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McAnally's (The Community Pub) => Author Craft => Topic started by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 12:33:43 PM

Title: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 12:33:43 PM
Okay this comes from the last page of the wrighting tools thread
and will make wore sensi if you read it first

i post something to do with the thread and some one coments on my spelling
it gose on to the point where dislexia is metioned
and i vagly coment about my sight
point of vew most of the time
i know not many people have disabilaties but as some one with a bad vi (visual impearment) i notice that lots of book have there main carictor as a normal ish '20"20' (you can drive, navigate crouds, coook ect with out truble)

but i persanly have more experence as a VIP (visualy impeared person) this means i find it hared to wright from a '20"20' point of vew most of the time and so in my book it is rare for me to do so (my main carictor is a VIP) this is for eas on my part mostly. but i was wondering if other people have problems like that
(they have a person whos vew point they don't know much about due to lack of exspirence but onte to put it in the book) i was also wondering why you don't have a disabled carictor in your books or has it just not crosed anyones mind before.
as i can do most things that '20"20's can do.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Shecky on February 05, 2012, 12:38:46 PM
That's actually a very good question. While there have been (in books and on the screen) a lot of characters with disabilities (often developing abilities that counter their disabilities), I can't recall many MAIN characters with disabilities. Professor X is a given example of the first (and probably the closest to being a main character of all the examples I have in mind), and Destiny of the X-Men universe also comes to mind: a blind woman whose mental vision more than makes up for her blindness, yet she's still a side character. So it would probably be an interesting read to see a main who is disabled and does NOT have a compensating power/ability.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 12:43:40 PM
that is kida what i have done
my main carictor is a 15 year old apprentis witch who
albinism
this is a condition that effects your sight as well as other
non of her abilaties help improve her sight but work to her strength with her sence of tuch improving it even more than it would otherwise

almost all the story is from her point of vew
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 12:53:34 PM
okay first thanks for reading this

second i forgot about xmen as only see some of the movies

thred I would like to know is it just that people don't know how to describe what they don't know or are they sceared of effending people if they get it wrong when it comes to disabled carictors and their points of vew?
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Aminar on February 05, 2012, 04:45:47 PM
I disabled many of my characters over the course of my story.

One lost an arm in her second appearance.
The sound mage overpowered a spell and deafened herself permanently.
The old guy lost an eye, and is really old(also a disability).
It's fun to write, but often feels gimmicky if it lasts too long.

In a short story I've temporarily abandoned; a character who lives in a society where everyone communicates by reading words written bioluminescently written across their skin hit his head really bad and killed his vision.  He worked a way around it, but the spell involves curving light(something very difficult within the system, and severely hampers his combat ability.  All of his combat magic has to extend off that spell because it takes up so much of his body space to cast.

Just make sure the disability feels natural to the character.

On another note: and don't take this wrong.  As a writer you should always practice proper writing techniques.  Most of your posts aren't proofread.  If that comes from your vision I understand, but you still should find a way to proofread your posts.  It's good practice, and if you write like your posts nobody has time to proofread all of that.  Maybe type them up in MSword with a larger font size.  Or get one of those awesome magnifying glass things(again assuming your disability is what hampers your ability to proofread your posts.)

Good luck and keep writing.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 05:00:15 PM
no i spell check most of my wrighting
yes the sight hinders the spelling and gramer
i try to stick to words i can spell when posting but not always posible
and the carictor in question was born with a genetic disabilaty witch is what albinism is
you can not help genetics i got realy bad deal with mine when it came to the eyes
but this carictor (theres a h some were in carictor isent there?) gets in lots of mistife and amusing situations (not going to albirate)
but her point of vew is intresting to read acording to my '20"20' frined
i may start trying to check my spelling when this language becomes feneticly spelt ofcourse
but i have a question do you ever wright in the point of vew of one of your disabled charictors and how it effects them

and i don't take ofence becuase of spelling coments i just lought at them!  :D
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Aminar on February 05, 2012, 05:52:52 PM
no i spell check most of my wrighting
yes the sight hinders the spelling and gramer
i try to stick to words i can spell when posting but not always posible
and the carictor in question was born with a genetic disabilaty witch is what albinism is
you can not help genetics i got realy bad deal with mine when it came to the eyes
but this carictor (theres a h some were in carictor isent there?) gets in lots of mistife and amusing situations (not going to albirate)
but her point of vew is intresting to read acording to my '20"20' frined
i may start trying to check my spelling when this language becomes feneticly spelt ofcourse
but i have a question do you ever wright in the point of vew of one of your disabled charictors and how it effects them

and i don't take ofence becuase of spelling coments i just lought at them!  :D

Oh yeah.  The arm gets brushed aside by the immense number of other changes, some accidental identity jumbling(in story), and the pragmatism living with dinosaurs would cause.

The big one was writing from the perspective of the newly deaf sound mage.  That was fun. 

I write in third person limited(although I occasionally throw in tiny bits of omniscient for dramatic purposes.  Either way, I'm definitely in their perspective.  It's fun, but like I said, It can really get old quickly.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 06:27:45 PM
I gust metion it when it is nesersery as i know how one deals with sight problems and wight in first person more than thired
pluse i don't always wright in her point of vew as there are things that must be exsplaind that only work if you can see (descriptions of peoples aperences mostly and other important vews on events)
not everything is about the disabilatie but there is a lot of sound description and speach when in her point of vew
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 07:54:21 PM
so sorry
i just remebered a charictor who was a main carictor that due to unushual BCV related inserdent ended up handy capt for a wile
it losly counts its not a full disabilaty and was not permenent but should me mentioned

if anyone has vews on above questions or threis why main carictor don't have disabilaties that there powers chounsle out?
all vews wanted
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Snowleopard on February 05, 2012, 08:33:14 PM
In Fritz Leiber's - "A Specter is Haunting Texas" - the main character is a human from a off world colony with really, really low gravity.  When he goes to earth he must wear a special Exo-skeleton in order to function and survive.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 08:35:43 PM
i gess that counts but that is fixerble by tecnolagy not a power but is still fixsable
but i'll alowit as a fear point
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Snowleopard on February 05, 2012, 08:40:02 PM
Yes, there's one point in the story where he's taken out of the Exo and is laying in a lounge by a pool, (If I remember rightly it's been awhile since I read the book.) dying and watching a butterfly.  (Something he finds amazing that it can fly in our gravity.)
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 05, 2012, 08:55:01 PM
that sounds like aninteresting book i'll have to look out for it
I think that counts more than the BCV induced loss of hand use
but the arthor works round it or finds a way round it
I like the butifly thing thats a cool perspective and that is what i wanted diffrent perspectives exsplaind to the reader due by disabilaties
your one is realy poetic
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Snowleopard on February 05, 2012, 09:12:49 PM
Fritz Leiber was a very good writer and a really nice guy.
He's more famously known for his Sword and Sorcery duo - Fahferd and the Grey Mouser.

Yeah, different perspectives on something does bring it home to the reader.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Aminar on February 05, 2012, 09:30:38 PM
A disability is something the character should be trying to work around/fix unless the story is entirely about that disability, but even then...

A different twist on this is The John Cleaver trilogy by Dan Wells.  The main character is physically fine, but psychologically severely handicapped(Truly Sociopathic).  The way he deals with it is excellently written and the books are quite fun.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: OZ on February 05, 2012, 11:02:55 PM
I loved the Dan Wells trilogy. I hope he writes something else soon. (Or has he already and I missed it?) Marvel comics Daredevil is another well known character with a handicap (blindness) although the way it's written, his super powered other senses and his "radar" sense more than make up for his loss.

Jeffrey Deaver's Lincoln Rhymes is a quadriplegic detective. At least one of the stories, The Bone Collector, was made into a movie although I haven't seen it. I remember reading a series of short stories about a blind detective when I was a teenager but I don't remember the author or any of the titles. I just remember that I enjoyed them.

I have thought before that I would like to write a story with a handicapped protagonist (or even a group of people, perhaps from some sort of care facility ) but I have been afraid that I would not do them justice since I personally have not experienced what they have.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Aminar on February 06, 2012, 06:49:41 AM
Odd fact.  Dan Wells next book is out in German, but won't hit the US for several more months.  It's about a schizophrenic.(I think)
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 06, 2012, 03:31:55 PM
Okay so you went only slitly off topic i had to read the last post twice to understand it
When i say my charictor has a disabilaty it is to give her depth and just to prove that we with sensery disabilaties and any one for that matter can do anything
interesting things like magicle abilaties ect don't just happen to normal '20"20's
but i am glad that i am not the only wrighter who gives other prespectives
 ;D
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Darkshore on February 06, 2012, 03:40:35 PM
Okay so you went only slitly off topic i had to read the last post twice to understand it
When i say my charictor has a disabilaty it is to give her depth and just to prove that we with sensery disabilaties and any one for that matter can do anything
interesting things like magicle abilaties ect don't just happen to normal '20"20's
but i am glad that i am not the only wrighter who gives other prespectives
 ;D

Writing characters with disabilities adds to the realism factor for me, but it all depends on your target audience. I understand that you have sight problems and this effects your spelling, but it would be very beneficial for you to take extra time with your posts (as I hope you do with your writing) to ensure that there isn't an abundance of misspellings. Is English perhaps not your first language? To me that would make sense as many of your words are spelled oddly. Wright compared to Write, for example. No offense intended, just trying to help.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 06, 2012, 03:56:18 PM
sorry
english is my first language but
i spell things therneticly most of the time
okay therneticly is a hard word
you say that you have gathered that I have sight problems
take a minet to think about this
if you were to blink constently for that hole minet
you have gust entered what my life is like constently
as that is avrage
my glasses bearly make a diffrens most of the time
and you wonder why i can not spell as well as you lot
and today it is worse than normal but what can you do
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Kali on February 06, 2012, 04:40:32 PM
I don't really mind that you don't spell as well as I do.  I don't sing as well as Christina Aguilera. It's just a thing. People are different.

What bothers me is the harsh reality check you're in for when you find out that neither agents, editors, nor readers will cut you any slack for your disabilities.  Their only concern is, "I can't read this."  It's not their job to work with your disability, it's your job as a writer to minimize the impact it has on your writing.

On board posts? Whatever. Y'know, it's no big thing.  I sometimes am not in the mood to try and translate your posts but so what? No big deal.  But if you want to be a writer, this IS something you're going to have to address and you haven't said word one about what you do to try and address it.  Do you use a spell checker in your writing?  Do your first readers fix your spelling for you? 

It does no good to get defensive with us when we're not being offensive. We're not attacking you for your spelling, just wondering what, as a writer, you're doing to address this difficulty.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 06, 2012, 05:00:14 PM
OH
i get it
i have the most wonderful friend who help with my grammer and spelling
she checks all of those things
i also use spell check
and when wrighting thestory or most long peaces of wrighting i use dragon speak easy witch helps a lot
i can't use it for my posts as i am down stears and my sister and mum come in and talk to me will i type

i apoligis if my preves posts where agressive
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Kali on February 06, 2012, 05:18:26 PM
They were a little, but I get it. I wouldn't be surprised if you've gotten odd looks for wanting to write, with your difficulties. But hell, Helen Keller managed and she was blind. Stephen Hawking's almost completely paralyzed and he manages to write books just fine.

I'm glad to hear you're learning how to beat your problems into submission.  ;) 
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Aminar on February 06, 2012, 05:22:40 PM
She won't do that forever though; editing gets tedious.  Were I you I would think about using a dictation program for your writing.  That will make it much much easier for someone to look over.  As Kali has said, we're really just trying to help you out.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 06, 2012, 05:26:51 PM
I get that and thanks i am going to find my head pones and start up dragon i ges i have been getting too lazy with the spelling
thanks  :)
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Paynesgrey on February 06, 2012, 05:48:22 PM
Back on topic, one popular character with disabilities is Miles Vorkosigan.  Pre-natal poisoning left him with long bones that had the consistancy of chalk.  (Kind of like Mr. Glass in the Bruce Willis flick "Unbreakable.")  He's hunchbacked, and breaks very, very easilly.  He's also clinically bi-polar as hell. 
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Shecky on February 07, 2012, 11:40:19 AM
Back on topic, one popular character with disabilities is Miles Vorkosigan.  Pre-natal poisoning left him with long bones that had the consistancy of chalk.  (Kind of like Mr. Glass in the Bruce Willis flick "Unbreakable.")  He's hunchbacked, and breaks very, very easilly.  He's also clinically bi-polar as hell.

Good point. Miles is LOADED with weaknesses. He more than compensates for them, though, which is a great story in and of itself.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: jeno on February 07, 2012, 05:04:09 PM
Miles has disabilities, yeah, but it becomes a plot point in later books that most of them are corrected. Even the bi-polarness settles down once he *spoilers*. There's another disability that pops up later, but that one gets controlled with, er, medication.

Not that this is a bad thing as far as the books go (in fact it make sense that the disabilities are corrected, given Vorkosigan's particular ambitions and the level of technology in his world), but I know that a lot of people side-eye books that focus mostly on 'curing' disabled people so that they can become normal. The Vorkosigan books, though not specifically about Miles' disabilities or the curing thereof, still fall under that pattern. Just something to keep in mind.


Random Vorkosigan quote:

"Schizoid or no, not even you could compartmentalize yourself to that extent."
"I am not schizoid," Miles bit off. "A little manic-depressive, maybe," he admitted in afterthought.
Galeni's lips twitched. "Know thyself."
"We try, sir."

Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Shecky on February 07, 2012, 06:01:29 PM
I've often wondered about that. If I understand correctly, differently-abled people are often lambasted for seeking to eliminate that difference. If this is the case, are we to privilege the differently-abled-and-proud-to-stay-that way viewpoint over the differently-abled-and-desirous-of-changing viewpoint? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the whole point of correctness, of equality, is to accept and see the good in all viewpoints.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: jeno on February 07, 2012, 10:26:13 PM
I don't think the issue is with privileging certain viewpoints (proud vs wanting to change) over others. That's just diversity of opinion. It's more of an issue when there's a long pattern of people (particularly people who don't have disabilities) writing about how curing disabilities makes disabled characters normal/happier/better etc.

It's not an argument that can be applied to individual works (like, say, Vorkosigan) because all things can, theoretically, be justified in the text. It's more about the broader context and implications of what you're writing, which can be something you ignore, but is still not something you can avoid, if you see what I'm saying.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Shecky on February 07, 2012, 11:00:25 PM
I don't think the issue is with privileging certain viewpoints (proud vs wanting to change) over others. That's just diversity of opinion. It's more of an issue when there's a long pattern of people (particularly people who don't have disabilities) writing about how curing disabilities makes disabled characters normal/happier/better etc.

It's not an argument that can be applied to individual works (like, say, Vorkosigan) because all things can, theoretically, be justified in the text. It's more about the broader context and implications of what you're writing, which can be something you ignore, but is still not something you can avoid, if you see what I'm saying.

I do, but I fear that the larger picture gets obscured when one character has to represent an entire subpopulation. Unless the story is designed to be in the about-society's-problems vein, I think it's asking far too much of an author to take up the opinions and wishes of everyone whose situation bears some resemblance to that of the character. Let's let the character be the character, not an entire group.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: meg_evonne on February 08, 2012, 01:00:20 AM
The most obvious disability story has been mentioned in several threads: The Ship that Sang by the late Anne McCaffery. It is the story of a woman who exchanges her failing disabled body for the heart of a space ship. One of my all time favorites. Although she compensates for the disability in a novel way, it is always with her.

FYI, at one point in time I had severe myofacia pain and could not type.   I used dragonspeak, which was barely acceptable at that time. I could no longer write, nor ride as the amount of communication between a rider and her horse is through the delicate touch of the reins. My left hand is still numb and filled with pens and needle sensations but I can feel with my right thankfully. (No it isn't fybromalgia, nor carpal tunnel. I'd prefer to not comment further.) How frustrating it was to have to hold material up to my cheek to feel what it felt like.

I'm glad you realize that you are welcome here and I wish you well on your writing!

I think you would be amazed at how many have disabilities on this forum and it doesn't slow any of us up. Well, my non-tech geek problem rears it's head regularly. Hey, it feels like a disability.

Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Shecky on February 08, 2012, 02:41:56 AM
^ What Meg said.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 14, 2012, 01:17:45 PM
I gess to me I don't notic mien at all untill the spelling thoing comes up realy its the only disadvantage, most of the time.

sometimes you have to down play a disabilaty in books aspeashaly if you don't know how they feel or how it effects them. I sopose if its apart of who the carictor is then its a good thing I somtimes forget that I am not the only one as day to day I don't meat people with other disabilaties but you two have just given me an idea for my second book (that is sortof being witton more for the fun of it than anything ells)  ;D

another book with a disabled person in it though not a main carictor (its kind of a losely mentioned) is
Lost Bullet by Malclm Rose some of the carictors are albeno
and ou can argue the hole disadvantage to the main carictor due to his age witch can be a hindrense sometimes.
 ;D
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Nickeris86 on February 16, 2012, 08:40:56 AM
I once had an idea for a short story in which all the main characters were physically disabled, (Blind, deaf, paraplegic, quadruple amputee), but they all had compensating powers or abilities.

However in my novel I am working on the main character is not disabled but disfigured from massive burn scars that he acquired as a child, which has given him a bit of a complex when it comes to fire and more specifically fire magic. He will eventually overcome this block but it will not be fast or easy.

I need to do some research into the physiological ramifications of burns to make it more believable.

The main reason that I personally have never written main characters with disabilities is not because I am afraid of offending someone but because I could not write a character who has lived their life without something that i have taken for granted all my life. I would not be able to portray it in a way that would satisfy my inner perfectionist.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Snowleopard on February 16, 2012, 08:56:54 AM
Heavy disfiguring burns are a physical and psychological bitch to say the least.
And I've read about how incredibly painful it is and how long it takes to recover from burns.
One of my favorite villain actors suffered severe facial burns - Richard Lynch.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 16, 2012, 09:02:25 AM
I once had an idea for a short story in which all the main characters were physically disabled, (Blind, deaf, paraplegic, quadruple amputee), but they all had compensating powers or abilities.

However in my novel I am working on the main character is not disabled but disfigured from massive burn scars that he acquired as a child, which has given him a bit of a complex when it comes to fire and more specifically fire magic. He will eventually overcome this block but it will not be fast or easy.

I need to do some research into the physiological ramifications of burns to make it more believable.

The main reason that I personally have never written main characters with disabilities is not because I am afraid of offending someone but because I could not write a character who has lived their life without something that i have taken for granted all my life. I would not be able to portray it in a way that would satisfy my inner perfectionist.

that sounds like a intresting idea  :)
i would not know about burns
but in the second book of my seris i am wrighting i have a pregnent carictor and one of her children will be death the other blind and only by working together will the twins well i wont say till i actualy get to that point in the book its still only a first draft  :)
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: Nickeris86 on February 17, 2012, 08:48:56 AM
I have a very vague idea about burns because my dad was a fire fighter for thirty odd years, enough to make me comfortable approaching the topic but not enough for me to truly understand it.

The twins thing sounds interesting I would like to know more. I know there is a phanominon where twins will have feelings from one another. The twin senses or something like that. No one knows how it works but its a documented event. Could be something to look into.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 17, 2012, 01:37:21 PM
yeh i am doing reaserch inbthat angle  :)
when i finish the first book like properly then might ask you to bata read it so you get a better idea of what i mean
and so the second book makes sence and then you will see how i have made the twin thing work
but in the first bok they have not been born yet
i rely cant wate to have them oldernuth to cours trubble  :)
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: meg_evonne on February 18, 2012, 12:45:00 AM
A book that I fell in love with was dispised by New Yorkers, but it moved me from the most gut wrenching and personal connections imaginable. It's now a movie that, again I admire greatly. The young boy is compelling, intriguing, and my heart aches for him. He has, I believe, mild Aspergers. If you wish to see a disability that is portrayed realistically and moves the reader into his shoes, try out, "Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close". I just saw the movie and felt that it did the original story due diligence.
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: The Deposed King on February 18, 2012, 01:24:12 AM
I say if you have a hankering for it.  then write what you know.  which is sight disabled.

After you do that, then you need to focus on explaining how things look to the character and how she/he compensates.  After that you need to make sure you aren't bogging your story down with non-relevent descriptions of how this disability effects her life and the story.

After you do a few of these.  I recommend writing either with a completely different disability or no disability, to give you some experience.  With a normal non-disabled character you'd need to focus on writing the descriptive scenes as seen by 20/20 vision.  With a paraplegic or deaf person, you'd be taking yourself outside of your known zone and I think this would give you insights on how to write a disabled character in a general way.  Being really close to something allows for an inside perspective that's hard to beat.  But it can sometimes focus to indepth to the point of irritation.  By working on a deaf or parplegic person it gives you an idea of how much is enough and how much is too much, for yourself as a reader and writer.

My two cents anyway.  I'm like at 20/450 myself, so its pretty easy to imagine how someone with permanentyly compromised vision would go around.  Take my glasses off and I have to get uncomfortably close to teh computer screen.  I'd only try to drive in a real emergency etc.  With my glasses I don't notice a thing.

Remember to always follow the dream and hey I have big spelling problems too.  I've worked on them though.  Maybe remember to start adding the H in after the C when you spell Character.  I don't mind the rest of it but for some reason that particular word is bugging me.  I know I know throwing stones and all that.  Anyway keep up the hard work.

and remember to always follow the dream,




the Deposed King
Title: Re: Disabled main carictors?
Post by: cenwolfgirl on February 18, 2012, 08:31:00 AM
i think you have a good point it would be intresting to try and exsplain what it is like not to be able to see
i started the book for fun and due to the hole wrighting what you know thing my main carictor has the same problems as me or at least one of them
i am doing the twin thing because i have freinds who have hearing problems and thought it would be fun to right
i am folowing my dream but waiting for people to get back to be about what needs to be changed before sending it to publishers is aginising
i need to lurn pationts  :)