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The Dresden Files => DFRPG => Topic started by: potestas on January 14, 2013, 01:15:14 AM
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has anyone created these for the game and what do you think they would look like
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has anyone created these for the game and what do you think they would look like
A subspecies of Faerie.
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Sparkly.
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I believe there was a template in the thread for that, under Diamond Court. It was a little boring.
And I could see the sparklies being a subset of Sidhe. Perhaps an interbreeding between them and the White Court?
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They'd have Blood Drinker, Addictive Saliva, Feeding Dependency, Echoes of the Beast (for the senses), Inhuman or Supernatural in all the Physical stuff, a +0 Catch of completely destroying their body, and mental powers (probably mostly based off Incite Emotion) varying by the individual.
They're boring as hell really. No interesting weaknesses or ways to fight them, you just have to use extreme violence, and in terms of attitude and powers available they're mostly no different from any other vampires. There is absolutely nothing you can do with them you can't do better with some other variety of vampire.
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I imagined their ridiculous psychic abilities being extensions of Incite Effect, but hey. and they're not really interesting playable characters.
Play a leprechaun! Not like Lucky Charms, like Mad Sweeney!
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i did find some stuff on them in the forums, thank you. I am just thinking of including them i was going to call them the alabaster court, but diamond court works as well. The movie versions are toned down a bit from the books. Myers background is that of a LDS, and i wonder how much her religious views of immortals influenced her version of vampire. Ultimately a faithful LDS becomes an immortal being. Ruling as god over part of creation. In any case lots of people don't like them here found that out so ill let the topic go.
Thanks for the help and the pointers.
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Now, now... let's be nice. If Potestas needs assistance creating these Twilight vampires, we as a helpful board should offer aid.
Potestas, what exactly is throwing you in their creation? There was the Diamond Court (I remember them as they were tacked on to a thread I created about fan created vampire courts) but I don't think they were very distinct. I personally don't know a lot about Twilight, but if you'll allow me I will attempt to create a Dresdenized version of them when I get off work.
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I threw out a legitimate plan to create them. I guess I could write it out:
Echoes of the Beast [-1]
Addictive Saliva [-1]
Blood Drinker [-1]
Inhuman to Mythic Strength [-2 to -6]
Inhuman to Mythic Speed [-2 to -6]
Inhuman to Mythic Toughness [-2 to -6]
Inhuman to Mythic Recovery [-2 to -6]
The Catch is complete bodily destruction (and I mean complete) [+0]
Plus whatever mental powers the individual has, mostly using Incite Emotion as a base. So -11 to -30+ Refresh.
There, template made. Also, as I mentioned, kinda boring.
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They also have a fire Catch. If you burn them, they stay crispy. Harry would probably short work of several of them. Particularly the "normal" ones. There's also one with Evocation and at least one Refinment so that he has access to all elements but Spirit.
And where do they get Addictive Saliva from?
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They also have a fire Catch. If you burn them, they stay crispy. Harry would probably short work of several of them. Particularly the "normal" ones. There's also one with Evocation and at least one Refinment so that he has access to all elements but Spirit.
Okay, cool. That ups the Catch to +2.
And where do they get Addictive Saliva from?
Don't they have some sort of addictive venom in their bite (which isn't quite the same, but close enough for government work)? Or am I confusing them with something else somewhere? Twilight isn't my strong suit, though I know the very basics.
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Nope on the venom. Actually, it's painful and burns and sucks horribly.
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Nope on the venom. Actually, it's painful and burns and sucks horribly.
Ah, scrap that, then. Maybe add Claws and/or Venomous for this?
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Nah. The painful burning and sucking horribly occurs primarily during turning.
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There has to be something interesting and unique about them. I'd personally stat them as an interbreeding between White Court vamps and the Sidhe. Most of their powers are actually covered in YS (Cassandra's Tears, various Channelings, Incite Emotion), but a couple might require some homebrew (Incite Effect?). I'd probably give them Venomous claws to represent the venom just so they're not Feeding Dependency Brick, The Template.
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I'd probably give them Venomous claws to represent the venom just so they're not Feeding Dependency Brick, The Template.
There's a reason everyone hates them. ;)
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They are strong very strong, with no known weaknesses. They cant actually be burned unless they're broken up first. The writer of the series(who shall remain nameless) said it was the venom that was flammable. The venom replaces all body fluids. Harry would have to open them up first then burn them. Other then that they are true immortals. They simple cant die and for all intents and purposes cant be killed. They would be invulnerable to damage +4 at least, Their strength would vary the youngest ones are the strongest the older weaker, some have extra gifts of strength and could maintain most of their early strength. Their speed is hard to calculate they move faster then a human can see. They can cover cast distances in minutes or hours. Their senses are extremely sharp think microscope to telescope and so sharp that things moving at extreme high speeds appear slow to them. Smell hearing the same. They have the ability actually multitask. Their brains are able to think about many things at once. Say one could play piano perfectly, carry on a conversation not related to what he was playing, while playing a game of chess in their head all the while spending most of their thought effort on how to keep a mortal girl from being killed by the big bads. On top of that some are gifted with mental abilities some with physical abilities some can control the actual elements.
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In short- a race of gish-y Feeding Dependency Brick Mary Sues. I think an actual, canon-accurate writeup for a newborn vampire comes in at a refresh cost in the high twenties. For, say, Edward, who's Lawbreaking (and story breaking-ba dum tish oh god my life is empty) is maximum, probably about the mid-thirties.
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So...Supernatural Speed and Strength and Toughness, the Undying and Extra Appendages custom Powers, Blood Drinker, and 3 Refresh worth of Supernatural Senses. Minimum 18 Refresh.
More if you give them Venomous Claws or psionics.
That's pretty powerful.
Would Feeding Dependency be appropriate? That could bring the cost down a little.
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I had strength and speed at Mythic, with a possible Physical Immunity with the Catch of, "literally ripped to shreds and burned", which isn't a Catch at all. They're doing at least eighty mph on foot and can basically just slap a speeding car to a dead halt. One handed. Feeding Dependency is appropriate, but the detriment is basically absent. You kind of just get a little less sane and more "evil" if you don't feed, and even the evil thing is debatable. I'd give them Venomous Claws and from what I recall, enough of them (more than fifty percent) have the psionics, so i'd make it a Must of the template, or at least an Option. Like how "At Range" is an "Option" for WCVs.
also, extra appendages derp kerwoo wha? They're bilaterally symmetrical.
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Extra Appendages is mechanically appropriate for representing supernatural speed and multi-tasking ability. I suppose you might want to rename it, but it fits the description given here.
With high physical skills and maybe an occasional Invoke, a vamp could equal a car in speed and force with Supernatural Powers. At least by my reading.
Physical Immunity is not a good way to represent immortality, since it grants invincibility.
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I used Physical Immunity because in the canonical thing, i'm pretty sure the only thing that kills vampires is other vampires. I'd have the Catch as other things with at least Inhuman+ strength. And thank you for the clarification. There's also this weird age progression/strength ratio that's actually modeled weirdly well in the DFRPG- When they're newborn (Year one, i believe) they might have one building block at Mythic and all the rest at Supernatural, and they gradually lose strength, representing gaining more control over their bloodlust. (Mechanically, they'd be gaining Fate Points with which to resist compels against "bloodthirsty" or sommat)
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They can't be harmed be anything except each other? Wow, that is unfair.
And yeah, that Power progression is weird. Losing Powers isn't normally done in this game.
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My biggest problem with Twilight as a world building exercise* was always this: Why are the vampires secret? They're earth-shatteringly powerful and have no meaningful weaknesses. why aren't they ruling over humanity as God-kings. Yeah, yeah, we can nuke them...but why haven't they been so ruling for the last 1,000 years, making them the ones with the nukes?
I mean, with most vampires there's the 'helpless (or vastly weakened) during the day' thing, which is a damn good excuse for not wanting to go public...but that doesn't the Twilight ones. I've heard explanations of why they don't rule everything...but none of them seemed at all convincing to me.
*I have other issues with them, but they're hardly relevant here. They have to do with plot and individual characters, not world rules.
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Yeah, that was brought up before. Steph Meyer's reply was "Who wants to be the King of cows?"
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Yeah, that was brought up before. Steph Meyer's reply was "Who wants to be the King of cows?"
My response: 'Who hides from cows?' or possibly 'Us, based on how we treat them.'
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Yeah, that was brought up before. Steph Meyer's reply was "Who wants to be the King of cows?"
Well, then they certainly aren't above fornicating with farm animals then :P
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losing strength really isn't a detriment since most vampires are roughly the same strength, newborns don't last very long and their blood lust makes it impossible to fight intelligently, this would apply to normal twilight vamps as well as they get hungrier they get less able to control themselves, they need t feed roughly every 2 weeks to a month to be able to even be around humans without eating them. (cullens and Denali clans being the exceptions because of years of practice.). They grow weaker without blood but only weaker in respect to other vamps, never "the cows". Jasper implied maybe even said that a small new born army of 20 or so could easily wipe any human standing army so why they don't rule is beyond me. The really sound like a plot device not something I could ever really play and if you wanted to play a blood dependent vampire that was more human then the black court or the now defunct red court you could just alter the white court to be a blood dependent group instead of emotional one. it be fund to try for a game or so but after that what couldn't you do if you wanted to do it. Still they would have problems against the white council, who do have the power to open them up and burn them. Plus with all their abilities, a effect that left them dangling in the air would give you enough time to kill them or get away. Plus in general they move in groups of 1-3 most clans aren't as large as the cullens. So the white council could provide a defense against them as well as be the reason they haven't taken over. It would probably take a warden or two but if prepared my money would be on the wizards, if not prepared then the wizard would be dead to fast to act. So some spell that that provided an instant shield when engaged in combat it would have to last more then a few engagements so your talking thaumaturgy and if the Dresden world contained these vamps all wizards would have to be trained to be able to set these times of shields. could be fun.
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Like I said, there's a reason everyone hates twilight. :P
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Yeah, that was brought up before. Steph Meyer's reply was "Who wants to be the King of cows?"
My brain automatically translated that to "I have no reasonable in-universe answer to that. So I'll deflect it by answering it with a rethorical question." xD
Sounds like they would need to be adjusted a bit to fit canon. Being that powerful, if they were organized as a court in the dresdenverse, they would rule everything this side of the Nevernever. The Sidhe and posibly the Fomor would probably be the only ones able to keep them in check.
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How many of them are there? And how well do they reproduce?
If there aren't too many, the White Council could probably exterminate 'em.
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As an interbreeding between a Sidhe and the White Court, I'd give them the whole Inhuman package with Optional upgrades to Supernatural , glamours, Incite Emotion(Awe), and both True Love and Cold Iron as the Catch.
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Given how incredibly dull they are as written let's instead try to salvage something unique and interesting about them and see if we can make a template that is loosely inspired by them.
So... If I remember correctly the reason for the sparkles related to their flesh being crystalline rather than fleshy. That is fairly unique I think so let's run with it. Picturing a damaged sparklepyre is at least interesting since their flesh would crack rather than tear when stressed to breaking points. They are also strongest on the day they rise and grow physically weaker as they age which is also an interesting inversion of typical vampire lore.
Our vamps will be inspired by the hopping vampires of Asian mythology. Creatures that slowly lose their ability to move, eventually becoming malevolent statues which only the younger members of the court can still communicate with via a psychic hive mind.
The template: Jiang Shi a.k.a. the "porcelain dolls"
Begin with mythic strength, speed, recovery, and toughness. Within a year all except toughness reduces to supernatural and in ten years to inhuman. After fifty years they lose all these powers as their bodies slow down after a century they can no longer move on their own. Any human who saw one would think it was a detailed porcelain or marble statue. The catch is blunt weapons like hammers, maces, or anything else that could break stone like explosives.
While they grow weaker physically they are gaining psychic powers. When turned, they gain a Hive mind power, (something similar to pack instincts with long range telepathy built in,) this allows them to retain some individuality but also be fanatically loyal to their elders. This also keeps them from drawing attention to themselves. The elders know just how easily an angry mob could shatter them as they lay helplessly even though the younger vampires could get away with it.
After losing the mythic levels they gain incite emotion. After losing the supernatural levels they gain dominate. Upon losing the inhuman levels they get master dominator, psycometry, and any other powers that make sense. When they become entirely immobile they gain a power similar to possession which allows them to attempt to possess nearby people or creatures for short periods until the body 'burns out.' Their statue-like body is left behind helplessly while they are doing this, but it is the closest thing to independant mobility the jiang shi get as elders.
They also have a blood based feeding dependency until they freeze solid. If they go without feeding they will eventually go into the statue phase prematurely without developing the corresponding psychic powers.
Throw in venomous claws and that should cover everything. What do you guys think?
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I may use these guys as an Ivory or Jade court vampires in my game. I like them a lot.
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yeah the frozen statue thing kind of isn't them at all, the voltari are over 5k years old and still moving around quite a bit, and while they are not as as strong as new borns they don't ever get as weak as that. the new born strength is fueled by there own human blood.
i would keep everything at the supernatural strength and speed, rather then try to figure out a specific catch for physical immunity I would give them mythic toughness, no catches if the ability normally requires, but assume any attack or power that gets by it does whatever damage it can do against armor 3, i would give them inhuman recovery to help speed the healing process. If you even wanted to simulate the newborn strength I would keep everything at supernatural and just add some extra bonus to the benefits of supernatural strength a high bonus on grappling. Its such a tiny period of their existence that i wouldn't build the template around it. Newborns cannot use any fighting skill whatsoever, they simply do not have the control for it, so make all their weapons and fist skills mediocre for the duration of the new born phase. established vampires don't have issues killing them, they just don't want to be grabbed by them. In the southern wars they made armys of them(10-20 at time) and used over whelming numbers to kill established covens. Remember established covens don't number over 3 in the norm, 4-5 would be the most and only in wartime for self protection. Even when the invaders did this most of the new borns ended up dead.
They can be hurt if hit hard enough by say other vampires and a were creatures teeth can cut the skin and a wizard should be able to use spirit(force), well enough to bypass the mythic toughness. Once you exceed their stress and consequence simply declare that they have been broken into a few moving pieces that are trying to reassemble themselves. now you burn them with any type of fire doesn't have to be munch a lighter should do and boom dead vamp.
If you don't have the mojo to kill them quick enough any effect that will suspend them in mid air should give you enough time to escape. Without leverage no amount of strength is impressive.
as for their other powers something for the senses, the venom should have two effects, if you get bitten it uses pain to paralyze, those of enough will or enough fate points might be able to throw it off but that should be checked every few passes. The side effect though is in 2-3 days you become a vampire of the same make. There is no cure if the venom isn't dealt with before it spreads to far. Most do not have abilities beyond this. Those that do are rare. When they do have abilities the largest group are mental and emotional controls or defenses. Very few powers extend to the physical. Also once turned they do not change.
They are set for eternity.
This can mean a lot depending on how you want to play it. Can they improve skills or are they stuck where they are forever. If they do not already know something can they learn to do it. For balance I would have to say no, especially to learning any type of magic. Skills could be put on a huge learning curve. In the books the biggest thing to change a vampire was love, with that they could become or learn something needed to make it possible and once they love they never stop. (it was a romance story after all)
Vampires enter a feeding frenzy when they taste human blood so its difficult for them to make other vamps, they normally just eat the dude they bite. Carlyle was the only one who didn't have this issue and Edward and alice could avoid it for Bella only. Every other vampire simply hoped they could stop before they killed the person they wanted to change. This is why there aren't many vamps of this type, they simply cant not kill something they bite and their victims simply don't have any ability to escape them whether bitten once or not. a roll to avoid blood lust and a fairly high one at that. They also get this way with spilled blood even tiny amounts but the roll is a bit easier. This includes well fed vamps so it is a very debilitating drawback. It makes it difficult for them to be in the presence of humans if they haven't fed recently. And as long as they don't taste it even if they fail the blood lust roll they can hold it in check long enough to stalk the victim to somewhere safe to eat. This should be played up as its the main reason these vamps dont go near humans and generally only associate with other vamps
This is also the misconception of critics of the story that say Edward was a stalker and Bella a willing abusey (sic). Edward was constantly fighting they vampiric urge to kill her and the moral urge to love her. Myers has written a book called midnight sun which is a retelling of book one from Edwards perspective. This book is much better at explaining the nature of Myers vampires and their way of life. She keeps it on line and its only 183 pages. She does not intend to finish it???? But as a a resource and explanation of her vampires its very good. Her site also contains other short blurbs about them that proved very helpful.
A wizard would probably lose the ability to use magic for at least the first year, he wouldn't have the control needed to use it. Could u imagine a member of the white council who was also this kind of vampire.
I didn't mean for this to be so long
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@Adin: cool vamps. I imagine a room with crystal statues and any mortals that walk in there become thralls that sacrafice themselves to feed the vamps...
@potestas:
I've just been following...and have no knowledge of twilight, but from you say,
The Catch for their toughness/recovery would be: 1 mild consequences (or maybe a moderate) + any fire.
So you have to batter them until they take a consequence and from then on any fire attacks would beat their toughness.
From how you describe their feeding dependancy, they seem to have VERY low discipliine...or at least an aspect that would be compelled every time there is blood present.
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@Adin: cool vamps. I imagine a room with crystal statues and any mortals that walk in there become thralls that sacrafice themselves to feed the vamps...
@potestas:
I've just been following...and have no knowledge of twilight, but from you say,
The Catch for their toughness/recovery would be: 1 mild consequences (or maybe a moderate) + any fire.
So you have to batter them until they take a consequence and from then on any fire attacks would beat their toughness.
From how you describe their feeding dependancy, they seem to have VERY low discipliine...or at least an aspect that would be compelled every time there is blood present.
The feeding issue is a big thing in the books and in the movies and books, has been used against them for advantage. So it would be appropriate to do this. Their survival instinct is the only thing that rates higher. An aspect would be a good way to represent this.
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yeah the frozen statue thing kind of isn't them at all, the voltari are over 5k years old and still moving around quite a bit, and while they are not as as strong as new borns they don't ever get as weak as that. the new born strength is fueled by there own human blood.
That was the point. Other posters had commented that the twi vamp 'diamond court' offerings that had been put forward so far that were faithful to the books, were basically "feeding dependency brick: the vampire." I wanted to design a vamp that cribbed what I thought were the two interesting and original ideas from twilight and exaggerate them until they became genuinely cool (crystalline flesh and growing weaker with age.) So I created a court that in the young phase is superficially similar to twi vamps, enough so that you can see why they would commission twilight as a propaganda piece, which seemed to be what a lot of people in the thread so far were looking for. I then added the hive mind to explain why the young ones haven't conquered the world, since the elders have a damn good reason not to risk it.
I'm considering giving the same treatment to meyer werewolves if anyone is interested, though they are even more boring than her vampires.
I also had a thought. After my 'porcelain doll' jiang shi reach the statue phase of their life cycle, their outer skin layer could begin to wear away revealing a less detailed statue resembling jade, and giving them a good reason to be the jade court if you want to go that route.
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Just a note:
My understanding is that the sparkles were added for the movie. The author said they had diamond skin, referring to it being as hard as diamond and the director of the first movie misunderstood. Since he couldn't show the vampires with diamond skin (at least not without blowing the CGI budget) he showed it sparkling like a diamonds.
Richard
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Nah, I did read the books years ago (I've mostly recovered) and they are described as sparkling in sunlight. That was her justification for why they weren't seen out in the day.
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Darn.
There goes the one piece of "it's not all the author's fault" that I thought existed.
Richard
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Funnily, White Court Vampires appeared in the Dresden files about four years before the Sparklies appeared in Twilight. I thought it was the other way around.
And it's absolutely her fault.
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For the Lulz, for those who are so inclined, a 'let's read' blog of the twilight novels:
http://community.sparknotes.com/2009/07/16/blogging-twilight-index-page
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Always was kinda curious how that worked actually.
If you have diamond skin (like mythic toughness) could you really feel anything? Nevermind, if they are actually that tough/strong/whatever, wouldn't it almost be like making love to a marble statue. Talk about chilly, uncomfortable, and possibly extremely painful.
Definately Mary Sues. TBH, it seems like the entire urban fantasy genre is getting like this (it's mostly from the female writers). Jim's work is a nice change of pace as he pretty puts all his character's through the ringer. I wouldn't be surprised if some stuttering guy runs over one of the major people with a concrete roller sometime in the next few books.
PS: Love the write up for those Adin. Only issue is that starting with having mythic EVERYTHING might be a bit much. If they did, I would make it where they can be dominated by any that are older and have little to no free will and are not driven completely mad by bloodlust (or they would just kill anything they see). Also you might want to consider making it where creating one is a major undertaking and somehow links them to their creator, that would get rid of the possibly of creating a bunch to use as disposables which has also been done to death.
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Definately Mary Sues. TBH, it seems like the entire urban fantasy genre is getting like this (it's mostly from the female writers). Jim's work is a nice change of pace as he pretty puts all his character's through the ringer. I wouldn't be surprised if some stuttering guy runs over one of the major people with a concrete roller sometime in the next few books.
Uh...you and I have not been reading the same urban fantasy. And most of mine's been written by female writers, too. So, uh, I disagree? Would you like some recommendations?
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I recommend Charles de Lint.
That aside, if anybody wants to write up the sparklepires or the statuepires as a proper Template I'm willing to help. And of course I'll add anything that gets made to the list.
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Uh...you and I have not been reading the same urban fantasy. And most of mine's been written by female writers, too. So, uh, I disagree? Would you like some recommendations?
Bah just ignore me, as I am exaggerating a bit (hmm admiting that probably breaks an internet law). Just saying that ever since Hamilton's Anita Blake Vampire Slayer series came out the market has exploded, which is good, however it's mostly a hit or miss on if a book/series is worth reading. It's common to see a lack in setting design, consistency, and character development. It goes back to the question if you can easily tell if the writers are in love with, or wish they where their characters. I get the feeling this is more the case from some of the female writers I have read over male ones *shrugs*. (Note: This is all just mostly a feeling, I haven't started making lists or anything like that)
But sure send me a list, am always open to reading things others recommend.
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B Just saying that ever since Hamilton's Anita Blake Vampire Slayer series came out the market has exploded, which is good, however it's mostly a hit or miss on if a book/series is worth reading.
But sure send me a list, am always open to reading things others recommend.
Not to mention she is hit or miss and half her books involve more sex in various kinds of way then i really feel like reading. I love the hollows series almost as good as a dresden maybe as good, if your looking for a good series.
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I was told Kim Harrison isn't that bad, but haven't read any of her work.
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I highly recommend Patricia Briggs 'Mercy Thompson' series to anyone who likes the Dresden Files. Very similar...attitudes, both on the author's and characters' parts.
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I highly recommend Patricia Briggs 'Mercy Thompson' series to anyone who likes the Dresden Files. Very similar...attitudes, both on the author's and characters' parts.
Tbh, I tried MT because of reccomendations I got from other DF fans - and while it was good, I didn't really like it.
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Tbh, I tried MT because of reccomendations I got from other DF fans - and while it was good, I didn't really like it.
*shrugs* Not to everyone's tastes I'm sure, I just think there's a fair amount of overlap there.
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PS: Love the write up for those Adin. Only issue is that starting with having mythic EVERYTHING might be a bit much. If they did, I would make it where they can be dominated by any that are older and have little to no free will and are not driven completely mad by bloodlust (or they would just kill anything they see). Also you might want to consider making it where creating one is a major undertaking and somehow links them to their creator, that would get rid of the possibly of creating a bunch to use as disposables which has also been done to death.
Yeah I was thinking something like that for my 'porcelain doll' or ivory court statuepyres, I picture a circle of elder crystal statues with one caretaker young vampire that is essentially a tool of the collective. When the caretaker ages too far it regains much of it's suppressed free will and becomes a new elder with it's last act being the creation of a new caretaker. When there are more than 13 elders an extra caretaker is made and the hive splits. (This court not intended for PC use.) You can tell how long an elder has been immobile by how far it's outer surface has worn down.
If one of you wants to try templating them up be my guest, if not I'll dust off my book and give it a shot in a few days.
I was told Kim Harrison isn't that bad, but haven't read any of her work.
I read Dead Witch Walking recently on a recommendation and was pleasantly surprised. From the cover I wouldn't have thought it would appeal to me.
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I read Dead Witch Walking recently on a recommendation and was pleasantly surprised. From the cover I wouldn't have thought it would appeal to me.
this is the first book of the Hallows series, one of the best i've ever read, now thee is a magic system id like to play.
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That blogging of Twilight is an awesome black hole, I'm both glad and hate you for that link.
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That blogging of Twilight is an awesome black hole, I'm both glad and hate you for that link.
You're both welcome...and welcome.
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For Dresden like stories (with a British twist) try the Ben Aaronovitch Novels (Starting with Rivers of London)
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If one of you wants to try templating them up be my guest, if not I'll dust off my book and give it a shot in a few days.
So, you gonna do this?
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Templating which ones? The half-sidhe, the ivory statues, Feeding Brick:The Requiem, or the Diamond Court?
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The statues.
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That might be four completely different templates for each age group. And at least two of them might not be playable.
How much is their Catch rebate worth? It depends on how much blunt force is necessary.Can i use enough to break through drywall, or do I have to pack a sledgehammer or force evocations?
Hmm. They start with the full Mythic suite, which is insane. That's base -24 refresh before you even put on Venomous Claws or any psychic powers. A Submerged or even Snorkeling group fighting two of these would get ruined. The third level is more playable- the full Inhuman suite with Incite Emotion and Dominate. I think that comes out to about -11 not accounting for the Catch.
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I had a group of White Court Vamps convince my first antagonist that she'd become a twilight vampire when she drank Black Court infection Potion. Does that count?
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Given how incredibly dull they are as written let's instead try to salvage something unique and interesting about them and see if we can make a template that is loosely inspired by them.
So... If I remember correctly the reason for the sparkles related to their flesh being crystalline rather than fleshy. That is fairly unique I think so let's run with it. Picturing a damaged sparklepyre is at least interesting since their flesh would crack rather than tear when stressed to breaking points. They are also strongest on the day they rise and grow physically weaker as they age which is also an interesting inversion of typical vampire lore.
Our vamps will be inspired by the hopping vampires of Asian mythology. Creatures that slowly lose their ability to move, eventually becoming malevolent statues which only the younger members of the court can still communicate with via a psychic hive mind.
The template: Jiang Shi a.k.a. the "porcelain dolls"
Begin with mythic strength, speed, recovery, and toughness. Within a year all except toughness reduces to supernatural and in ten years to inhuman. After fifty years they lose all these powers as their bodies slow down after a century they can no longer move on their own. Any human who saw one would think it was a detailed porcelain or marble statue. The catch is blunt weapons like hammers, maces, or anything else that could break stone like explosives.
While they grow weaker physically they are gaining psychic powers. When turned, they gain a Hive mind power, (something similar to pack instincts with long range telepathy built in,) this allows them to retain some individuality but also be fanatically loyal to their elders. This also keeps them from drawing attention to themselves. The elders know just how easily an angry mob could shatter them as they lay helplessly even though the younger vampires could get away with it.
After losing the mythic levels they gain incite emotion. After losing the supernatural levels they gain dominate. Upon losing the inhuman levels they get master dominator, psycometry, and any other powers that make sense. When they become entirely immobile they gain a power similar to possession which allows them to attempt to possess nearby people or creatures for short periods until the body 'burns out.' Their statue-like body is left behind helplessly while they are doing this, but it is the closest thing to independant mobility the jiang shi get as elders.
They also have a blood based feeding dependency until they freeze solid. If they go without feeding they will eventually go into the statue phase prematurely without developing the corresponding psychic powers.
Throw in venomous claws and that should cover everything. What do you guys think?
I'm fabricating backstory here, using them as a Diamond/Ivory Court, but i'm not sure where they should be based, ethnically speaking. I don't like the idea of putting them in Asia-the Jade Court probably would have killed them all- and I was halfway thinking Australia because not a lot of people do stuff with Australia. A couple of age levels i can justify not being playable- The newborn "All Mythics" is basically a mindless thug. Almost a Renfield. the "All Supernaturals" level is barely playable at a high refresh level. The easiest one is the "All Inhumans" with the Incite Emotion and Dominate. The problem is that's basically just a White Court Vampire with a less interesting Catch and a new power.
Can I have some input on this?
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The statue vampires would make a good Jade Court, so no need to worry about them getting killed off. Assuming you haven't created a Jade Court already anyway.
If they're going to be Australian though there's probably a lot to borrow from Aboriginal myths.
This is one of the things I saw as kind of a problem in OW, a lot of the monsters become mostly just the building block powers.
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Ok, there is clearly an interest so here is an attempt at a write up of my 'statuepires.'
These can serve as a jade court if you haven't already established one in your game or an ivory court. It should be noted that these are not intended as playable templates. They are more on the evil people eater side as a villain for powerful groups. In the interest of a unique name for Sanctaphrax's template resource post I will call them the Porcelain Doll Jade Court.
The Jade Court have been a shadowy presence existing throughout most of Asia for more than two thousand years. Rather than a single unified group, they exist as small hives of three to nine Elder vampires, and a single caretaker. Though, a measure of communication does exist between hives for official actions, such as the signing of the Unseelie accords.
The elders of the court are essentially sentient statues that communicate with each other by a collective mind. The caretaker is a young vampire, still capable of physical movement, who acts as little more then a puppet for the collective with no individual will of it's own.
The Jade Court life cycle progresses through four distinct stages.
Stage 1.) A newly made vampire is created as the old caretaker begins to wear out. A suitable human is chosen and brought before the sanctuary of the elders. Over the course of days the elders scrub all personality and individuality from the victim's mind. Once so prepared, the caretaker carefully chips a fragment from the youngest elder in the hive, then quickly tears open the humans chest cavity and plunges it into the still beating heart. If done quickly enough, the flesh around the shard begins to crystallize. Over the next few weeks, the whole body becomes stony and crystalline. When the process is complete, the new caretaker rises. The hive's grasp on the old caretaker is released and the new destroys the old.
In this stage the vampire is practically a physical god. It has:
Mythic Strength -6, Speed -6, and Toughness -6 as well as Blood drinker -1 and Feeding Dependency (Human Blood) +1. the catch is things that could shatter stone like sledge hammers, explosives, etc. +4. The hive mind and lack of free will are largely represented through aspects and the psychic powers of the elders. They can heal from injury, but no faster than mortals.
Total template cost: -14
Stage 2.) After about a year the vampire progresses to the second stage of it's lifecycle. It begins to slow down considerably as it's flesh stiffens. It has Supernatural Speed -4 and Strength -4 as well as Mythic Toughness -6 catch +4. It retains Blood Drinker -1 and Feeding Dependency +1
Total Template Cost: -10
At this stage the vampire may also begin to develop signs of a new intelligence and awareness forming, though most do not. The new mind is still easily suppressed by the collective, but is taken as an early sign that the vampire will become a new elder rather than be disposed of.
Stage 3.) After 50 years or so at stage 2 the vampire moves to this stage. If the vampire has shown no signs of awareness then it is disposed of as it reaches this stage and a new caretaker is created. If it is to become a new elder, it's mind will awaken fully and begin to join the collective and awaken in psychic power. Such a vampire continues to act as caretaker and the search for a new caretaker is postponed until it nears the end of this stage.
Stage 3 vampires have Inhuman Speed -2, Strength -2, and Mythic Toughness -6 catch +4. Blood Drinker -1 / Feeding Dep. +1. Domination -2
Total Template Cost: -8
Stage 4.) After approximately 20 years at stage 3, the vampire begins to rapidly grow feeble and must quickly prepare a new caretaker or leave the hive defenseless. Once this is done, the vampire takes it's place in immobility and becomes a new elder. It's body solidifies and becomes an immobile statue, allowing it's psychic power to expand considerably. The younger elders resemble detailed statues of themselves, while over the course of centuries their outer flesh begins to wear down and they come to resemble vaguely man shaped pillars of marble (or jade if you prefer.)
It has Mythic Toughness -6 catch +4, Domination -2, Master Dominator -2, possession -3
Total Template Cost: -9
The elders no longer need to feed on blood but still crave it. One of the duties of the caretaker is to bring live humans to the lair every so often and butcher them to allow the elders to absorb blood through their now slightly porous outer flesh. The elders sometimes possess these sacrificial humans to allow them to experience mobility outside of their joint control over the caretaker. Elders may also take any additional psychic powers that are appropriate, and some can even work magic while possessing a body.
The Jade court are known to use their mental powers from a great distance to draw the weak minded to their lair, often creating cults to service them.
What do you guys think? Want me to add anything?
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It's interesting that the Refresh cost goes down the older they get, though I suppose that's just a bare bones representation.
Just curious, they get 50 years in stage 2, but only 20 in stage three. What was the reason behind that?
I think if possible the elder statues should get some kind of ethereal projection ability. Just limit it to not being able to manifest, and maybe tether it to a certain radius outside of their statue form, and of course their statue has to remain intact for them to survive. It will facilitate their Possession ability if you do that, which if I were those guys I would be doing nearly all the time. I don't think that it would reduce their insularity.
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It's interesting that the Refresh cost goes down the older they get, though I suppose that's just a bare bones representation.
Yeah that is just the musts, any elder worth his salt will have any other psychic powers/magic that make sense, including things like astral projection.
Just curious, they get 50 years in stage 2, but only 20 in stage three. What was the reason behind that?
I wanted it to feel more like a natural life cycle, and have a lore skilled character be able to predict that when encountering a jade court hive they will most likely encounter the caretaker in stage 2, since the caretaker is the physical presence of the hive.
It will facilitate their Possession ability if you do that, which if I were those guys I would be doing nearly all the time. I don't think that it would reduce their insularity.
They are essentially possessing the caretaker's body almost all the time, as a hive minded cluster they have little desire to possess individual bodies for 'themselves.' Their extremely alien, communal mindset is a big part of what is meant to set them apart from other villains.
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Gotcha, I forgot about the possibility of losing individuality in the hive mind.
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Mechanics check:
-What does the Feeding Dependency apply to?
-You can't have Domination (Possession) without some method of entering your target's body.
-Pack Instincts would probably be appropriate.
-You may want to check out the following custom Powers: Telepathy, Mindless, Pack Instincts, Possession, Enthralment, Spiritual Co-Pilot, Spirit Form (with the Projected Spirit Form upgrade).
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Mechanics check:
-What does the Feeding Dependency apply to?
-You can't have Domination (Possession) without some method of entering your target's body.
-Pack Instincts would probably be appropriate.
-You may want to check out the following custom Powers: Telepathy, Mindless, Pack Instincts, Possession, Enthralment, Spiritual Co-Pilot, Spirit Form (with the Projected Spirit Form upgrade).
Good calls,
-Feeding dep. applies to Strength and Speed powers. If they go too long without feeding they stiffen into statues prematurely without any of the elder benefits. (I think aspects are sufficient to cover that part of it.)
-I'm aware possession by raw requires being able to physically enter the host body but I always house ruled it to 'and if you lack such a power you must leave your own body behind and helpless.' If you are uncomfortable with that you could always write a new power at the same cost that does the same thing except also leaves the body behind but that strikes me as redundant.
-I was planning to go with pack instincts but decided after reading over the description that it didn't quite fit. It could certainly be added to the template though without hurting anything. I think aspects are sufficient to fill in for the hive mind and instinct thing without bogging them down with lots of custom powers.
-Any of those custom powers could easily fit, but I wanted the musts to be as RAW or close to RAW as possible. Then people can add in whatever custom powers they feel are appropriate or necessary.
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If you're going to houserule Possession, I suggest going further than that. The canon Power is super vague, so one way or another you're gonna need to make stuff up.
And adding custom Powers as options might not work so well, since some of them would likely replace the Powers these dudes already have.
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Adin, could you add a list on optional Powers to the various stages of life so that I can add them to the Template list?