ParanetOnline
McAnally's (The Community Pub) => Author Craft => Topic started by: meg_evonne on May 27, 2007, 09:51:33 PM
-
I either need to take a class on grammar (especially verb tenses) or find a nice, handy computer program that will check it for me. Do any of you have any suggestions, I hope? I've googled, but can't tell what really works in the real world.
Thanks! Meg in IA
-
Microsoft Word or MS Works Word Processor are pretty good about grammar check, though Word tends to get onery with flagging elliptical sentences. Not sure if there's one specifically for novels, though.
-
Word used to go nuts when you used passive sentence construction, although you can turn it off.
I use OpenOffice now, personally, although I don't use the grammar checker. I re-read things pretty extensively and I can pretty much guarantee that one of the people who betas will pick up any grammatical mistakes.
-
Take the class ;) Knowing how your language works is invaluable to a writer, and will save you time in editing down the road, especially since those grammar checks are often laughable.
-
I think you are right. Nothing beats having the knowledge and getting it right the first time. Back to school, sigh. Meg :D
-
Yep. The class, and a nice selection of reference books for tricky moments:
Strunk & White's The Elements Of Style
Style: Towards Clarity & Grace by Joseph M. Williams
These have both been extremely helpful to me.
The main problem with software checkers is the simple fact that they are programmed along business correspondance lines, do not deal well with variables, and are almost useless when presented with fictional devices like colloquial first person, multiple characters with differing regional speech patterns, etc.
It's best to take the class, buy a couple books, and have some dedicated first readers. :)
Best,
-G.
-
Thanks Jack!
-
Yep. The class, and a nice selection of reference books for tricky moments:
Strunk & White's The Elements Of Style
Style: Towards Clarity & Grace by Joseph M. Williams
These have both been extremely helpful to me.
The main problem with software checkers is the simple fact that they are programmed along business correspondance lines, do not deal well with variables, and are almost useless when presented with fictional devices like colloquial first person, multiple characters with differing regional speech patterns, etc.
It's best to take the class, buy a couple books, and have some dedicated first readers. :)
Best,
-G.
Seconded on Sturnk and White: it's got to be the best and most readable book on grammar out there. I keep a copy of it on my writing table for reference when I'm working.
-
Seconded on Sturnk and White: it's got to be the best and most readable book on grammar out there. I keep a copy of it on my writing table for reference when I'm working.
Strunk and White it is, with a class for spice. Thanks! Meg
-
I agree that taking a class would be a very good thing...
I use MS Word for most of my writing, and I have a specific rule I follow whenever it flags a spelling or grammar error. Put simply, I try to correct the error on my own.
If I can't figure it out, then I see what the checker offers as a solution. I find that Word sometimes has problems with things such as plurals and tenses. For example, if someone who loved the musical Cats said "Cats is my favorite musical" the odds are that Word would tell you that the "correct" statement should be "Cats are my favorite musical".
I also like to try correcting things myself because you don't always have a spellchecker handy! Finally (I posted about this once before), it's most annoying when people are certain that they're spelling something correctly when they're not (than/then is a favorite of mine) and actually click the "add to dictionary" button when they do a spellcheck! Somewhere down the road they insist that their spelling of a word is correct due to the fact that "The spellchecker told me it was".
The bottom line is a spelling/grammar checker is a wonderful tool but should not be relied upon one hundred per cent.
Keith
-
Word doesn't "remember" that I'm using a past tense from sentence to sentence. The sentence may be fine--it's in relationship to the rest of the paragraph or chapter that is the problem. For editors this is a real obnoxious error that reflects amature vs professional writing skills. Still when I am in a long piece it is in my nature to be a lousy editor. I hate the fine details and I don't always find the errors in review.
There are some great sites that I found that are free to test your grammar skills with excercises. One of them is: http://www.smic.be/smic5022/exercisesgrammar.htm
There is a Style Writer Program I found that is great for query letters and business letters, but isn't right for fiction. I'd like to feel confident however, that I'm not coming across as an idiot. Fiction programs appear to be more organizational in nature. I'm not sure I want a program to tell me my dramatic tension or my character isn't up to par; I'll decide that on my own thank you very much!
From the responses posted, programs just aren't out there. Drat!
Meg
-
I have a favorite spell-check horror story. I was working for an agency that created resumes and cover letters for welfare moms. I wanted to describe one client as conscientious but I didn't spell it right. Spell check changed it for me. So, the resume read that she was hard working and contentious.
She got the job despite my (and MS Word's) best efforts.
Barbara
-
lol Barbara, just goes to show you that no one really reads resumes! not even the person who hired her! Or maybe they wanted a contenious employee?
-
"Sturnk and White...."
Is it a sin to misspell that? :)
In addition to the books and the lessons, computer programs are still a good net.
I highly reccomend Office 2007. Fantastic program...plus, I think you can get an inexpensive student copy, which you would be if you were taking grammar classes ;)
-
I suspect that misspelling Strunk is MORE than a SIN. I'm sure I am definitely doomed now.
Hey, just learned how to check my passive vs active percentages. You probably all know that by now, but just in case....
Make sure that "check grammar" is checked off. In the bottom left corner of the spelling/grammar menu. Hit Options button at the bottome the spelling/grammar screen and under grammar, check off "check readability statisics". When you run spellcheck you'll get a readability stat area. One of those stats is Passivity. It also gives something called a Flesch score, meaning if it is easy to understand, aim for 60 to 70 apparently. There is a Flesch-Kincaid score that corresponds with grade level. Apparently you only aim for 7 to 8???? Doesn't that seem LOW to you guys? Maybe SciFi buffs just have higher grade ranges. What do you think?
-
Keep in mind that the "grade level" that these programs churn out is based on two things. First of all the size of the words you use (my guess is science fiction just generally uses larger words than other forms of writing...seems to make sense) and how long your sentences run.
Incidentally, newspapers (last time I checked, anway) aim to keep their writing at a grade 4 level or lower...that's considered the reading level of the average north american. My personal belief is it's a case of "use it or lose it". Let's face it, everyone here can probably read well beyond the grade 7/8 level, but then we no doubt all read a lot more than the average population!
Keith