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McAnally's (The Community Pub) => Author Craft => Topic started by: meg_evonne on June 15, 2010, 05:52:58 PM
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With the advent of chat, we have the capability of meeting together to discuss live works of science fiction. It's generally agreed that knowing your genre and its history is essential to writing--both technically as well as creatively.
Who would be interested? If there are enough, we could post a poll to find a good date and time, as well as establish a rotation of book selection. I'm thinking once a month?
I posted this here, because I thought we could stick to an author reading mindset vs general discussion?
Thoughts?
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I've never been in a book club thingie (Normally a slow reader). So we all get assigned the same book, read it, then come back a month later and talk about it? Am I on the right track?
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Yeah, only I'm hoping that someone is very clever and already in another book club that manages to do that so it's funny, entertaining, and generally enjoyable... I'm pretty sure that alcohol seems to be a major factor for enjoyment, if you are of age. And chocolate of course. Can't have proper discussion without chocolate. :-)
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Can I substitute chocolate for some stinky cheese?
An idea for a starter book would maybe be book 1 of the True Blood series, since they just started season 3?
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I love the idea of a book club that's focused on analyzing stories from an writer's perspective. :D
What sort of books are we talking about? Urban Fantasy, Sci Fi, Fantasy, Horror, general SFF, mainstream? Mostly classics or what's hot right now?
For book selection... hm. I have more suggestions for books that are outside of UF than in that genre, to be honest, though there's a fair bit of crossover in some cases.
World War Z: An Oral History of the Zombie War - Max Brooks (horror, first person accounts of the zombie apocalypse)
The Lies of Locke Lamora - Scott Lynch (low fantasy, think Ocean's 11 in a fantasy setting that resembles late Renaissance Italy)
Snow Crash - Neal Stephenson (...er, post cyberpunk? hackers with swords in the future integrate computer viruses with Sumerian mythology)
His Majesty's Dragon- Naomi Novik (historical fantasy, dragons are used to fight in the Napoleonic wars - think Master and Commander)
In general UF, there's Greywalker, Kitty Norville, Mercedes Thompson, Southern Vampire, Weather Warden, Anita Blake (early books), Newford, Neverwhere, War of the Oaks ...and there's quite a bit of Urban Fantasy in the YA genre - The Demon's Lexicon, Darkest Powers, etc.
I've been meaning to start reading A Dirty Job by Christopher Moore (the guy who wrote Lamb, the Gospel According to Biff) and House of Leaves by Mark Danielewski (which is supposed to be an amazingly mind-twisty book).
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Okay, so that looks like it would cover our first couple years. ;D
Good list!
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It's a very interesting idea and I'd certianly be interested but my time constraints due to work would make my attendance unreliable at best.
I hope you get more support and that this idea gets off the ground though.
Might I also suggest you look into the works of Philip K. Dick or even Cory Doctorow (his work is found for free on his website because of his belief in Creative Commons) who are both favourite authors of mine.
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In my daughter-in-law's book club they commit to a year with 10 meetings. I think we would need to only test it out to see how it goes and skip the initial commitment bit for now. Each participant chooses a book and is moderator for that hour to hour/1/2 session.
As to type of sci fi, I would think that if we grew in number we might be able to off-shoot more book clubs that stick to the sub-genres.
I'm old school and was thinking it would be fun to go back and explore "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress" or similar from Heinlein, but I am completely open to whatever people would like to explore. I think we need to make sure it is something that is available at most public libraries to keep the costs down.
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So erm....
>.>
<.<
o.O
When we starting?
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Interesting idea. If it's to be from a writers' perspective, it might be worthwhile to pick at least one totally terrible work and analyze how it could be improved upon.
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Interesting idea. If it's to be from a writers' perspective, it might be worthwhile to pick at least one totally terrible work and analyze how it could be improved upon.
Ah, have to be careful with that - I don't see anything wrong with looking at books critically, but it can't cross the line into bashing. And picking a work solely to tear it apart seems like a no-go area, to me at least.
(unless this group cuts ties and moves off of the JB forum and into AIM, or something)
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Ah, have to be careful with that - I don't see anything wrong with looking at books critically, but it can't cross the line into bashing. And picking a work solely to tear it apart seems like a no-go area, to me at least.
(unless this group cuts ties and moves off of the JB forum and into AIM, or something)
I think it could work. Like taking a book that's not very well written, but has sold well, an discussing what does and doesn't work in it, and what kind of things could make it done better. And I think most of us are mature enough not to go into the territory of author bashing. The two that come to mind for me are the Eragon and Twilight books, both that could have a lot of discussion about story and technique, and what to do and not do, and how to set yourself apart with originality and how it can fall flat because of the writing. If that sentence made much sense to anyone else.
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I don't think bashing would be a good idea. Pointing out story flaws, grammar flaws, etc. could be a good thing as long as you don't go too far. The Harry Potter series, on the whole, was a decent series, but I had issues with the bad grammar of a couple of the middle books and the 300 pages that could have gone missing from book seven. As long as we maintain respect for the author it could help people recognize flaws in their own work.
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Interesting idea. If it's to be from a writers' perspective, it might be worthwhile to pick at least one totally terrible work and analyze how it could be improved upon.
Connie Willis would agree! She said that you should seek out the worst movie and figure out where they went wrong!I think it could work. Like taking a book that's not very well written, but has sold well, an discussing what does and doesn't work in it, and what kind of things could make it done better. And I think most of us are mature enough not to go into the territory of author bashing. The two that come to mind for me are the Eragon and Twilight books, both that could have a lot of discussion about story and technique, and what to do and not do, and how to set yourself apart with originality and how it can fall flat because of the writing. If that sentence made much sense to anyone else.
Yes, but I also think it needs to be good enough to keep me awake and thinking! Also we are all busy writing, maybe something that is shorter would be good, still a novel but not an epic or something so our reading time would be limited.
I don't think bashing would be a good idea. Pointing out story flaws, grammar flaws, etc. could be a good thing as long as you don't go too far. The Harry Potter series, on the whole, was a decent series, but I had issues with the bad grammar of a couple of the middle books and the 300 pages that could have gone missing from book seven. As long as we maintain respect for the author it could help people recognize flaws in their own work.
Agree.
How about a compromise... I personally haven't read any of Charleine Harris. Certainly well read, appreciated, sells like hotcakes. What if we started with her first book? Thoughts? Also, I don't think Ms Harris is a poster, right? Still our comments would need to be up to writer beta standards with comments meant to crit, not ridicule. I think we are all on that same page?
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Is Ms. Harris the one who wrote the Sookie Sackhouse books that make up that True Blood series?
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Yep, the same.
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Yes, aak3 recommended it in this post.* So you haven't read them either? I've made a comment that in the television series (I've only seen series 1) Sookie seems too perfect and without flaws, then there could be discussion that so far in the tv series she doesn't actually kick butt. So there are some beginning discussion points such as, Is she too perfect? But if so and they are still well received--then why? Is she too passive? But if so, why are they received so well by women?
Plus it might be fun to get into the whole 'set in the south' theme and how she protrays that in her descriptions.
Pretty sure the libraries would have them right?
What thoughts do other people have?
Edited: as aak3 just confirmed!
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I could certainly get talked into re-reading the first Sookie book, as it's been several years--I think I discovered Harris just before Jim, which was around mid-2006! I could also go for a REALLY bad book--maybe some pulp fiction "masterpiece" from the 1950's, or something along the lines of The Eye of Argon.
(Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure I disqualify for this reading group, as my writing genre of choice is murder mystery with no fantasy or SF elements, although there's a lot of crossover between genres, so maybe an exception could be made...?)
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How about a compromise... I personally haven't read any of Charleine Harris. Certainly well read, appreciated, sells like hotcakes. What if we started with her first book? Thoughts? Also, I don't think Ms Harris is a poster, right? Still our comments would need to be up to writer beta standards with comments meant to crit, not ridicule. I think we are all on that same page?
Charlaine Harris has written a lot more than Sookie Stackhouse. She has 2 traditional standalone mysteries; a cozy mystery series (librarian Aurora Teagarden) of about 10 books in length; a short, harder-edged series (Lily Bard); and most recently another series with a protagonist who was struck by lightning as a teenager who sees the moment of death when she stands on a grave (Harper Connelly), which was written alternating with Sookie books.
She also has a website similar to Jim's, although not as extensive. A lot of her writing is internal, as Sookie has a lot going on inside that doesn't show. That's part of the passivity, perhaps. She's not perfect, but she tries.
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So you haven't read them either?
No, I haven't. Mind you, till this True Blood show made its way north of the border, I hadn't heard of Sookie before either.
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(Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure I disqualify for this reading group, as my writing genre of choice is murder mystery with no fantasy or SF elements, although there's a lot of crossover between genres, so maybe an exception could be made...?)
Lol, you don't disqualify. I'm working on political fiction, but I like reading science fiction. I may write science fiction later, but the one I'm working on is political. Most of the methods for writing are similar. It's all about the people.
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My biggest question with Sookie (since I haven't read the books) is why does she try and go toe to toe with some of the head badass people when she's a total wimp? And when she recognizes how vastly inferior she is, she gets ballsier. Napoleon syndrome?
Oh, and she has no consequences for her actions usually.
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My biggest question with Sookie (since I haven't read the books) is why does she try and go toe to toe with some of the head badass people when she's a total wimp? And when she recognizes how vastly inferior she is, she gets ballsier. Napoleon syndrome?
Oh, and she has no consequences for her actions usually.
FWIW
I just ordered the second season True Blood, so I may not know the answer to your question. In the books she knows how overmatched she is and tries to avoid being killed, altho she stands up for her friends. Also, after the first season the stories REALLY diverged (the Maenad in the books is just a passing character - well, a chance for Sam to get laid - where I think on TV she's a lot more).
And in the books she has definite painful and lasting consequences.
So the books may be VERY interesting to you, although they focus on Sookie, which diminishes the amount of time the others are on stage.
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I sort of figured pieces were left in the show that made her behavior somewhat irrational without the book's context.
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I sort of figured pieces were left in the show that made her behavior somewhat irrational without the book's context.
I'm pretty sure the show is meant to stand on its own, since the stories have diverged so widely.
Also, the South figures very prominently in the books. Ms. Harris is a proud southerner, and many of the aspects were surpising to me, being from the north. Sookie changes/grows psychologically through the book series, which is far more advanced than the show, which has only had 2-3 seasons.
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I really like the conversation going on here with Ms Harris' book. So I'll make a call. I started a new thread with a poll. BTW I added to my 'to be read' list with this thread and will be reading many of the books that were recommended. Thank you.
I'm going to find some of the reviews or something to post with the poll. Please read before voting so we'll end up with a book that the most of us can learn from as we read. Let's see. I'll post another poll if it won't let you vote two places...for what night is best for book club night in July.
I could get excited with this! Hope you are too!
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Also, since the book series has so much more territory covered, I think Alan Ball may have incorporated facets from the later books into the tv series. I don't want anyone going to books from the tv show to be surprised/annoyed at reveals in the books that they already know from the tv. Or have the books handle situations differently in the books than on TV.
;D
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There are also reveals in the tv show that aren't in the books, and some that are completely different than in the books.
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Didn't get the poll started. Will try again tonight. My computer froze up. First site I found had an exhaustive penguin marketing interview w Ms Harris and her edirtor with really neat stuff. I this k we made a good call. Will post poll etc and links tonight if I manage it. Sorry guys. Life intervines...