I'd be curious to know the boards' ruling as well- I had a wizard who decided her best friend (a man of God type) was just too squishy, and made him an armored jacket. In the end, after being rather unsatisfied with him having an item that depended on her stats, I had him take it as a weak IoP (with only Inhuman Toughness, and nothing else).
I wouldn't charge the man of god any refresh whatsoever, in my opinion it comes out of the wizard's refresh. Even though she is not carrying the enchanted item herself, it is still in use and therefore still costs her an enchanted item slot. I see no reason to bring Items of Power into the equation, those are something else entirely.
The easiest way to do this is Item of power, but not like you are thinking: Item of Power +2 that gives Ritual (Crafting) and something else (like inhuman toughness).
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,26219.msg1116446.html#msg1116446 (http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,26219.msg1116446.html#msg1116446)
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,26610.msg1133920.html#msg1133920 (http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,26610.msg1133920.html#msg1133920)
But the stunt I recommend does not actually give permanent access to anything. It just lets you borrow from NPCs on a case-by-case basis.
PS: I actually agree with you about that. What I disagree with you about is whether a mortal stunt can boost things that have to do with supernatural powers. Stuff like +2 Craftsmanship while The Sight is open.
I don't think a Pure Mortal would be able to use Enchanted Items, they wouldn't know how. I haven't read all of the Dresden books yet so if there is an example of a Pure Mortal using one than I shall stand corrected,
If you refuse a favor, you lose this stunt (and will be unlikely to find another sponsor willing to grant such favors in the future).
Maintaining them is another matter.
What's there to maintain? From the descriptions in the book, all of Harry enchanted items either require no maintenance (his duster), or maintain themselves (his force ring recharges itself as he moves his hand, and his shielding bracelet recharges by sucking magic out of the very environment).
If you didn't have to maintain items, you could just make as many as you wanted.
I do not think it should be possible to take the refresh burden away from the crafter with a stunt. Wouldn't allow it with Refinement, either. Would allow it with a custom power.
This is one thing that I think is best handled on a case-by-case basis with copious GM discretion.
There is no right or wrong answer here.
Of course there is, whatever answer agrees with mine...
...is what the right answer or the wrong one? ;D
I think that maintaining magic items involves recasting the spells on them.
So the idea of maintaining an item without magic makes little sense to me.
I hate to bring up an example from the novels, but I'm pretty sure Harry talks about how he has to recast the spells on his staff from time to time. And Bob says that all magic fades away over time unless linked to a bloodline, I think.It sucks, but I think you're right.
I hate to bring up an example from the novels, but I'm pretty sure Harry talks about how he has to recast the spells on his staff from time to time. And Bob says that all magic fades away over time unless linked to a bloodline, I think.
I wouldn't say most items recharge themselves but if you can work out a justification of how they do then I don't see any reason for the ones your character ends up with to need recharging.
The maintenance on the items doesn't come off to me as physical so much as topping up the spell on the item since it will wear down sunrise by sunrise, seems like that would require you to be able to cast the original spell.
That, in turn, would kind of necessitate that you understand the spell used in its creation either by having the crafter explain it or by using the Sight.
Then how would you explain spellcasters with magical items that use spells that they can't cast? For example, I could make a character with just the Ritual power (or just Thaumaturgy, for that matter), and then give him an Enchanted Item that shoots lightning bolts a few times per session. He can keep it, use it, recharge it and maintain it, and it's perfectly legal by the rules, even though he can't cast lightning spells or even any kind of Evocation at all.
The obvious example is from the novels... Harry's rings. They recharge by automatically storing up kinetic energy as he moves his hands normally throughout the day (though actively hitting a punching seems to accelerate the process). In that instance, the user doesn't need to do anything magical to replenish the spell, aside from knowing and understanding the mechanism by which it's replenished.
Ah, I see now.
See, I viewed it more like a battery... You just need to know how to pump magical energy back into the spell that's already there. And you'd only need to recast the spell, should the item get damaged (like when Harry's shield bracelet gets burnt out protecting him from that elevator fall) and need to be repaired.
Mostly I'd just say they don't need someone to explain it to them since they're the one creating the item in the first place.
But how do you create the item, if you don't know the spell you're putting into it? And especially, if insist the knowing the original spell is required to maintain it.
See the bit about me not allowing Rituals/Thaumaturgy-only crafters. I don't allow anyone to create an item with a spell they couldn't also cast. If they can't cast Channeling/Evocation, they can't make items with them. If they can't do water evo, they can't make water evo items. If they have nothing but Rituals and put everything into item crafting, they can't make much of anything.
That's my campaigns though. I don't go retroactively screwing with someone else's settings and characters if I end up GMing something in their world.
EDIT: typo
See, I take the idea that Harry could do a perfect veil if he had all the time in the world and was meditating, not under stress, etc. even as early as Storm Front to mean that with Thaumaturgy, you can do any of evocation's effects, they just take a while. Evocation is doing those effects quickly, channeling raw energy as opposed to performing a ritual to do so.
See, I take the idea that Harry could do a perfect veil if he had all the time in the world and was meditating, not under stress, etc. even as early as Storm Front to mean that with Thaumaturgy, you can do any of evocation's effects, they just take a while. Evocation is doing those effects quickly, channeling raw energy as opposed to performing a ritual to do so.Note that Harry has full Thaumaturgy, not just rituals. He also has Spirit Evocation and can (theoretically) cast Evocation veils. He's just not particularly good at it, due largely to compels against the "Not So Subtle" half of one of his aspects. When given time to build the spell up slowly, however, he can do it, because he has full Thaum.
Thaumaturgy can do pretty much anything with enough time, so enchanted items which are a type of Thaumaturgy (and can cast Thaumaturgical spells anyway which are usually stronger than evocation) can do pretty much anything (obviously limited by scale). Even with your rule that doesn't stop pure Thaumaturgy crafter weaponising Thaumaturgy spells to attack an enemy (attack of a summoned creatures, transformation, wall of conjured blades etc) or creating veils etc (which are Thaumaturgy spells as well).
Please, let's not have the Crafter debate here. It's taken over too many good threads already.
I disagree strongly with what you just said, Mighty Buzzard. Make a new thread if you want to find out why.