy Christian undertones?
I'm saying like a person (much like Michael) are using their faith instead of magic to do things. ex. throw fire, teleport, yada yada, etc. lol. The story would lean heavily toward the age-old Good vs. Evil storylines. The only thing different would be more angels, demons, biblical references. I kno this might not appeal to all religions, but I promise it would in no way openly make fun of any other religion.
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Yes, I could enjoy such a novel. But you'd be treading dangerous ground and at risk for all kinds of pain due to the sensitive nature of fiddling with peoples heart felt beliefs. The Chronicles of Narnia succeeded though. Contrary to another poster, the religious message should help dictate plot and characterization or you are wasting the chance to appeal to Christian readers.
The plan would be to have an introduction that strictly emphasizes that this is Christian FICTION/FANTASY. lol, that none of it would go so far as to change anything the Word says or create any new doctrine..lol, that would be bad..lol
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I'm saying like a person (much like Michael) are using their faith instead of magic to do things. ex. throw fire, teleport, yada yada, etc. lol. The story would lean heavily toward the age-old Good vs. Evil storylines. The only thing different would be more angels, demons, biblical references. I kno this might not appeal to all religions, but I promise it would in no way openly make fun of any other religion.
Kinda goes against the Christian doctrine that we are all miserable sinners and all power comes from God, doesn't it? Unless you have your protagonist getting his/her power from God, I'm pretty sure that's some form of heresy. And if you are, where's the suspense if you can just cal on God for sufficient power to accomplish your task?
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lol, no heresy the ppl are getting the power from God, but like harry they can't just blast a hole in the earth, they have limits just like anybody else. Like you said, image an entire book about the knights of the cross, except,...lol, jim butcher isn't writing it....lol :D
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Um, I don't know if I've ever mentioned this but I am a Christian, a very deeply faithful and born-again Christian. That having been said, I've read more than 300 Action/Fantasy novels in the last eight years (since I got the first one for my 12th birthday) and I honestly see no problem with it. Despite what anyone says, Harry Potter isn't gonna send kids to hell, nor is Dresden or any other story. Also, so long as the reader as an ounce of sense, no one is gonna think that these stories are real. They're make believe. Fun, distracting, even enthralling make believe, as well as my favorite form of entertainment. But that doesn't make dangerous, unless you spend a week reading without sleep and your heart bursts or something. Honestly, what sane person has a problem with a Fantasy Novel, especially a well written one?
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Honestly, what sane person has a problem with a Fantasy Novel, especially a well written one?
I honestly hope you never have to find out.
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Um, I don't know if I've ever mentioned this but I am a Christian, a very deeply faithful and born-again Christian. That having been said, I've read more than 300 Action/Fantasy novels in the last eight years (since I got the first one for my 12th birthday) and I honestly see no problem with it. Despite what anyone says, Harry Potter isn't gonna send kids to hell, nor is Dresden or any other story. Also, so long as the reader as an ounce of sense, no one is gonna think that these stories are real. They're make believe. Fun, distracting, even enthralling make believe, as well as my favorite form of entertainment. But that doesn't make dangerous, unless you spend a week reading without sleep and your heart bursts or something. Honestly, what sane person has a problem with a Fantasy Novel, especially a well written one?
thanks, for the comment! could you recommend some titles? I'm getting in deep with this book and I would like to stretch out and get some more ideas. I didn't mean to make you think I say you will go to hell for reading harry potter..lol, that preposterous. I've read all the potter series and dresden, it's just that some christian audiences don't take to a "magic" book as they would a "faith" book. Thanks for the comment, though, open minded people are hard to find nowadays..lol.
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Honestly, what sane person has a problem with a Fantasy Novel, especially a well written one?
You should see the looks I got from people at the church I go to here when I said I'd read Harry Potter. There is no sane reason why they have a problem with fantasy, science fiction, witches, wizards, dragons and the like. I was raised in a Christian home and am still very much a Christian now. Sci-Fi and Fantasy are my favortie genres and I'm with you, neither is going to corrupt little children and send them to hell. Who hasn't imagined that they had some kind of speical power?
Malakai Jones...I think you have a good idea. I just PLEAD with you to keep the characters real. I can't count the number of "Christian Fiction" books I've tried to pick up and found the characters so unbelievable that I couldn't bear to read it. So many of them had characters that were too rightous and too perfect.
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well, since I don't feel the fear of idea phishing...lol, here's a small summary, a college kid, who was raised a christian is given the job to be a "squire" for one of the archangels, much like in the dresdenverse, things go south pretty soon. the kid and his roommate have to battle evil in an "unseen" battle of good and evil that the average world is all but oblivious to. Deaths occur, love is found, and a couple of demons a sizzled by bolts of electrity. lol, just a good romp with heroes that are working for a "higher" power, not that they themselves are any better than the rest. In fact, in many instances, their is a battle in one of the main characters about some "sinful" activities...lol. so, I'm trying to keep it,......fun,....i guess i'd have to say. I'm trying my best not to have one big copy of the bible..lol.
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Would any of you enjoy reading a "dresden-esque" novel with heavy christian undertones? I feel that we christian readers don't have books that could be classified as "action/fantasy" usually. (Most christians are discouraged from reading books with wizards and witches..lol). Anyway, give me some opinions, some feed back . Thanks a lot, have a great day! ;D
I'm not Christian...but it sounds like a good idea. It doesn't make fun of or insult other religious beliefs. And it's a fantasy story that sounds fun so go for it.
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Mal--you should probably find and watch a copy of the movie Miracles with Tom Conti and Terri Garr. Best religious movie ever made.
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well, since I don't feel the fear of idea phishing...lol, here's a small summary, a college kid, who was raised a christian is given the job to be a "squire" for one of the archangels, much like in the dresdenverse, things go south pretty soon. the kid and his roommate have to battle evil in an "unseen" battle of good and evil that the average world is all but oblivious to. Deaths occur, love is found, and a couple of demons a sizzled by bolts of electrity. lol, just a good romp with heroes that are working for a "higher" power, not that they themselves are any better than the rest. In fact, in many instances, their is a battle in one of the main characters about some "sinful" activities...lol. so, I'm trying to keep it,......fun,....i guess i'd have to say. I'm trying my best not to have one big copy of the bible..lol.
I'm not religious either, but this sounds like a really fun idea that I'd definitely pick up at the bookstore. I love epic stuff. :)
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I'm saying like a person (much like Michael) are using their faith instead of magic to do things. ex. throw fire, teleport, yada yada, etc. lol. The story would lean heavily toward the age-old Good vs. Evil storylines. The only thing different would be more angels, demons, biblical references. I kno this might not appeal to all religions, but I promise it would in no way openly make fun of any other religion.
I'd love to read something like that! Like Wolfshadow, I am a committed Christian and a lover of fantasy and see no conflict between being those two things at the same time. A fun related story... You know those essays you have to write for college applications? In 2000, when I was applying to the Christian college that I ended up attending, one of the essay questions on the application was to write about a book (other than the Bible) that had changed your life in a really significant, really good way. I wrote on Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets. I bet the day my app came in was an atypical day in the admissions office, especially back then! :) They let me in anyway, obviously. My alma mater has been pro-Harry Potter from the start, though. As they should be! :D
About books... I read and liked Shadowmancer by GP Taylor. I think he pulled off the fantasy/Christian worldview thing reasonably well in Shadowmancer, but it's the only book of his that I've read. I haven't read much recently published "Christian fiction" in the last couple years, so I can't really give an opinion of what I think of it in general. Most of the Christian fiction that I see other people reading falls under the category of Christian romance novels, which is a genre that I've never felt a desire to explore. Same goes for romance novels in general. They're just not my thing.
Opinions on other notable Christian authors who have written stuff that could potentially be called SF or fantasy... I enjoy Frank Peretti sometimes. I like some of his YA/kids' books, like Hangman's Curse and the Cooper kids adventure series. His books for adults, not so much. Regarding a famous author tandem that shall not be named... to say that I am not a fan of the Left Behind books would be a gross understatement. I made the mistake of reading the first couple volumes in high school because some friends recommended them. Didn't like the books. The writing and character development leave much to be desired. Plus, the authors go into dangerous territory theologically with their fictional interpretation of Biblical apocalyptic references and are irresponsible about it. That's my opinion, at any rate.
Malaki - I hope the writing process is going well and that you're having a lot of fun with it! Please keep us posted on your progress with the book! ;)
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wow, you guys are real great at encouraging somebody! I love the comments posted, thanks lots. Spread the word so I can get some more opinions! You guys are a GREAT help!!! ;D
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I am a Christian and have always been disappointed with the scifi/fantasy section in the Christian bookstores. They basically don't exist. You're little blurb up there sounded real interesting. Over on the RPG, Tagnizkur and I have characters that I may eventually write into a book. Basically, they are imbued with angelic power to battle evil in the world.
Speaking of Tag, please keep him in your prayers. His wife is having pregnancy complications and they might have to deliver their little one early. The baby would be 33weeks and go straight to the NICU. Tag is an incredible man, I hope the Lord strengthens him right now.
But yes, a novel like yours would certainly find an audience.
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Malakai you might wanna try the writer forums, they seem to be a big help to a lot of folks.
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Lol, didn't even think about that...haha thanks
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First and foremost, it would have to be a good story, and well written. Fantasy and scifi books with themes related to Christianity that I've read and enjoyed are C.S. Lewis' Perelandra Trilogy and Chronicles of Narnia.
I've also read some horrible dreck, whose sole purpose seemed to be to preach Bible Fundamentalism to the reader in the guise of a fictional character. The worst I can think of offhand is Sherlock Holmes In Dallas, where not only is the fictional Victorian era detective called in to solve the conspiracy behind the Kennedy assassination (!!!), but also spends long paragraphs preaching to Dr. Watson on the nature of sin and the teachings of Jesus.
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Want me to move this thread to the Author Craft forum, Malakai?
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To be honest, there's a lot about TDF that's fairly heavily Judeo-Christian, not to mention that Harry himself seems to be getting set up as a Messianic figure (especially if we consider that Jesus wasn't perfect and had his "moments").
Still, while I'm pretty securely in a Harryesque "theological Switzerland", I think the idea of the holy wizard is interesting - with faith magic linked to arcane magic, that opens up a lot of doors. Mystic theurge, anyone? :)
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First and foremost, it would have to be a good story, and well written. Fantasy and scifi books with themes related to Christianity that I've read and enjoyed are C.S. Lewis' Perelandra Trilogy and Chronicles of Narnia.
My first thought was also of CS Lewis' Perelandra Trilogy. (I wasn't a fan of Narnia, even as a child) I haven't read it for years (and literally I mean YEARS) but I thought it was brilliant. I suspect they have held up well, although for some reason I still remember the bit where they land and realize there was a hard surface road that might very well allow vehicles to go 100 MILES/HR! Still I bet it does hold up really well. Lewis really was/is incredible.
The problem is, we can't all be CS Lewis' and that's where it becomes a fine line between "religious overtones or religious themes" to religious dogma. Since you aren't interested in marketing it, go for it. If you really would like to use sci fi as a background to further a religious attitude--you might try accessing the 2008 Writer's Market. As I read through listings there did seem to be several publishers that were seeking religious themed novels. You could get the names and then access their websites for submission details.
Bottom line though is having a good story. Truthfully, all the sci fi books I read, carry forward the religious themes that I believe in. Good is good--whether a demon or a human, if they act that way. Struggles against temptation are always interesting. Besides once you really get rolling you might find that the characters and plot take you other directions, just as interesting to pursue. If you are thinking about riding the age curve as Narnia movie fans grow up, you might find some special nitch that is perfect for you.
Good luck!
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Want me to move this thread to the Author Craft forum, Malakai?
Yes plz Priscellie, thanks! Didn't realize I'd get as this many replies!
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1. small advice to the Malakai: the frequency you say "lol" is a bit annoying to me, especially becasue what you write is interesting otherwise.
2. I am not a christian, and I would never read a novel if it comes across as dogma, regardless of religious background. now, if the setting is solely based on christian background and powers come from the christian god, I'd have no problem reading it, just as other fantasy explain powers otherwise. In fact, as christian religion is a real world belief, a well executed take on someone with religiously motivated powers could be rather interesting.
Actually, I think Dresden Files is a pro-christian series as well. Michael and Father Forthill are covered not only in a respectful and positive way, but Dresden's struggle with fatih comes across like someone searching for (the christian) god.
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1. small advice to the Malakai: the frequency you say "lol" is a bit annoying to me, especially becasue what you write is interesting otherwise.
What does that have to do with anything?
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What does that have to do with anything?
I find it very irritating and I like to point people out when they do stuff that detracts from otherwise OK things. just like people with a huge amount of spelling mistakes that make posts unreadable. If someone puts smileys or lols everywhere, the real smiles don't come across anymore, IMO. It was just a small advice which noone has to follow.
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We have a positive, non-critical attitude, and welcome everyone.... lol or spelling errors, even those with rather overbearing opinions. Even our "touchy subject areas" are expressly for civil discussion. I personally am offended by someone that appears to be critical of others as it implies that one's view point or personal preferences should take precedent over another persons. Such is a rare, rare occurrence on the Jim-butcher.com forum.
As you read more posts, I believe you will find this a pleasant place, filled with many attitudes, ages, opinions, spelling gurus ,and not so spelling or grammar proficient people. And yes, some of us enjoy emotes.
Of course, if you find it difficult to be welcomed in such a place--it is your own decision to go elsewhere. I understand that something called "flaming" seems to be par on some forums. Happily it isn't here.
We look forward to you sharing your own views, opinions, humor, stories, and sharing ours with you.
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*Stops polishing his overbearing opinions long enough to look around with an expression of slight confusion*
;)
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Would any of you enjoy reading a "dresden-esque" novel with heavy christian undertones? I feel that we christian readers don't have books that could be classified as "action/fantasy" usually. (Most christians are discouraged from reading books with wizards and witches..lol). Anyway, give me some opinions, some feed back . Thanks a lot, have a great day! ;D
Heavily Christian books are usually published by Christian presses. Someone I know is slogging through The Oath by Frank E. Peretti right now. I'm told it's one of the better selling titles in Christian speculative fiction. My impression is that most sf/f publishers won't touch anything too overtly religious, while Christian publishers won't publish anything that isn't heavily allegorical. It sounds like what you want is halfway in between, unfortunately.
Plenty of Christians are told to think for themselves and read whatever they want. (lol) If a group has a problem with Harry Potter, I don't think you're going to appease anyone by reading or writing more overtly Christian fantasy novels. Write whatever pleases you personally.
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O.k., :D, I was gone for most of the past two days and couldn't check the message board, but as far as advice goes thanks to everybody! Moritz, thanks for the advice, and yes, I do say "lol" to much. But, in all actuality I am actually laughing/smiling/find it humorous when I put that. If it annoys you, I'm sorry for that, but otherwise your advice was great.
Wolfhowls, thanks for the defense. ..... ;D
Meg_evonne, don't let stuff like that get ya down, in the grand scheme of things, you will have forgotten it by this time next week
And finally, Franzeska, Thanks for your advice. I am trying to bridge a gap that is put there by trying to write a novel like this. Maybe I can hit a good sweet spot as far as publishers go. Maybe I'll get lucky. You never know, if I'm writing for the Lord, I might get some kickbacks. ;)
Everybody have a great day!
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p.s. Paynesgrey, your post made me "LOL" a lot....thats great stuff
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So you could say that... you're on a mission from Gahd? *ducks*
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What would make interesting is that you make the roommate a Muslim.
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What would make interesting is that you make the roommate a Muslim.
That would be a good idea, but I don't know enough about the muslim culture to write about it. I wouldn't want to do any injustice to the religion.
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That would be a good idea, but I don't know enough about the muslim culture to write about it. I wouldn't want to do any injustice to the religion.
Good that you don't want to do that. But you can do some research and ask again.
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I agree with Wolfhowls, I think your attitude of concern about offending and the respectful treatment of another relegion is a fine starting point to learn and guide others in your story to do that same. If that was in the story to boot, you would have my nickel. :)
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well, lol, hopefully i can garner more of than a nickel out of ya? :D, but really thanks.
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If any of you would like to read/proofread/criticize the first chapter of my novel. give me a message or email, and i'll send it to ya!