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The Dresden Files => DFRPG => Topic started by: CrackedOzy on February 12, 2013, 08:44:10 PM

Title: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: CrackedOzy on February 12, 2013, 08:44:10 PM

Is there a way to have a Catch for Recovery that instead of being something that prevents, being something that is required?

In other words, rather than say having a Catch of "fire" so your Recovery doesn't work on fire damage, you have a Recovery that requires something, such as blood or brains in order to work. Is this possible as the rules are written and if not, could this be a viable house rule option?

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Deadmanwalking on February 12, 2013, 08:47:02 PM

Well, there's always Feeding Dependency or Human Form [+2] both of which might be appropriate for this kind of thing.Really, I think that's the best way to handle it in the rules-as-is. Human Form [+2] is particularly appropriate, IMO.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Hick Jr on February 12, 2013, 08:47:27 PM

For blood/brains, Blood Drinker with the Recovery being governed by Feeding Dependency might work.

For everything else, there's Limitation, which can be found in the Custom Powers thread.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Mr. Death on February 12, 2013, 08:49:33 PM

Quote from: CrackedOzy on February 12, 2013, 08:44:10 PM

Is there a way to have a Catch for Recovery that instead of being something that prevents, being something that is required?

In other words, rather than say having a Catch of "fire" so your Recovery doesn't work on fire damage, you have a Recovery that requires something, such as blood or brains in order to work. Is this possible as the rules are written and if not, could this be a viable house rule option?

I did this for an Item of Power based on the Phoenix, and we ended up going with Human Form for the +1.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: CrackedOzy on February 12, 2013, 09:01:13 PM

Well really the idea I wanted to use this for was for a Gargoyle who had to turn to stone and sleep off the damage. How would you handle that?

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Hick Jr on February 12, 2013, 09:02:52 PM

Mythic recovery governed by a Limitation of "Recovery only works while sleeping, represented mechanically as skipping a scene." Probably providing a +3/4 rebate.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: CrackedOzy on February 12, 2013, 09:14:28 PM

Mythic is higher than I was thinking, but where is that Limitation stuff? I skimmed over the Custom Power thread and didn't see it.

Also, is there anyway to mimic this by the book? (Or using one of the other Fate books?) My group can get a little squeamish on fan created stuff.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Deadmanwalking on February 12, 2013, 09:20:28 PM

Human Form [+2] still seems the way to go. It's made for this kind of situation, really. Combine with reasonable Catch and you've got a pretty cheap power, really.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Sanctaphrax on February 12, 2013, 09:23:41 PM

Here's Limitation.

It does everything. It's not that clearly written, though, so I'm going to reword it soon.

(click to show/hide)

LIMITATION [+varies]
Description: Your abilities are limited in some way.
Note: You may take this Power multiple times. Suffering from the negative consequences of taking this Power will often, but not always, be a Compel. If the importance of this Power changes during play, it might be necessary to change its cost or compensate with Compels.
Skills Affected: None.
Effects:
Limited Powers. Attach this Power to at least one other Power that you possess. Then, select a circumstance. Whenever that circumstance applies, you are treated as though you did not possess the attached abilities. You may not select Powers with drawbacks unless the GM approves, and even if the GM does approve they may rule that you do not receive any rebate for the cost of the Powers in question.
Rebate. This Power reduces the Refresh cost of the attached Powers. The percentage that the cost is reduced by depends upon how commonly the limitation on your Powers will cause problems for you.

• If it will matter rarely (perhaps once every 6 sessions or so), reduce the cost by one-sixth.
• If it will cause problems from time to time (in some, but not all, sessions), reduce the cost by one fourth.
• If it will be a frequent impediment (once a session on average), reduce the cost by half.
• If it will prevent you from using your Powers except in unusual situations (no more than once a session on average), reduce the cost by three fourths.

At the GM's discretion, difficult-to-classify limitations might grant a rebate in between two of the suggested ones. Decimal costs should be rounded to the nearest integer, with GMs rounding halves based on what cost seems more appropriate.
Item Limitation [-0]. You may transfer Limitation and the Powers attached to it to another character, causing you to lose them and causing the other character to gain them. They may then transfer them freely, but if another character has your Powers when a Milestone occurs, they must pay for them. Note that though the Limitation will be the same, it might be valued differently owing to the other character's differing circumstances. Similarly, if you do not have your Powers when a Milestone occurs the Refresh invested in them is refunded. Whenever the Limited Powers trapping causes you to lose access to your Powers it is possible that another character will steal them. If they do so, it is as though you had voluntarily transferred the Powers to them. You may choose the process by which your Powers are transferred or stolen, but both processes should be roughly equal in difficulty. This upgrade is usually used to represent items that grant Powers, and the process for acquiring Powers through it is generally just picking up the item in question.

Anyway, that's clearly Human Form if you're going by canon. Technically the +2 version isn't appropriate because it doesn't sound like you're limited to changing only rarely, but odds are your group won't care if you treat being inactive as an equivalent drawback.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: CrackedOzy on February 12, 2013, 09:29:59 PM

I'm really confused, how does "Human Form" apply? It doesn't have anything to do with healing.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Sanctaphrax on February 12, 2013, 09:31:18 PM

Sure it does. It has to do with whatever Powers you attach to it.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: CrackedOzy on February 12, 2013, 09:35:09 PM

But it's about taking away the power, not granting it. Plus you'd still need a Catch.


I guess what I was thinking is having a circumstance for The Catch, like "Only while not in stone sleep" rather than a substance.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Mr. Death on February 12, 2013, 09:35:54 PM

Quote from: CrackedOzy on February 12, 2013, 09:29:59 PM

I'm really confused, how does "Human Form" apply? It doesn't have anything to do with healing.

Human form means, basically, that there is a set of powers that the character only has access to some of the time. It's a +1 discount if it's voluntary, +2 if the circumstances necessary are outside of the character's control (such as in this case).

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Sanctaphrax on February 12, 2013, 09:41:39 PM

Human Form makes it so that you only have certain Powers while in a certain form.

You want to only have Recovery while in your stone form.

The connection should be pretty clear.

Quote from: Mr. Death on February 12, 2013, 09:35:54 PM

...+2 if the circumstances necessary are outside of the character's control (such as in this case).

Actually it's +2 if the form can only be assumed rarely. Says so right there in the book. If the circumstances outside of your control don't make it rare for you to assume your powered form, no +2 for you.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Deadmanwalking on February 12, 2013, 09:48:16 PM

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on February 12, 2013, 09:41:39 PM

Human Form makes it so that you only have certain Powers while in a certain form.

You want to only have Recovery while in your stone form.

The connection should be pretty clear.

Actually it's +2 if the form can only be assumed rarely. Says so right there in the book. If the circumstances outside of your control don't make it rare for you to assume your powered form, no +2 for you.

The name is 'Rare or Involuntary' though, implying that perhaps involuntary shifting is sufficient. Not RAW, of course, but it's a pretty common alternate reading.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Mr. Death on February 12, 2013, 10:12:55 PM

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on February 12, 2013, 09:41:39 PM

Actually it's +2 if the form can only be assumed rarely. Says so right there in the book. If the circumstances outside of your control don't make it rare for you to assume your powered form, no +2 for you.

As said, the description is "rare or involuntary" and includes that you get the +2 if you only have access to your powers at rare "times of the day".

It's for if there's times you really want to use your powers, but simply don't have access to them for some reason.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Sanctaphrax on February 12, 2013, 10:24:35 PM

All of Human Form is for having Powers denied when you want them. The +2 version very specifically says "if you are only rarely able to take your powered form".

This is not ambiguous. I can understand why you'd want to houserule it, but you should be aware that you are in fact doing that.

Title: Re: Catch Idea/Question
Post by: Mr. Death on February 12, 2013, 10:31:57 PM

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on February 12, 2013, 10:24:35 PM

All of Human Form is for having Powers denied when you want them. The +2 version very specifically says "if you are only rarely able to take your powered form".

And it illustrates what it means by "rare" by saying certain times of the day. Such as, say, at night.

And it's not for having powers "denied." It's for having some powers available in one form that aren't in another--Will and Georgia have Human Form, and their shapeshifting is entirely at will--there is nothing stopping them from turning into a wolf aside from, say, particularly tight clothing. Same with the Hexenwulf belts--an entirely at will change.