So I was just at the Japanese Embassy here in Ottawa, which is basically in the "Embassy District" of town, and I was thinking about thresholds, and how I could see an embassy providing one. What are your thoughts on this?
I think the threshold might be strange with an embassy if one exists. The demarcation line is possibly the gate, rather than the door to the building. using some ghost story backing as support for this next part, but I think it might apply to citizens/non-citizens rather than occupants/non-occupants of a home like normal
ghost-Harry was not a normal shade & could enter the church without so much as a hint of trouble because he was running around as a soul rather than a shade, but regular thresholds everywhere else would still stop him cold.
if it's an embassy where they throw a lot of parties and have a lot of visitors, the threshold in the building might even be weaker due to the business diluting it letting mortals think of it as a place they are welcomed in
Virtually every place has boundaries. Hotel room define who is and who isn't a guest. Business define who can and can't enter the business. Schools define who can and who can't enter them. The list is near endless, but it's the "this is our home / our place of safety in the big bad world" places that form thresholds.
Except the things that we view as boundaries become actual boundaries. Consider a fence around a graveyard. A graveyard is not a home. Not all graveyards are holy ground(usually just the ones attached to churches). And yet (ghost story spoilers):
Harry admits that he could not possibly have made it to his own grave had the gate not been open.
He even talks in grave peril (I think? It's whichever one with the Kravos/Nightmare) about how the fence around a graveyard acts as a powerful barrier. We see it as something that separates one thing from another and so it does. Now imagine how much more a border between nations would be in comparison to a simple fence.
Now it isn't going to have all of the aspects of a threshold. It's not going to suppress supernaturals once they are inside. But it is going to be one wicked zone border for things effected like that.
On a side note I live next to one of the only cemeteries that I know to have no fence or wall all the way around. One of the sides is completely open.
On a side note I live next to one of the only cemeteries that I know to have no fence or wall all the way around. One of the sides is completely open.
Then move - NOW! Before they get you!
Back on topic, if you look under veils in Your Story will find a bit on boundaries - how a veil is contained by defined by boundaries.
Thresholds are generated by someone living in an area (apartment, house, cave, etc). Often they are weak (i.e. a bachelor like Harry who lives alone) but they exist where people sleep. there's a brief bit near the end of GS and the problem caused by some of the bad guys sleeping at the lair.
I've looked though the books and various WoJs and I have seen anything in the setting as written that says other types of thresholds exist - but if people want to modify the setting, that's great. I can see a narrow strip in the food court, the one between McDonald's and Burger King, becoming a boundary like that.
Of course, I could have missed something. Some WoJ or some reference in one of the books. If it's out there then maybe one the keepers of the WoJs will parachute in an enlighten us. It's happened before.
Richard
Rivers serve as thresholds. Night and Day . Seasons. Etc.
I think an embassy could very well have a threshold.
Marvel Comics spoilers ahead:
I mean, they hold enough magical significance in Marvel Comics that Captain Britain ( gets powers from Excalibur has no powers off the British isles) has powers anywhere britain claims is their soil. Their embassies count for him... really, it's canon..it happened once.
Sounds pretty magical to me.
Sorry, but the reason why I keep harping on all buildings (and rivers, circles, enclosing walls/fences, etc) having a Threshold isn't because going into a public building like a store would normally cause a wizard or supernatural create to lose power. They wouldn't, at least normally, because the location would have a Threshold: 0, it's there, but so weak as to have no discernible effect. There is actually canon for this from Ghost Story
When Harry follows Fitz into Nick Christian's office & sleeping area at the Ragged Angels Detective Agency, Harry comments that there is a Threshold there, but so weak as to require little effort for Harry to cross.
Now, if a Supernatural nasty were to enter and attack people in a grocery store while Michael, Charity and Father Forthill were all there shopping for a church picnic... Then the nasty would absolutely run into a Threshold: 6, which would immediately make things difficult for the nasty.
-Cheers
What you think about the fences around graveyards, Richard?
Yet another kind of threshold - one that only effects ghosts. Maybe spirits but I'm betting only ghosts.
When Harry met a Black Court Vampire beside his grave neither one of them was worried about an invitation. Harry's powers were at full (unlike when he entered an apartment uninvited in White Night) and the Vampire didn't need an invitation to enter. If that had been a "people live here" threshold then things would have been vastly different at that meeting.
No, now that I think about it, it doesn't affect spirits. In Grave Peril a spirit that looked like Harry took someone to a graveyard. Magic was tossed around. A Fae wandered in. No signs that anyone needed an invite.
More recently (GS Spoiler) Jim has hinted that Demonreach projected itself into the cemetery and was the extremely powerful thing that had problems communicating with Harry.
My take is that we are talking about different types of "thresholds". I might be wrong about this, but this is how I see them broken down:
"Home" thresholds that prevent nasties from entering, degrade spells that cross them, and strip away powers from wizards who enter; can be invited through one.
"Dawn/sundown" thresholds that destroy vulnerable spirits and degrade spells but has no effect on wizards; no invitation attached to this.
"Graveyard" thresholds that keep ghosts either in or out; no invitation (other than an opening in the wall) applies.
"Holy ground" thresholds that keep nasties out but have never seemed to effect Harry's magic (even when he was brought in unconscious); invitation is debatable.
"Run water" thresholds that keep nasties out, degrade spells that cross them, but a wizard wading through a stream doesn't leave his power behind; no invitation applies.
"Magic circle" threshold that keep nasties out (or in) and are broken if someone with freewill passes through them or throws something through them, or if the circle is damaged either by someone with freewill or the environment.
Then there's:
"Created boundaries" like runes carved into things that can be used to anchor a ward.
"Natural boundaries" that can be used to anchor and define a veil.
Here's hoping that I've clarified my views on this topic.
Richard