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The Dresden Files => DFRPG => Topic started by: jb.teller4 on November 19, 2010, 06:02:53 PM

Title: Are Venatori Umbrorum or Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of Accords?
Post by: jb.teller4 on November 19, 2010, 06:02:53 PM
Are the Venatori Umbrorum and/or the Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of the Unseelie Accords? My guess would be that they aren't, especially the Venatori Umbrorum since they're mostly mortals
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. But I can't remember reading either way.

It's going to come up in a couple weeks in my Las Vegas campaign (http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaigns/welcome-to-las-vegas (http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaigns/welcome-to-las-vegas)), so I'd appreciate if someone kows the answer. If no one knows or the answer is uncertain, I'll just say they aren't and go with it.

Thanks!
John B.
Title: Re: Are Venatori Umbrorum or Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of Accords?
Post by: MyNinjaH8sU on November 19, 2010, 06:20:02 PM
To clarify, Marcone was not the first mortal Signatory. He was the first mortal Freeholding Lord.

My personal vote would be that the Venatori are, but the Fellowship is not. The former has more of an agenda than just fighting, and I could very much see them as Signatories. However, I could play devil's advocate and say that they cannot be, as they are fighting the Red Court without repercussions from the accords for an unlawfully declared war.

Really, whichever fits your story better should be the answer.
Title: Re: Are Venatori Umbrorum or Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of Accords?
Post by: devonapple on November 19, 2010, 06:23:00 PM
It doesn't appear so, though one could make a case for a mortal organization like the VU or some other clued-in group.

The Fellowship has been reportedly acting as guerrilla opposition to the Red Court for centuries, and considering their entire reason for existence seems to be to thwart the Red Court, it would have been politically problematic for any other Signatories to have sponsored them.

That said, you have the option to modify things for your own game setting.
Title: Re: Are Venatori Umbrorum or Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of Accords?
Post by: Lanodantheon on November 19, 2010, 07:28:03 PM
This is something a lot of people have asked. Until JB comes out and says it at an interview/singing or a forum post, it's up in the air.

My personal opinion is no because of the nature of what they do: Hunting Monsters.
Title: Re: Are Venatori Umbrorum or Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of Accords?
Post by: Richard_Chilton on November 19, 2010, 09:25:27 PM
I'd say no to both because neither one has the heavy weight magical power to be a player.  The Fellowship is just a group of refugee half vampire types and the Venatori Umbrorum are hunters with tricks.  There aren't that many groups signed on to the accords so odds are you that only the movers and shakers are there.

And let's look at what they do - the Fellowship exists to attack the Red Court while the Venatori Umbrorum exist to hunt "monsters".  Both of them target at least one group that has signed the accords (the Red Court) while I get the impression that the Venatori Umbrorum target the Black Court and other monsters (trolls etc) that have membership in a signing power.  If they were part of the accords then they would be violating them everyday.

But if I'm wrong about the Fellowship then that two signatories vanished on the same night - making it even more significant.

Richard
Title: Re: Are Venatori Umbrorum or Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of Accords?
Post by: Lash Dresden on November 19, 2010, 09:34:06 PM
In Summer Knight when Harry was noting what went on at the council meeting, and what other entities were represented as allies of the White Council, was the Fellowship represented? 
Title: Re: Are Venatori Umbrorum or Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of Accords?
Post by: Todjaeger on November 20, 2010, 06:58:26 AM
Quote from: MyNinjaH8sU on November 19, 2010, 06:20:02 PM
To clarify, Marcone was not the first mortal Signatory. He was the first mortal Freeholding Lord.

Slight correction here.  Marcone is the first 'pure vanilla' mortal Freeholding Lord.  He is definately clued-in, but does not himself have any powers.

Quote from: MyNinjaH8sU on November 19, 2010, 06:20:02 PM
My personal vote would be that the Venatori are, but the Fellowship is not. The former has more of an agenda than just fighting, and I could very much see them as Signatories. However, I could play devil's advocate and say that they cannot be, as they are fighting the Red Court without repercussions from the accords for an unlawfully declared war.

Really, whichever fits your story better should be the answer.

As for the Venatori, it is possible that they are covered under the Accords by the White Council.  While the White Council is indeed a separate power bloc, they are allied, and some members of the Venatori do have some power, but not sufficient to join the White Council.  As such, they would fall into the purview of the White Council just like other mortals with lesser powers like members of the Paranet.

Equally possible is that the Venatori are signatories, and joined forces with the White Council during the war since they have been subject to attack, as has been mentioned towards the end of Proven Guilty.
Title: Re: Are Venatori Umbrorum or Fellowship of St. Giles signatories of Accords?
Post by: Lanodantheon on November 23, 2010, 08:26:10 PM
To clarify my reasoning for why I think the Venatori and the Fellowship are not signatories, if they sign onto the Unseelie Accords they have to uphold all of the Old World rules and play by them. If someone from any of the suprernatural powers asked for hospitality, they'd have to give it. If they attack someone, they'd have to do it as part of an open duel or declaration of war, which is all the time. That doesn't sound to me like something a group of "Masons with Flamethrowers/Machineguns" or a Fellowship of partially-turned-Monster Monster Hunters would want to do.... ever.....

Not being signatories would give them more freedom to move and they'd be great allies for the Wizards because they can do things the Wizards can't legally speaking.
They can play dirty a lot easier than the Wizards can.

Evidence for the Fellowship includes Martin sharpshooting a duel in progress. IF they were signatories, Ivy would have killed him d-e-d.