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The Dresden Files => DF Spoilers => Topic started by: Conspiracy Theorist on July 21, 2020, 10:31:54 AM
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Why? why???
Harry normally acts under some injury or other, but why this silly, silly made up disease? Has Harry run out of bits of anatomy to be shot in?
It is in my opinion only justifiable if it has some prolonged impact upon Harry, for example that wizards do not come into their full power until they have got over conjouritis. The wizard population is too small and too spread out for it to be a virus or bacteria, it just couldn’t spread enough to continue within an active population, unless vanilla mortals are asymptomatic carriers, but then Harry would have picked it up years ago. This suggests that it might be a developmental condition related to magic users rather than a disease, like descending testicles for mortal men, part of the maturation process.
The only other distinguishing point physiology speaking Harry has in relation to other wizards is that he is Starborn, which gives protection over Outsiders. Is his delayed Conjuritis related to that?
But why?????
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I thought that disturbing, too. I was hoping it was an early sign of conjuring and shape shifting abilities. And not some children's disease. But it could still be. I'm not giving up hope. Also, I can't imagine, Harry has never heard of that. Except, someone manipulated memories, either Harry's or those of everyone else, so that they told him, it was a disease and not some curse or some new abilities. As to why, I have no idea. Let's wait and see.
OK, maybe one idea: it could be developing a new talent, that would make him more dangerous, if he concentrated too much on it to learn to master it, so some adversary tries to make it appear as something else. Maybe a talent that isn't practiced, withers and dies, or one does never gain control over it.
I was thinking on manipulation of memories that have knowingly occurred in the books until now.
There was the missing blasting rod and therefore fuego in Small Favor through Mab and the memory manipulation by Molly in Changes, so that Harry forgets that he has hired a killer.
I counted only manipulations directly involving Harry.
And there were the mind magic attacks by corpsetaker in dead beat.
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People have drawn parallels with Tavi.
He made the bargain with Lea and never fulfilled it. Lea told us at the Red Party that it affected his power.
With him taking the Winter Mantle all bargains are fulfilled and he has access to his full power for the first time since adolescence. Without Bob or someone else to explain when "young wizards" usually get it will have to guess. After no sign of it with Molly and she was a wizard in her late 20s.
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Weak attempt at comic relief? ??? Other than that is seemed pretty pointless except maybe to
point out that Harry is still a mortal. He may have a mantle that numbs him to physical pain, but
he still can get injured. He is a powerful wizard and a star born, but he is still human and not immune to catching the same things that the rest of us are, i.e. allergies, colds, and yeah, childhood diseases. We all know there are vaccines against the likes of measles and mumps now, but some do not get them and if an adult catches one of these diseases it can be lot more serious than in their kids..
My theory is little Maggie had it, we know that she has talent from the short story, but Harry doesn't.
If she had a very mild case, especially since he had never had it before and doesn't know she has
talent yet, he may have thought it was a mere cold and he simply caught it from her. Welcome to the "Parent's Club" Harry, we share a lot with our kids, and they share a lot with us, that includes any contagious diseases that we don't have an immunity to. So I think it was thrown in there simply to underscore that little Maggie has talent, she had the wizard's childhood thing, Harry didn't recognize it, caught it, got sicker because childhood diseases are almost always harder on adults.
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People have drawn parallels with Tavi.
He made the bargain with Lea and never fulfilled it. Lea told us at the Red Party that it affected his power.
With him taking the Winter Mantle all bargains are fulfilled and he has access to his full power for the first time since adolescence. Without Bob or someone else to explain when "young wizards" usually get it will have to guess. After no sign of it with Molly and she was a wizard in her late 20s.
I like it.
I also think his experiences in Ghost Story (where he learned how ghosts can make stuff out of memory) could give him a unique perspective on conjuritis.
Controlled conjuration, with the stabilization technique Eb uses on the bucket in the cornerhound fight, could be a really powerful technique.
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With him taking the Winter Mantle all bargains are fulfilled and he has access to his full power for the first time since adolescence. Without Bob or someone else to explain when "young wizards" usually get it will have to guess. After no sign of it with Molly and she was a wizard in her late 20s.
Or like Harry she simply wasn't exposed or allergic to what ever causes it. Lots of people for example are immune to poison ivy, then as adults upon exposure find themselves with a massive case.. Conversely some people grow out of their allergies, as I kid strawberries gave me hives, they don't any more. Some kids can be around other kids with chicken pox, never catch it, but to their dismay catch it as an adult.
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I had assumed that at some point in the story (or battle ground) that he would need to create an object (like the bucket for the gasoline, but more serious) and we'd see him hoping around trying to make himself sneeze so he could make it - without having to see him learn how to conjure items out of the NN suddenly.
Of course, after having it, he should realize it is totally in his power to conjure items out of the NN and we might see him add that to his list of skills.
Though the whole spider thing bothered me because he also somehow conjured minds for them, which seemed odd.
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Though the whole spider thing bothered me because he also somehow conjured minds for them, which seemed odd.
Maybe conjuritis includes summoning stuff. In that case, they already had minds; he just called them here.
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Yeah, while reading it, I totally assumed it was somehow a major sign of a geasa lifted or some type of time/power tweak, the fact that young, developing wizards got it and Harry was getting it then. As silly as it is, I suspect it is actually rather significant.
A worst case scenario would be Jim split the books and needed filler for the 1st one but that just does not strike me as Jim. And I love the idea that it would enhance his understanding of summoning / creating via NN.
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Yeah, while reading it, I totally assumed it was somehow a major sign of a geasa lifted or some type of time/power tweak, the fact that young, developing wizards got it and Harry was getting it then. As silly as it is, I suspect it is actually rather significant.
A worst case scenario would be Jim split the books and needed filler for the 1st one but that just does not strike me as Jim. And I love the idea that it would enhance his understanding of summoning / creating via NN.
Or like mood swings that come with puberty? ::) As we all know there is a wide age range for it depending on a lot of things, my youngest son had the voice change etc at eleven my older son not fully until he was almost sixteen. We adopted both kids, they had different ethnic backgrounds, one small and slight of build the other very tall and stout.. Maybe because he is so powerful, and larger than average his wizard hormones took longer to fully kick in?
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Put me in the Maggie camp.
There was a frying pan in the first few chapters Harry didn't conjure but turned into ectoplasm. My vote? Maggie did it.
His noticing Hope Carpenter gaining a figure was part and parcel with him realizing she's only a few years older than Maggie.
Same with Ivy.
Eb's objection to keeping with Maggie was that she didn't have her power yet. This stops being a bone of contention between grandfather and grandson if her power is already manifested- it's a moot point. Harry would then gain a new apprentice- or maybe as a peace offering, Eb will.
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Put me in the Maggie camp.
There was a frying pan in the first few chapters Harry didn't conjure but turned into ectoplasm. My vote? Maggie did it.
His noticing Hope Carpenter gaining a figure was part and parcel with him realizing she's only a few years older than Maggie.
Same with Ivy.
Eb's objection to keeping with Maggie was that she didn't have her power yet. This stops being a bone of contention between grandfather and grandson if her power is already manifested- it's a moot point. Harry would then gain a new apprentice- or maybe as a peace offering, Eb will.
I agree, as a parent and a grand parent, I understand fully the impact of the "daycare plague." Not for nothing did Jim write that short story about little Maggie, clearly some of her powers have awakened, which means she could of had a mild case mistaken for a cold by Harry, who didn't even know what conjouritis was never having had it, until he caught it at a really bad time.
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The first few times I figured it was Bonea trying to be helpful in a toddler way. Overall the comic relief element of it fell flat for me most of the time. You can have it be annoying for Harry, but when it becomes a helpful bucket, I think it's too far.
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It would make sense if it was a tip off to Maggie having talent. We don't know whether or not she does. Zoo Day doesn't tell us. Maggie got the book from the Carpenter kids who do not have talent. Being able to fight the monsters from the book is about being a kid and having knowledge. Not have wizard powers.
It makes sense that Harry, and to a lesser extent, Molly never got it. Harry was extremely isolated from other wizards. He didn't go to Council meetings with his master, either one. Harry explicitly says that Molly will be expected to go with him whenever he goes to Council functions. Harry never had that when he was an apprentice. The only Council functions he goes to until becoming a warden are his trials. After he goes, he's seen less than any wizard except for Rashid.
Are we told it's a childhood disease, or just a young wizard's disease? Because young means something very different to wizards. It could mean by late twenties or even early thirties. It could be like the "Sight coming in" thing. Harry was in his early thirties when that happened.
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Yeah, the Maggie thing works. She's got talent, and got conjouritis at the right age and talent level. She made the pan.
And Harry got it too, just like a parent getting chickenpox as an adult when they didn't get it as a kid, because their kid brought it home.
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My one question about the pan is, did Harry experience a drain of power when the pan showed up. If not, at least to me, the Maggie has it is basically confirmed.
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Yeah, the Maggie thing works. She's got talent, and got conjouritis at the right age and talent level. She made the pan.
And Harry got it too, just like a parent getting chickenpox as an adult when they didn't get it as a kid, because their kid brought it home.
And chicken pox is always worse for adults.. So in the shaft when Harry is thinking he doesn't want to see giant spiders in there with him, that is exactly what his brain conjured. Giant spiders on steroids because the more powerful the young wizard the more exaggerated the conjuring until control is gained.
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Does he sneeze Sue into existence because he is reminded of Cowl’s blackout in Dead Beat and that would be a handy way to get around with no cars?
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Does he sneeze Sue into existence because he is reminded of Cowl’s blackout in Dead Beat and that would be a handy way to get around with no cars?
Would all the ectoplasm have to come out of his nose??
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Reading the posts made here so far, I realized I wasn't the only person who found the humor of this illness just fell flat and came across as silly rather than funny. I also can see Maggie as the vector for this infection, but I wonder if the illness represents something more serious. Perhaps it's the first sign that carrying the Winter Knight's mantel is taking a toll on Harry, in this case by weakening his immune system. Remember, the first time it occurred Harry felt a deep ache in his limbs that didn't fade for several seconds. The mantle should have kept Harry from feeling any pain, even a dull achy one. It's a sign that Harry is starting to run up against his limits.
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I figure it was the clue for what he does later with Molly's illusion. It's basically the same thing with extra steps...
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I think the Conjouritis is a set up for mirror mirror....harry sneezes and he somens a duplicate of himself from a mirror universe.
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I don’t Think so, what we know of Mirror Mirror it is Harry who is pulled into a parallel world,
As regards Grifter, that would be absolutely horrible for Harry, so yes, that is probably what Jim would go with
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Reading the posts made here so far, I realized I wasn't the only person who found the humor of this illness just fell flat and came across as silly rather than funny. I also can see Maggie as the vector for this infection, but I wonder if the illness represents something more serious. Perhaps it's the first sign that carrying the Winter Knight's mantel is taking a toll on Harry, in this case by weakening his immune system. Remember, the first time it occurred Harry felt a deep ache in his limbs that didn't fade for several seconds. The mantle should have kept Harry from feeling any pain, even a dull achy one. It's a sign that Harry is starting to run up against his limits.
Possible, but as a parent, and now a grand parent discovering "the daycare plague" when I visit after not being around young children for any amount of time, I am not overly concerned that Harry is experiencing some immune response breakdown. Aside from limited exposure to the Carpenter kids, and then the contact wasn't the hugging etc that goes along with having kids, Harry just
hasn't been around young kids very much. They are walking petri dishes, and as parents we are
fated to catch whatever, I think that is what is going on, I hope that is what's going on.
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Possible, but as a parent, and now a grand parent discovering "the daycare plague" when I visit after not being around young children for any amount of time, I am not overly concerned that Harry is experiencing some immune response breakdown. Aside from limited exposure to the Carpenter kids, and then the contact wasn't the hugging etc that goes along with having kids, Harry just
hasn't been around young kids very much. They are walking petri dishes, and as parents we are
fated to catch whatever, I think that is what is going on, I hope that is what's going on.
Yeah, I'm of the opinion that the conjuritis is Jim showing Harry growing into his role as a parent, with the bumps along the way. That kind of theme was strong in this book. It's too silly a premise to be a major cluebat.
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But what if the Conjouritis gets worse, and Harry starts snarting, conjouring at both ends simultaneously?
Seriously it smacks of being a deus ex machina.
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Perhaps it's the first sign that carrying the Winter Knight's mantel is taking a toll on Harry, in this case by weakening his immune system. Remember, the first time it occurred Harry felt a deep ache in his limbs that didn't fade for several seconds. The mantle should have kept Harry from feeling any pain, even a dull achy one. It's a sign that Harry is starting to run up against his limits.
Or a warning sign that suppressing the mantle's dark urges with extreme exercise is doing underlying damage.
If Butters is right that the mantle is primarily a 'magic feather' for pain suppression rather than a free buff to physical strength, a deep ache sounds just about right for habitually pushing all your muscles and joints past their limits. Perhaps the illness isn't so much causing the pain as temporarily interfering with the mantle masking the pain of what he's been causing himself.
I'm thinking he'd better take LtW or River Shoulders up on that offer of anger management lessons sooner rather than later.
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Or a warning sign that suppressing the mantle's dark urges with extreme exercise is doing underlying damage.
I'd think wizard healing would mean that slow accumulation of damage wouldn't really be an issue, though.
In PT Butters seems more concerned that Harry will outright break bones by using super-strength, which the wizard healing wouldn't prevent.
(And I think Butters kind of underestimates what the Mantle does for Harry; he's several times used it to do things that are just flatly beyond human capability, and I think the running endurance/speed he talks about late in PT is also probably beyond human capacity - overriding your limits won't actually give you more energy.)
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I'd think wizard healing would mean that slow accumulation of damage wouldn't really be an issue, though.
In PT Butters seems more concerned that Harry will outright break bones by using super-strength, which the wizard healing wouldn't prevent.
(And I think Butters kind of underestimates what the Mantle does for Harry; he's several times used it to do things that are just flatly beyond human capability, and I think the running endurance/speed he talks about late in PT is also probably beyond human capacity - overriding your limits won't actually give you more energy.)
If anything the conjouritis is a distraction, whether Jim meant for it to be or not. The whole thing could have been cleared up if Butters had asked Harry if little Maggie had had the sniffles lately?
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I'd think wizard healing would mean that slow accumulation of damage wouldn't really be an issue, though.
In PT Butters seems more concerned that Harry will outright break bones by using super-strength, which the wizard healing wouldn't prevent.
(And I think Butters kind of underestimates what the Mantle does for Harry; he's several times used it to do things that are just flatly beyond human capability, and I think the running endurance/speed he talks about late in PT is also probably beyond human capacity - overriding your limits won't actually give you more energy.)
Not to mention the boosted healing factor the WK mantle gives, after he fights Andi he writes off some gashes as things that'll be gone in a day or two.
“Several weeks,” Molly said. “There are so many cuts here, I don’t think I have enough Band-Aids. We’ll have to wrap it, I guess.”
“I’ll just put a clean shirt over them,” I said. “Look, it isn’t a big deal. Little marks like that are going to be gone in a day or two.”
Speaking from experience, even dog scratches that don't draw blood will still be there in a day or two, let alone ones that tear through a suit.
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I had a COMPLETELY Different take on The Conjouritis. I thought it might relate to Maggie and HER powers. NOT Fun Fact: childhood diseases are sometimes worse in adults (chickenpox is), Maggie could have a less noticeable form of the same disease, Harry is bigger and stronger with more magic, so it's more disruptive. Here's the thing about children, the spread germs VERY efficiently, they bring cold from school and EVERYONE gets sick! Being a parent often means being sick because your kid gave you a cold, sometimes your cold is worse than theirs. If you missed a childhood disease in your own childhood, your own child could bring it home from school or from friends. Maggie goes to school and had been shown interacting with children in the magical community (the Svartalves in this novel) so she could have brought something home from any of the places she goes and the kids she plays with. Dresden has become a full time parent, sometimes it's gross, and sometimes it makes you sick. However I do concede that my mind might be on children spread things in school and bringing them home only because of the "Summer of COVID."
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I had a COMPLETELY Different take on The Conjouritis. I thought it might relate to Maggie and HER powers. NOT Fun Fact: childhood diseases are sometimes worse in adults (chickenpox is), Maggie could have a less noticeable form of the same disease, Harry is bigger and stronger with more magic, so it's more disruptive. Here's the thing about children, the spread germs VERY efficiently, they bring cold from school and EVERYONE gets sick! Being a parent often means being sick because your kid gave you a cold, sometimes your cold is worse than theirs. If you missed a childhood disease in your own childhood, your own child could bring it home from school or from friends. Maggie goes to school and had been shown interacting with children in the magical community (the Svartalves in this novel) so she could have brought something home from any of the places she goes and the kids she plays with. Dresden has become a full time parent, sometimes it's gross, and sometimes it makes you sick. However I do concede that my mind might be on children spread things in school and bringing them home only because of the "Summer of COVID."
That has been my view all along, and the obvious answer. Poor Harry has no wizard parents to relate this to. Eb could have elaborated more than he did about it, but he didn't.
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Conjuritis is just foreshadowing the next way jim tortures harry. Its a disease wizard kids often get. Harrys to old to normally get it, which is why it's funny. But the disease isn't to torture Harry its the implications.
Wizard kids get it, and harry never built up an immunity.
*Wizard* kids. Maggie. She's got power. This foreshadows it. And kids are petri dishes. He got it from her because he was never exposed as a kid.
Jim likes to torture Harrys body but it gets old if you dont hit him in the brain, heart, and soul too.
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Conjuritis is just foreshadowing the next way jim tortures harry. Its a disease wizard kids often get. Harrys to old to normally get it, which is why it's funny. But the disease isn't to torture Harry its the implications.
Only if you have never been a parent and caught one your kid's so called "childhood diseases." Normally the symptoms are ten times worse to even serious in an adult.. So no laughing matter.
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Tell that to ebenezar and lara
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Tell that to ebenezar and lara
Lara has never had kids as far as I know, I don't think Thomas counts because I bet he wasn't ever allowed to play around other kids. Eb has never been around them.. Like I said, easy to laugh if you've never caught a so called childhood disease as an adult.
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Also, does Lara even have any personal experience with being sick? I'd think the White Court healing would probably make disease a non-issue.
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I suspect that Lara has raised sevral of her siblings over the years. remember both inari Thomas's younger sister and Thomas were raised by lara. I am sure as kids that thomas and inari got to play with other kids because the white court has a tradition of waiting till they feed and kill before informing them they are vampires
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Yes, and all of Thomas male teenage friends kept pushing him for a sleepover at his family’s place. It was annoying when they were 13, it must have got embarrassing when they were doing it when they were 19.
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Also, does Lara even have any personal experience with being sick? I'd think the White Court healing would probably make disease a non-issue.
Indeed, as I said, unless she has caught chicken pox or measles as an adult, she has no clue.
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Indeed, as I said, unless she has caught chicken pox or measles as an adult, she has no clue.
Yeah - and I don't think she could due to Whampire healing. Lara probably hasn't been sick in 200 years (or however long she's been a full Whampire) and doesn't have a clear memory of what it's like.
The Raiths must have some degree of disease protection, I'd think.